part 1
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069404]As the above,
With how you address thing and like everything as you format, you sound like your intention is looking for trouble and using everything you could to proof others wrong then wanting a real honest friendly communication to find out what is it. [/QUOTE]
how I “sound” is your perception based on your past experience, rather than assessing the question itself, such as it is, which was worded very neutrally (“how does one substantiate this claim” - pretty neutral and straightforward"); if you derived an intention of “looking for trouble”, that is you relying on your past experience to flavor your current perception, as opposed to viewing the question such as it is; if you were unsure of the intent behind it, you could have simply asked for clarification, instead of playing the whole “answer a question with another (unrelated) question”;
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069404]I have no problem with sharing and how things work; [/QUOTE]
but you do have trouble when someone else shares how “things work” from a perspective that does not rely on the descriptors that you use - you label it as speculation, etc., which is dismissive and does not encourage “real honest friendly communication”
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069404]and how it is in fact lots of Chinese and old age Chinese has benifit from it in the past and present, but the reason is not according to yours format or yours proof or proof this and that to you under this rule that rule…etc. [/QUOTE]
so then what is it based on? subjective perspective? unverifiable hearsay? look, as I said before, if you make a claim that “anyone” will benefit from a given practice, that is a generalized statement; if you make a generalized statement, then it really requires some sort of substantiation; OTOH, if you say that “in my personal experience” I have seen “x” number of people improve their health due to this practice, then that in and of itself is a valid statement
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069404]it cannot be that way because whatever it is is beyond the typical present modern western way of thinking and believe; [/QUOTE]
I am sorry, but I find this statement, in my personal experience, to be fundamentally incorrect; I will explain why this is the case:
first, this statement only speak to your PERSONAL experience, or, rather, it speaks to your lack thereof; as you always say, unless you have experienced it, it’s all speculation; your dismissal of “present modern western way of thinking” is not based on your experience with so-called “western way”, it is due to your LACK of experience with the specific aspects of so-called “western way” that leads you to believe that the so-called “western way” is not able to to describe what you are talking about in terms of what happens to the organism as a result of said internal practice;
see, in order to know if the so-called “western way” is able to adequately describe / explain the workings of internal practice, one would necessarily have to have significant experience in BOTH; in this case, I am able to make a comparison because I do have substantial experience in both; in your case, while you may have substantial experience in internal practice, you (at least seemingly) do NOT have experience of the so-called “western” disciplines that I utilize to talk about it; so for YOU, so-called “western way” cannot explain it, because you are not familiar with the methodologies tht are able to do so;
this is not an attack on you Hendrick, it is not “hating”, it’s just a statement of fact: I have spent a considerable amount of time and research actively looking for ways to describe internal practice from a non-“traditional” (or however one wud like to say it) perspective; based on my research, as well as my personal, direct experience with Taoist practice and so-called “western” methods of integrated health / healing, both with myself and over a thousands patient over 15 yrs. of pratice, I am able to look at it from two different perspectives with a degree of authority that someone who has not had both types of experience can; it doesn’t mean I’m great, or special, it just means that when someone tries to dismiss the ability of so-called “western way”, it’s because they are unfamiliar with the methodologies of “western way” that permits one to make that connection;
and finally, in case you think that I am just speculating, I have directly verified most of what I have “discovered” with my sifu, who is a classical Taoist teacher but who also is “cross cultural” in his approach, so it’s not just me making things up randomly without testing and verifying them;
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069404]I am at your spot before I know, [/QUOTE]
you do not know “my spot”, you can’t possibly know it, because you have not investigated things the way I have - you may have taught internal practice, you may even have used it to help people, but I have worked with over 1,000 different people over 15 yrs who have come to me for treatment, have used a variety of approaches, and have actively researched the connections between so-called “traditional” internal practice and other “western” methodologies to find the commonalities and to develop a functional framework to utilize them; and this is not speculation - this is working with people with pain and dysfunction who need to have tangible results; so if I use a “western” approach to Taoist practice and have had success implementing it from that perspective, that is no longer speculation, it is fact; and as such, I can speak from a position of relative authority as to how “western” knowledge can be applied to “internal” practice;
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069406]and I am not interested to convince you because that waste lots of energy ; and arguement doing anyone no good.[/QUOTE]
well, I don’t know - to me that’s a pretty passive-aggressive standpoint; it also suggests that you are not really interested in dialogue, you would rather just have a monologue with people who are willing to see things your way; a dialogue OTOH doesn’t necessarily mean that you have to argue or convince anyone of anything, it means that you are willing to engage in a dynamic evolutionary process of exchanging ideas, and possibly being exposed to something you hadn’t thought of before; of course, if you are not interested, that is fine, but then why are you here? you seem to want to exchange only with people who are willing to acknowledge your authority or who agree with your perspective; and again, that’s certainly your prerogative as it is anyone else’s; but the problem is that when you encounter a perspective you disagree with, you demonstrate an attitude that is hardly becoming of one who supposedly has deep experience in internal practice: you belittle others, you dismiss them, you act very disrespectfully; and I am not the only person noticing this; and maybe you don’t think you are doing any of this, but that is a fairly general perception here; and maybe you don’t care, which is fine as well, but then it is some what strange when you act as if you are disliked / attacked for what you see has no reason;
