[QUOTE=taai gihk yahn;1069361]I can answer “the question” for myself; I am curious as to your perspective on it, since you are making the claim;[/QUOTE]
I dont making the claim, i am just describe the experience for many people in the past and present.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069346]you seem not be able to comprehend what I post and react with all kind of thought according to your own thinking, as it is always off topic.
I talk technology and its process and examine the process and technology, no pre assumption.[/QUOTE]
No, you talk fantasy. I am talking technology. Technology that can and has demonstratated YOUR technology to be fantasy.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069348]How intelligent is a person who keeps commenting anything that person have never seen and know?[/QUOTE]
Look in the mirror and let me know!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069354]any one practice the technology get a better health and better application body/mind/momentum handling ability. That is forsue, any one will get that result be it in the past, present, or future.[/QUOTE]
Anyone practice walking, weight training, dancing, boxing, fencing, etc. Get better health and better applicayion body/mind/momentum handling ability too, so what?
That too is for sure past, present, future!!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069358]Why do you called yourself Taai gihk yahn?[/QUOTE]
I expect anyone asked a question to answer the question asked of them first and not to change the subject in order to cover their own ignorance!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069360]or I expect the person who pick a nick name as Taai gihk Yahn to be able to answer the question for himself?[/QUOTE]
Quit changing the subject!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069362]I dont making the claim, i am just describe the experience for many people in the past and present.[/QUOTE]
Yes you have made claims. You also haven’t answered any questions asked of yoy, just like you never do!
You are a charlatan and a fraud!
[QUOTE=Scott R. Brown;1069364]No, you talk fantasy. I am talking technology.
Sure, check all of your posts in this thread, beside words there is no technology?
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069357]
Because you dont know what it is.
[/QUOTE]
So, you can’t name anyone. Why is it that if I ask the same question of any sport fighting art, boxing, wrestling, judo, MT, etc. – provide me the name of some fighter that this training has produced – they can do it easily? And in large numbers. Yet, you can’t name ONE “advanced internal martial artist” that can fight.
The results don’t lie. The evidence is in.
That is your irrational generalization assumption and accusation.
So, refute it – provide the names of ANY “advanced internal martial artists” that have proven fighting skills. If that training produces good results, then where are they? Hmmm?
You always like to think you are the spoke man of WCK isnt it?
No, I am the anti-bullsh1t spokesman! LOL! Although I think Scott is giving me a run for the money. 
Karma means cause/effect and attraction.
Those who keep thinking fighting will get into fight neccesary or not. you like to have a fighting life that is your decision.
If you don’t want to get in the pool, why “practice” a swimming art? To just play-pretend that you “understand” swimming? Do you feel better about yourself because you believe that you are doing “advanced internal traditional chinese swimming”? LOL! By never getting wet?
And then trying to use karma – if I get in the pool and swim, I will attract swimming to me!!! ROFLOL! No, all you will see is that all your fantasies will sink. 
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069367]
Sure, check all of your posts in this thread, beside words there is no technology?
Yeah, um…go ask someone…it feels like popcorn…put hand on wall, don’t move in anyway, send wall flying, post chinese youtube video of some old guy flapping his arms like a bird…
THAT is your technology!
[QUOTE=Scott R. Brown;1069324]Right! You can make someone fall down without moving in anyway. In your dreams! Good luck with that!
Where did I say there was no movement.?
You attack those things you have no knowledge of. Wrapped in your blanket of self righteousness . Claiming ignorance as a virtue and that if you don’t know it it must not be true. The world is large you should experience more and talk less.
As for my fighting knowledge. I fought as professional kick boxer from 1971 to 1973. In Taiwan and S.E. Asia record 5-2 . Not a great fighter but I did it and trained for it. I also spent some time training in wrestling. Perhaps not the same as todays MMA training but real fight training and quality level fighting competition for the time.
As for further discussion when you show me where I said no movement at all then I will speak with you. Until then there is no point in further discussion.
So, you can’t name anyone. Why is it that if I ask the same question of any sport fighting art, boxing, wrestling, judo, MT, etc. – provide me the name of some fighter that this training has produced – they can do it easily? And in large numbers. Yet, you can’t name ONE “advanced internal martial artist” that can fight.
you could do your own research and tell us.
No, I am the anti-bullsh1t spokesman! LOL! Although I think Scott is giving me a run for the money.
Isnt every self-rigtheous bullsh1ter said the same?
If you don’t want to get in the pool, why “practice” a swimming art? To just play-pretend that you “understand” swimming? Do you feel better about yourself because you believe that you are doing “advanced internal traditional chinese swimming”? LOL! By never getting wet?
Swimming and fighting are different activity with very mind set.
And then trying to use karma – if I get in the pool and swim, I will attract swimming to me!!! ROFLOL! No, all you will see is that all your fantasies will sink.
Sure, as you like it. your life your choice and you take your consequence.
[QUOTE=Scott R. Brown;1069374][QUOTE=Hendrik;1069367]
Yeah, um…go ask someone…it feels like popcorn…put hand on wall, don’t move in anyway, send wall flying, post chinese youtube video of some old guy flapping his arms like a bird…
THAT is your technology![/QUOTE]
Here on you are in my ignore list same with Terence.
Learning a craft or an art from a master craftsman- is neither east nor west. Hendrik was makinga standard suggestion- go to a teacher who knows. Hendrik does not have a school nor does he make any money off martial arts.
Hendrik is not a racist.. there is a difference between pointing to some classic cultural practice or knowledge or meaning of terms and racism.
joy chaudhuri
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069377]
Here on you are in my ignore list same with Terence.[/QUOTE]
LOL! Denialists ignore inconvenient truths. Funny, how all you have to do is provide evidence that “advanced internal TMA” training does produce good results to refute us, but you can’t come up with one name.
Keep believing in fairies. I do believe in fairies, I do, I do!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069377][QUOTE=Scott R. Brown;1069374]
Here on you are in my ignore list same with Terence.[/QUOTE]
Good decision- hope that you stick with it. Folks too often take the bait of being goaded and prolong a thread that goes in all sorts of direction. The thread started with Theo reporting visiting Hendrik.
Joy chaudhuri
[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1069380]----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Learning a craft or an art from a master craftsman- is neither east nor west. Hendrik was makinga standard suggestion- go to a teacher who knows. Hendrik does not have a school nor does he make any money off martial arts.
[/QUOTE]
You still haven’t answered the question of how does one determine who is a “master craftsman” and who is only role playing?
Hendrik is not a racist.. there is a difference between pointing to some classic cultural practice or knowledge or meaning of terms and racism.
Agreed. Hendrik isn’t a racist. I think Hendrik has some very good info. And I think he’s got some nonsense mixed in with it.
[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1069382]The thread started with Theo reporting visiting Hendrik.
[/QUOTE]
Which in turn, leads into discussing what things Hendrik shared and their value, etc.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069362]I dont making the claim, i am just describe the experience for many people in the past and present.[/QUOTE]
I’m sorry, but you DID make a claim, you did not “just describe the experience for many people”; you said that “anyone” who practices it will get better health:
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069354]any one practice the technology get a better health and better application body/mind/momentum handling ability. That is forsue, any one will get that result be it in the past, present, or future.[/QUOTE]
when you say “anyone”, you are generalizing, taking it out of the realm of subjective experience;
do you realize how these two statements are directly contradictory to one another? how there is a fundamental difference between “anyone” and “many people”? the first is fully inclusive and an absolute; the second, which is, IMPO, a much more reasonable statement, is based on your personal, direct, subjective experience;
frankly, I’m a little surprised that a scientist such as yourself can’t tell the difference, or if you can, fell into the trap of overestimating things; but you wouldn’t be the first…
now, having cleared up the inconsistency there, as regards the second statement, about “many people” - in what way do you qualify “better health”? for example, someone who was sick, practiced what you taught and got better? or that you feel that the people who practice what you teach seem to get sick less often? what do you notice?
BTW Hendrick, I am actually trying to have a reasonable discussion with you here, since health and healing are my area of interest, I am curious as to the way in which the principles you describe relate to what it is that I do;
[QUOTE=horserider;1069309]Just fast glance at this thread . I do not know about others but stepping and pulling one side to launch other side is not how we do what is being called inch jin
Hand flat on target no stepping no rotation or pulling one shoulder to propel other type of momentum. Ours is demonstrated while standing YGKM Hand flat on target. Then either send target of if serious drop target to ground stance never leaves no twisting of waist or shoulders. No rotation or momentum usage. You can do those things of course but that is something else.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=horserider;1069375] Where did I say there was no movement.?
You attack those things you have no knowledge of. Wrapped in your blanket of self righteousness . Claiming ignorance as a virtue and that if you don’t know it it must not be true. The world is large you should experience more and talk less.
As for my fighting knowledge. I fought as professional kick boxer from 1971 to 1973. In Taiwan and S.E. Asia record 5-2 . Not a great fighter but I did it and trained for it. I also spent some time training in wrestling. Perhaps not the same as todays MMA training but real fight training and quality level fighting competition for the time.
As for further discussion when you show me where I said no movement at all then I will speak with you. Until then there is no point in further discussion.[/QUOTE]
Hi horserider,
If you re-read your first post, there is a heavy implication of no movement.
“no stepping no rotation or pulling one shoulder to propel other type of momentum. Ours is demonstrated while standing YGKM Hand flat on target. Then either send target of if serious drop target to ground stance never leaves no twisting of waist or shoulders. No rotation or momentum usage.”
So…no stepping, no rotation or pulling back of a shoulder…..no rotation, no momentum, to twisting of waist or shoulders!
Where is the movement then? If you are not using momentum, are not twisting or moving your waist or shoulders, YOU ARE NOT MOVING!!! I know, I know you are moving your arm that is all? NO that is NOT all. You cannot move JUST your arm and expect to flatten anyone without there being some kind of trick involved. This is a FACT of bio-mechanics!!!
How can someone with your experience have so little body awareness? The fact is, you are either lying or you are moving something and not even knowing that you are doing so!
You have no understanding of bio-mechanics!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069376]you could do your own research and tell us. [/QUOTE]
Uhhhh.we have!!! That is why we are calling BULLSH!T!!!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069376]Isnt every self-rigtheous bullsh1ter said the same? [/QUOTE]
Look in the mirror and let us know!
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069377]Here on you are in my ignore list same with Terence.[/QUOTE]
:eek:
YEEEEEEEE HAW!!! 
After 10 years I finally made it to someones ignore list!
I’m gonna be famous!!!
Me? I never put anyone on ignore, because I am not gutless!
[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1069382]Good decision- hope that you stick with it. Folks too often take the bait of being goaded and prolong a thread that goes in all sorts of direction. The thread started with Theo reporting visiting Hendrik.
Joy chaudhuri[/QUOTE]
Take your whiney holier-than-thou attitude somewhere else! We are posting substantive comments, along with some hyperbole. The hyperbole would not be necessary if Hendrik could answer a direct challenge to his whacky claims with something other than non-sense. He gets what he asked for by acting superior and treating others with dismissiveness and a veiled derision. Kind of like what you are doing now come to think of it! This is not the only thread Hendrik has behaved this way. This is his pattern of behavior when his grandiose vision of himself is challenged. He has a loooooong history of this kind of behavior! If you are too pure to associate with those of us who dont buy into his bull, why post in the first place?
Once you make comments like yours above you have just joined the ranks of us lower-class! Congratulations! You are now what you criticize! How does it feel to be a hypocrite?
I am not goading Hendrik. I am treating him in the same manner he treats others. If you cannot see that you are pretty blind, because you cannot see what is obvious to others!
Scott, I think what these guys who do all of the “one-inch-or-less” movements lack an awareness of is that they equate movement with visible axial rotation movements - e.g. - spinal rotation, stepping, shoulder movements - these are all movements that involve rotation around a given axis, and are therefore visibly more obvious than not;
the sort of movement these guys are experiencing, IMPO/E, is a relatively non-axial*, planar trasnsilatory type that occurs more along as opposed to around a given axis; these movements not only 'look" like there is less / no motion, they feel that way to - my sense is that it has to do with how joint proprioceptors / muscle spindles are maximally stimulated (or maximally “noticed” perhaps) via angular acceleration / momentum, as opposed to compressive / decompressive movements (which are essentialy what long-axis movements do to the connective tissues around them);
instead, the sort of movement that occurs is more of a compression / decompression type (think of an accordion) and involves use of the connective tissue matrix to relay ground reaction force more “efficiently”; it also explains why doing things like standing practice are “necessary” to acquire this particular type of function, because it cues one into axial translatory mechanics; not to say that one cannot acquire this other ways, certainly one can; of course, standing practice will only increase one’s awareness in a relatively static situation, it does nothing for dynamic function, especially against a resisting individual;
anyway, my point again is that I can understand WHY it seems like there is “no movement” going on here; especially because the language for analyzing this sort of motion is not typically available to most people, so they get into the old metaphors of “qi” and the like (I think that this is partially because, for some reason, when one moves in this way, it seems to have an autonomic effect, such as feelings of warmth, “energiy”, etc., especially in the area of major autonomic ganglia, possibly because of what happens to the sympathetic trunk alongside of the thoracics which get “pumped” by the axial loading / unloading of the spine)
just some thoughts…
*addendum: I am not suggesting that there is no axial rotation - it is impossible to move without a rotational component - but because probably a lot of the rotation occurs in the costovertebral and intervertebral joints around relatively transverse as opposed to a vertical or coronal axes, and because it occurs arund multiple transverse axes, you see a resultant “translatory” motion along a vertical axis, as opposed to individual rotation around multiple transverse axes(!); I know that’s a mouthful, but when describing biomechanics accurately, one has to have both an integrated as well as reductive perspective - which is what makes it hard at times, and why many people have incorrect ideas about body mechanics when they have not studied it or used it regularly as I do;
the other thing is that if you start to take into account the “axes” involved in movement through the abdominal and thoracic viscera and connective tissue in general, it gets very complex! you have instantaneous axes which are shifting constantly, and so again, you can have rotation, but it doesn’t “look” like it…
Well it is clear there is some mis-communication going on.
I find it hard to understand how someone can move their body and not even perceive it. Especially someone who claims advance abilities.
Not to mention “momentum”. Where there is movement, there is momentum. It cannot be otherwise under any circumstances.
[QUOTE=Scott R. Brown;1069401]Well it is clear there is some mis-communication going on.
I find it hard to understand how someone can move their body and not even perceive it. Especially someone who claims advance abilities.
Not to mention “momentum”. Where there is movement, there is momentum. It cannot be otherwise under any circumstances.[/QUOTE]
of course there is momentum; it’s just that because it “feels” different" or more likely “look” different, then people who lack the technical capacity to describe what they are doing (also because they probably are supported by those watching them), they start thinking it’s at worst something mysterious or at best something that cannot be described without using esoteric terms like “qi” and “fa ging”, etc.
it’s nothing extraordinary, it just has to be made clear
I’m sorry, but you DID make a claim, you did not “just describe the experience for many people”; you said that “anyone” who practices it will get better health:
when you say “anyone”, you are generalizing, taking it out of the realm of subjective experience;
do you realize how these two statements are directly contradictory to one another? how there is a fundamental difference between “anyone” and “many people”? the first is fully inclusive and an absolute; the second, which is, IMPO, a much more reasonable statement, is based on your personal, direct, subjective experience;
frankly, I’m a little surprised that a scientist such as yourself can’t tell the difference, or if you can, fell into the trap of overestimating things; but you wouldn’t be the first…
now, having cleared up the inconsistency there, as regards the second statement, about “many people” - in what way do you qualify “better health”? for example, someone who was sick, practiced what you taught and got better? or that you feel that the people who practice what you teach seem to get sick less often? what do you notice?
As the above,
With how you address thing and like everything as you format, you sound like your intention is looking for trouble and using everything you could to proof others wrong then wanting a real honest friendly communication to find out what is it.
BTW Hendrick, I am actually trying to have a reasonable discussion with you here, since health and healing are my area of interest, I am curious as to the way in which the principles you describe relate to what it is that I do;
I have no problem with sharing and how things work;
and how it is in fact lots of Chinese and old age Chinese has benifit from it
in the past and present, but the reason is not according to yours format or yours proof or proof this and that to you under this rule that rule…etc.
it cannot be that way because whatever it is is beyond the typical present modern western way of thinking and believe; I am at your spot before I know, and I am not interested to convince you because that waste lots of energy ; and arguement doing anyone no good.
further more, in fighting application side, I have never said WCK is not use for fighting; I am defocus it and emphasis the mind/body transformation practice purposely because fighting has a consequence and not everyone is going to fight. and in this society, how many really can affort to have a physical fight instead of solving the problem one face ? Just get realistic. filling one’s mind with fighting fighting fighting is a sick way of living for human. constructive Human society is based on resolve issue not fighting. IMHO, why promote fighting and violant?
A training which lead one to have a balance and healthy living is much more practical then those idolism fighting model for mass majority.
However, I must said, those who has the snake enginee, the six directional force, the multi-momentum generation type of traning and transformation could do much much more and handling much much more then most ordinary people who has not been train that way.
That is forsue because they were train to handle their mind/body/momentum in a more detials and deeper state. Those are not what the ordinary brute force user can imagine. That is also a fact.