[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069538]May I know how long have you do Hsing Yi? since you said you done Hsing Yi more then Baji? Do you do Zhang Zhuang?[/QUOTE]
I did XingYi since 1978 (I truly don’t like to talk about myself).
My system use “(13 Tai Bo) - 13 postures” as the Zhang Zhuang training. Here is the one called " (She Shen Tan Hai) - Sacrifice body and dive into ocean". The person in that Zhang Zhuang was my teacher.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1069541]I did XingYi since 1978 (I truly don’t like to talk about myself).
My system use “(13 Tai Bo) - 13 postures” as the Zhang Zhuang training. Here is the one called " (She Shen Tan Hai) - Sacrifice body and dive into ocean".
http://img541.imageshack.us/img541/3319/chang13tb.jpg[/QUOTE]
what have you attain on this practice?
Originally Posted by YouKnowWho
The SC system use “(13 Tai Bo) - 13 postures” to train:
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1069543]The SC system use “(13 Tai Bo) - 13 postures” to train:
This seems to be training the Ren and Du medirians have you gone that far?
The main purpose of is to develop the “leg lift” throw (combat application).
http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/7585/changleglifting.jpg
You can see this body posture (head down and leg up) had been used in this clip so many times. It will be very helpful if your body are used to stay in that posture.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5151513507675511017#
Just try to response to your question. Have no intention to take any detour on this thread.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1069545]The main purpose of is to develop the “leg lift” throw (combat application).
http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/7585/changleglifting.jpg
You can see this body posture (head down and leg up) had been used in this clip so many times.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5151513507675511017#
Just try to response to your question. Have no intention to take any detour on this thread.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for your sharing. Understood your intention.
For me, is a good post to train the ren du medirians or the spine. when that is strong then throw will be easy. otherwise, it will be like a gun without bullet.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069547]
For me, is a good post to train the ren du medirians or the spine..[/QUOTE]
do u train it alone or in a sequence (for us, it is #3/8 of our Gong Long Fuk Fu series)?
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069547]Thanks for your sharing. Understood your intention.
For me, is a good post to train the ren du medirians or the spine. when that is strong then throw will be easy. otherwise, it will be like a gun without bullet.[/QUOTE]
You are welcome.
Trying to protect the honor of the TCMA is the common goal that we (TCMA lovers) all intend to share here. We may argue among ourselves but when any MMA guy tries to put down TCMA, we should all unit as blood brothers and fight the foreign intruder. 
So those who keep using their mind wanting control and proof cant enter into the realm.
So you gotta have faith?
I can do without this imaginary realm you are trying to sell. In fact, without control or proof, I have faith I’m better off in the outer darkness.
[QUOTE=theo;1069527]Scott, what I’m saying is that the ancients had a process to develop and reproduce the art, or a process of transmission. if they weren’t good at what they did, then why would we all be doing this? as hendrik pointed out, we’re just looking at what is Natural here and what works, technology. Can someone take that technology and make it work. It’s a process and method of passing the art on. understand the point of the story, but to get the right result, you’ve got to take the right steps. as it has been done for so many years, there is a way to get there and we can either try following it or reinterpret it and try and have a million different opinions on what it’s supposed to mean. the human body can only move in so many ways, so we’re not talking about becoming invisible or qi blasts or anything, but a deeper awareness and handling of the entire body, getting back to Nature. not sure what lineage you come from, but the concept of “internal” exists in all of the red boat lineages. to quote Leung Jan, “your power must be internal”. this is well defined and there is a process of attaining it, that is the transmission Hendrik describes. so if we’re just going to use our own scientific hypothesis and assumptions in the manner of if we can’t prove it then it’s not real kind of mindset (although some experiments have been done to prove, don’t have the facts on me though) maybe we’re missing part of the picture.[/QUOTE]
Hi Theo,
You have explained yourself very well! I appreciate that you have taken the time to do so. I cannot argue with a thing you have said.
I am not intending to state or imply the process you are addressing is useless or ineffective. I am saying that Hendrik presents himself and the method he follows to readers here as different and special and that no one can understand it or apply it effectively unless one is taught by a master. (something he really doesn’t actually know, although he clearly believes it)
I am familiar with more than one method of internal development. All of these methods follow a similar method, process, technology, even cross culturally, just as all forms of martial art follow the same IDENTICAL foundational principles. While there is some differences in application and performance of actions, so to speak, the underlying principles always remain the same. The claim that this particular method is different and special and unlearnable except when taught by a recognized master is specious as long no evidence is provided in which to measure that claim.
There have been many books over the years written on methods of internal development. Whether one can gain any benefits from these may be debated, however the point is they HAVE been written, which means the processes, may be outlined in a clear and concise manner for all to read. EXCEPT, apparently, Hendrik’s method!
Hendrik’s unwillingness or inability to explain himself or his process effectively and the subtle demeaning and dismissive attitude with which he treats others when pressed to give explanations gives the impression of insincerity, untruthfulness and having something to hide. Not to mention it is rude, which is something he refuses to recognize or acknowledge. Yet he presents himself as a teacher of internal arts, which have the purpose of not just improving ones health, but supposedly ones spiritual and emotional maturity. Qualities his pattern of behavior clearly demonstrates he lacks!
If this is a process that he is unwilling to share openly online, then it never should have been mentioned online, unless all he is doing is trying drum up followers.
Think of it this way: What if someone came online and said, “Hey everybody, I just cured cancer! It is easy to do with practice. Anyone can do it, BUT I am afraid I cannot share it with anyone or tell it to anyone, because you just wouldn’t understand!
Isn’t that just what Hendrik is doing here? Isn’t this just the same method used for centuries by “Snake Oil” salesmen? Present something with implied value, but withhold it from an eager and interested public? This is both unkind and unfair to those who are interested in the method. It would have been better not to present anything at all.
So while your explanation, so far, is the best explanation presented on the this thread, it still does not provide any meaningful information. All we have is your anecdotal information, and Hendrik making vague and illusive comments about “popcorn”! Is it any wonder then, that some people are being a bit harsh with Hendrik?
Once again, I really do appreciate your response. It was very well stated and it is very clear and reasonable! Thank you!
[QUOTE=anerlich;1069552]So you gotta have faith?
I can do without this imaginary realm you are trying to sell. In fact, without control or proof, I have faith I’m better off in the outer darkness.[/QUOTE]
No one trying to sell you anything, and no one ask you to imagine. also no one tell you to have faith. even if you think outer darkness you are still in the imaginary realm.
It is just a fact that controlling mind is usually blocking nature to flow. So, let go imagine and let go thinking.
Human are wave or vibration being on top of the bio-chemical. the mind is a good tool to help one to return to the resonance of the vibration. but instead we use mind in the way of wanting control disregard of the resonance, thus we end up distrub the nature operation and flow and cause problem.
All internal art is about let go that distrubance and using intention to lead one back to the nature resonance and let nature take its own path and at some point even drop the intention when it becomes excessive. That is Dao. That is let go let God be. That is using silence to lead action. That is the key of the practice. That is the truth. Only those who knows this could pass the gate of no gate. So, there is no different between enter into silence and doing a prayer, both let go the controlling mind.
Nothing in this world has any control but provide help and support or inteference to the nature vibration.
[QUOTE=taai gihk yahn;1069548]do u train it alone or in a sequence (for us, it is #3/8 of our Gong Long Fuk Fu series)?[/QUOTE]
alone or sequence is not the issue the issue is how deep the training go or what realm or layers ie : mind, body, breathing, qi , Jin, momentum, shen, layer…one activate when doing it. IMHO.
what is Gong Long Fuk Fu? which style is it?
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069561]No one trying to sell you anything, and no one ask you to imagine. also no one tell you to have faith. even if you think outer darkness you are still in the imaginary realm.
It is just a fact that controlling mind is usually blocking nature to flow. So, let go imagine and let go thinking.
Human are wave or vibration being on top of the bio-chemical. the mind is a good tool to help one to return to the resonance of the vibration. but instead we use mind in the way of wanting control disregard of the resonance, thus we end up distrub the nature operation and flow and cause problem.
All internal art is about let go that distrubance and using intention to lead one back to the nature resonance and let nature take its own path and at some point even drop the intention when it becomes excessive. That is Dao. That is let go let God be. That is using silence to lead action. That is the key of the practice. That is the truth. Only those who knows this could pass the gate of no gate. So, there is no different between enter into silence and doing a prayer, both let go the controlling mind.
Nothing in this world has any control but provide help and support or inteference to the nature vibration.[/QUOTE]
Hendrik,
This is the best and most accurate thing you have said on this thread. Good for you!
But…of course, I have to have a but…its required by law, dontcha know?
The way you tend to present yourself, and this subject, implies you mean for the person to have faith in what YOU say, even if you really mean “have faith in a proven method”.
Having trust or faith does not mean to disregard reason. When you, or anyone, does not or cannot recognize the need for some people to address such a topic through reason, it does the earnest seeker a disservice to not address them according to their ability to understand or personal nature.
Your attitude and manner tends to put off those kinds of people. It would behoove youand them to at least validate their concerns and inherent nature, and admit to them their concerns are beyond your abillity to address and try to refer them to someone who can address the concerns and interest according to their inherent nature.
I refer you to the various kinds of Yoga addressed in the Bhagavad-Gita for differing personalities to support my point.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069571]alone or sequence is not the issue the issue is how deep the training go or what realm or layers ie : mind, body, breathing, qi , Jin, momentum, shen, layer…one activate when doing it. IMHO.[/QUOTE]
wow; I guess that you really just can’t participate in a discussion without “teaching”; ok, I won’t bother you anymore; take care
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1069545]The main purpose of is to develop the “leg lift” throw (combat application).
http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/7585/changleglifting.jpg
You can see this body posture (head down and leg up) had been used in this clip so many times. It will be very helpful if your body are used to stay in that posture.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5151513507675511017#
Master Sheng was simply superb. And the standing posture for training- makes sense.
joy chaudhuri
Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
alone or sequence is not the issue the issue is how deep the training go or what realm or layers ie : mind, body, breathing, qi , Jin, momentum, shen, layer…one activate when doing it. IMHO.
[QUOTE=taai gihk yahn;1069590]wow; I guess that you really just can’t participate in a discussion without “teaching”; ok, I won’t bother you anymore; take care[/QUOTE]
Feel free to do what you want, that is not an issue for me. I have plenty to discuss and learn.
As evidence above, who is “teaching”?
I am just express my view response to your question honestly and openly. it is straight forward technological discussion to share information of TCMA.
If I got this post from some one else, I would reply, " IMHO, that picture is showing he is inhaling and using his 3 hands yang medirians and 3 legs ying medirians… and also his ren medirians.. along with his spine… so he must bet cultivating the pull or sucking phase …etc. What do you think?
and the other person might come back says, Yes that is true based on the shape of the spine which it is U shape in one way and reverse U shape in another way …while activating the Ren and Du medirians…
And I would then reply…
And the discussion continuous… that is simple discussion for those who really train and know what they are doing. why all these false accusation? That is a sign of wanting control and manupulative, not a behaviour of open discussion.
And if some one expect to get praise on " Oh you are great" … Well shows some indepth insight and kung fu. instead of lots of superficial stuffs mimic-ing expert, mimic-ing Lao Tzu in talk, request proof this and that which is totally off the mark.
not to mention, those who really have the kung fu careless on those B$
" you are great and I know it too social words" because those who really have the kung fu knows either one find a mate or not. like those who love based ball cards will talk only passionate in base ball cards, or those who knows the music passionate in music exchange. they could learn from each others while communicating with passionate. No you are great I know it too. BS.
As I told Youknowwho, one cant BS one’s kung fu level, for the experience, just a few scans, one knows what is the deal. and there are plenty of those advance level people, at least have bow to lots of them. I am actually extremely happy to bow and learn from them because that benifit me. Never I would say such thing as above when I found others has much more deep insigh then myself.
I would not lower my Barr because as any base ball card lover or music lover, you want to join the club, bring your cards and music and passionate.
Youknowho,
You see, TCMA goes down to tube when there are lots of pretender who never even practice but talk big. As that picture you shows me, anyone could try it while doing it with inhale and compare it when one doing it with exhale and see which feel more nature according to the flow of motion and body handling…etc. That is the discussion. IMHO. What do you think?
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069593]As evidence above, who is “teaching”? [/QUOTE]
you really have no idea, do you? I asked a question just out of curiosity; your response was essentially to say that it was the “wrong” question (“alone or sequence not the issue”), and then proceed to tell me what I should be asking about; now mayb this wasn’t your intention, but this is how you come across most of the time: avuncular and pedantic; and it pretty much kills any interest because you are constantly attempting to re-frame the discussion along the parameters that you consider important;
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069593]I am just express my view response to your question honestly and openly. it is straight forward technological discussion to share information of TCMA. [/QUOTE]
this isn’t speaking to skill or technical knowledge; it has to do with basic social skills that you appear to b lacking in; and of course, you may not care, I am aware that this is certainly your perogative, but again, it speaks to one’s capacity to create the potential for continued discussion as opposed to inhibiting it; and again, you seem to often express surprise as to why many people “attack” and “hate” you; this is why, IMPO;
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069593]Feel free to do what you want.[/QUOTE]
thanks for your permission :rolleyes:; again, yet another example of why many people find interacting with you tiresome - your “behavior” is, in a word, often boorish; and again, I understand that you may not care (heck, you may even b doing it on purpose to “weed out” the people u interact with), I am not suggesting you should, I am just pointing it out, with no expectation one way or the other; I am not telling you how you should be, I am not “requiring” you to change, I am just pointing out, in context of this particular social environment, the cause / effect nature of your posting style and the responses you often get, in the off-hand event that you might be interested in it and just can’t seem to notice it on your own;
ok, let me give you an example of a “normal” social interaction:
TGY: “do you do the move in sequence or alone?”
Hendrick: “we do it alone / in sequence (pick one); why do u ask that question?”
TGY: “well, because in our particular 8-posture sequence, if u examine the move in relation to the 2 preceding it and the 1 following it, it functions as a “gathering” posture but unlike the first two that are “pure” gathering”, this one also starts the “engine” in terms of how we do it, as there is a specific “pumping” of the ankle of the leg that is in the air, and relates to the last 4 movements which are varyingly “distiling” and “distributive”, so while doing it alone is fine, when done in sequence it has a different effect"
or something like that - meaning that there is, IMPE, a substantial difference between doing it alone or in sequence ( of course agreeing w u that the move itself can b done on many layers)
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069593]
If I got this post from some one else, I would reply, " IMHO, that picture is showing he is inhaling and using his 3 hands yang medirians and 3 legs ying medirians… and also his ren medirians.. along with his spine… so he must bet cultivating the pull or sucking phase …etc.[/QUOTE]
when we do it, the arms are actually crossed in front of the body - which of course changes the nature of the arm meridian function; also, we do not do it only w inhale - the ankle “pumps” in accordance w the natural in/out breath cycle, w “emphasis” slightly more on exhale - but the nature of the move is overall a “gathering” one, so similar to I wud SPECULATE to what u call “pull / sucking”; and also the emphasis is on “opening” the governing channel (versus next move which opens conception vessel)
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1069593]And the discussion continuous… that is simple discussion for those who really train and know what they are doing.[/QUOTE]
I agree;
ok, let me give you an example of a “normal” social interaction:
That is according to you instead of Normal.
Dont give me those BS social skill stuffs allabi for your own very controlling /manupulative mentality or behavior.
Again, this is the USA, I live in the Silicon Valley and dealling with all type of creative people and hot shorts. So, what you post is not Normal for me who live in a free speech and free idea and creative enviroment. and we here could sense those type of manupulative act very quickly.
However, it is "absolutely abnormal " to post an false accusation when others reply politely in a good faith with a view in a different way. Those are just abnormal behavior.
No one will take those BS false accusation or attack or manupulative.
life is too short for those BS to always get off track from the subject.
and there is no time for licking one’s superiority complex and inferiority complex.
Hendrik- that was a good distinction you mad on the differences between wc and some shaolin styles on energy in the fingers.
It takes work and time to get to that stage.
Happy New Year to you,
joy