[QUOTE=t_niehoff;1072771]So, if you want to talk about using mechanics, you also need to talk about the task.[/QUOTE]
Agree 100% there. Without understanding what problem Hendrik tried to solve, it’s very difficult to understand what he was trying to say.
Simple question, “How to kill your opponent by using levitation”?
[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1072778]
Hendrik no longer fights and what he talks about is not enough for fighting- one still needs to be clear on mechanics, structure, timing, physical and mental training, clearing ones head etc.
[/QUOTE]
Joy,
You are right I dont fight anymore. Working toward to become an Arhat .. hahaha
as for mechanics, structure, timing, physical, and mental, IMHO, from my understanding of the ancient, as soon as one handle the six direction force vectors and having awareness at every instant, the mechanics…etc issue is solved in the root level.
six directional force vectors concep always comes with a trajectory path which means it consist of the past, present, and future trend.
IE one doesnt have to know how the car moves and if it is even a car or a bus, as soon as one solve the momentum/force vectors issue at the particular contact instant one solve the contact point issue without has to deal with lots of mechanics…issue. bottom line, it is that particular contact point one is interested in.
so, the snake engine is to make sure one has all the handle or knob for the handling.
and levitation means one needs to be in neutral state to be able to response in the instant, otherwise one is always having a lag time which is too late to solve the present issue due to one always has to undo something before one can do something.
so,
What happen is the technology chop up the mechanics, structure…etc to frame by frame, similar to a movie is consisted of frame by frame and if one solve the issue frame by frame then one deal with the whole movie right there at each frame.
Thus, the above type of paradigm is a different type of paradigm which the internal artists such as WXZ and other ancient artists into if describe in our modern term. That is when they said, K1 is not the root, waist is not the master… formless… etc everything turn into a flow in this paradigm and only awareness, force vectors balancing, and a mind-body which is capable to handle the awareness, force vectors balancing matter. it is beyond shape or form because everything is dynamics.
And once one get into this paradigm one no longer will ask if the weight is place in K1 or heel… in YJKYM…etc
why? take a look at human body, in the inhale phase the spine curve one way and the other way in the exhale phase. so, that spine curving will cause the weight to shift from K1 to heel or back…etc that is nature. unless one is dead otherwise the weight has to move. not to mention when the hand moves then other momentum issues involve.
and if one trying to fix into one point then one needs other force vectors to compensate for the fixing. and this is extra effort also it great problem of lag time because one always has to undo this compensation in response to what one face.
Thanks for sharing. It is a good one to read.
The title Levitate could be any words, it is what the idea points to that is the key. it is the time to enter the era of dynamic flow structure.
I was coaching another WCner a few days ago on YJKYM in south east asia via video conference. and at one point he told me it seems that the body never still but everything is moving…
my answer to him is dont you know your body is alive? and only when you use a live body to practice the SLT you have an alive SLT. otherwise it is dead — just mimic-ing something where you dont even know your own body. SLT means pay attention to all those details which is alive instead of fixing your weight in your heel…etc and practicing as a mechanical dead robot but expecting to be a living tiger.
[QUOTE=kung fu fighter;1072782]here is something that might interest you
"Hellebrandt (1940) was one of the first to demonstrate that even the erect standing posture is not literally static. …[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=chusauli;1072780]Perhaps “riding” is a better word than “levitating”.[/QUOTE]
Robert,
As you know, words are just words, those are just a symbol it can be called anything.
For me, riding is not accurate because when the person is at the state, one is actually “floating”.
as it describe here in other IMA classic
http://www.taichicentral.com/tai-chi-central-news-journal/files/1de5f0941f950372a01eac473515b02d-20.php
Thus, as I told others in this forum, go get the process, attain it and tell the world what it is. Everyone can experiment with it and know what it is.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1072783]Agree 100% there. Without understanding what problem Hendrik tried to solve, it’s very difficult to understand what he was trying to say.
Simple question, “How to kill your opponent by using levitation”?[/QUOTE]
Do you know why is it a need of neutral gear in a car? it doesnt do anything right?
I am not trying to solve anything I am presenting what the ancient TCMA IMA practice which is not known to the general public in the west with a western language.
Namely, Levitate = float = virtue ground = the point where the force vectors from the six direction in the 3 D axis cancel and balance each others.
The bottom line is if one doesnt get close to this state Qi layer will not surface and thus one will not experience Qi’s flow.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1072791]I am not trying to solve anything I am presenting what the ancient TCMA IMA practice which is not known to the general public in the west with a western language.[/QUOTE]
My question is:
[QUOTE=chusauli;1072780]Perhaps “riding” is a better word than “levitating”.[/QUOTE]
i would suggest “buoyancy”…
[QUOTE=taai gihk yahn;1072794]i would suggest “buoyancy”…[/QUOTE]
Sure, why not? in that direction…
just not using the old term like… Grounding, loose up… words anymore.. those are misleading IMHO.
The paradigm got to be shifted or else stuck.
more people needs to get into these and tell the world what the heck is it. Interpetation doesnt do any good but misleading.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1072793]My question is:
you certainly have not read my posts.
So, this levitate stuff are a part of the first SLT kuen kuit which is passed down by Yik Kam.
1,
Collect the Intention/Attention union with the awareness in the Equal Shoulder stance
http://wingchunkuen.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=1273
These stuffs are what one is coach into experimenting and experiencing in that equal shoulder stance. in this stanza, in one part one is lead or coach into the silence to know what is Awareness and one’s mind/intention and the other part is to know one’s body.
It is not even anything deep. but the first step to begin the SLT training.
In my understanding, this is a pre 1840 deal when training TCMA, so why is it 1840 is a big deal? because 1840 is the era of the opium war. the chinese lost, and China become a partial colonist where traditional culture good of bad become the target of western judgement vedict in the name of NOT SCIENTIFIC. Yes, that is the same term used since then. and a pre meditative culture or civilization put down and destruction begun. The second of this type of incident is 1965 when Mao using the Russian way to destroy the chinese civilization for his own political agenda.
I never say everything in the old Chinese tradition is great ;but there are some thing which is even the west doesnt have it be it in today’s high tech era; due to the tranditional Chinese is living in a different paradigm ;and thus will have different solution looking from different angle, where some not as good but some much superior solution then the west. That is a reality. if one look at the writing of post 1840 and 1965 one would not see these type of content.
So, here we took a something the WCK ancestor practice in pre 1840 and examine it with the modern high tech era’s eyes. To see what is it they know pre 1840 and got almost wipe out. This is just the first baby step of ---- Knowing your own mind and body before begining the SLT.
It is very possible that the following is how the ancestors in the red boat every coach by YWC herself. it goes directly to the human way.
The following are the description of the six directional force vectors via forward/backward pair, left/right pair/ up/down (discending) pair. each pair being introduce one at a time and then merge all of them together to start SLT. the falling step type of momentum is introduce within the up/down pair. the left/right pair introduce a spiral /torqe type of momentum…
2,
Both hands raise forward duality is form.
3, ,
Left Leg trips out there is a aiding and counter effect. Right heel with spiral force tightly stored.
4,
Qi activity in Dan Dien and the Du Medirian while the spine is loosely discending.
Thus, one is prepared on the mind/body force vectors before begining the SLT. And when one is practicing the SLT one already has experienced with the mind, body, six directional force vectors which cover the 3 D. The SLT is then used as a vehicle to further experiments. handling, and testing one’s skill " buoyancy" in the 3 D force/momentum field.
So the first four stanzas cover the basic of the basic and if this is missing then the basic or operating manual is lost.
[QUOTE=Vajramusti;1072778]Dictionary definitions are ok for denotation.. they have their shortcomings in connotation. Yet words have to be used in chat lists- so if interested in serious conversation- one has to try and understand the perspective of the word user. despite the differences..
[/QUOTE]
I completely disagree.
If a poster is trying to get across an idea in a forum, then the responsibility to communicate that idea lies with the person communicating. It is not the case where someone can spew out of their mouth the first thing that comes into their head regardless of accuracy and everyone else hearing it or reading it has the burden of translating. There is a responsibility in comminicating ideas that involves a diligent effort to communicate to an audience.
If someone offers a better word, the proper response would be to look up that word if one doesn’t understand it, and say “thank you” if it is better suited, or to explain more fully if it is not. Here, instead, we see a stubborn and egotistical reponse saying “my meaning of levitate was perfect as stated”.
If someone is not willing to do that, then why should I invest any time in trying to understand what they are saying?
[QUOTE=Wayfaring;1072809]I completely disagree.
If a poster is trying to get across an idea in a forum, then the responsibility to communicate that idea lies with the person communicating. It is not the case where someone can spew out of their mouth the first thing that comes into their head regardless of accuracy and everyone else hearing it or reading it has the burden of translating. There is a responsibility in comminicating ideas that involves a diligent effort to communicate to an audience.
If someone offers a better word, the proper response would be to look up that word if one doesn’t understand it, and say “thank you” if it is better suited, or to explain more fully if it is not. Here, instead, we see a stubborn and egotistical reponse saying “my meaning of levitate was perfect as stated”.
If someone is not willing to do that, then why should I invest any time in trying to understand what they are saying?[/QUOTE]
If that is truly how you feel, that your time is wasted, then why bother posting at all? Others here are getting something from what is posted, if you are unable or unwilling to do so then that is your choice. However, others apparently do not feel the same way.
Terms are always open to interpretation, particularily in WC as words and terms do not translate directly into English or whatever your mother tongue may be.
[QUOTE=Sihing73;1072820]others apparently do not feel the same way. [/QUOTE]
Unfortunately I feel the same way as Wayfaring does. The levitation is not WC term. It’s not Taiji term either. It’s not even IMA term. It was a term that only used by Hendrik. Without futher clearfication, Wayfaring and I won’t be able to know what Hendrik was talking about (does it matter?). The word “(Piao) - float” and “(Shun) - raisin” are both used in TCMA but that doen’t seem to be what Hendrik was talking about.
Unfortunately I feel the same way as Wayfaring does. The levitation is not WC term. It’s not Taiji term either.
It’s not even IMA term. It was a term that only used by Hendrik. Without futher clearfication, Wayfaring and I won’t be able to know what Hendrik was talking about (does it matter?).
The word “(Piao) - float” and “(Shun) - raisin” are both used in TCMA but that doen’t seem to be what Hendrik was talking about.
if you read my previous post such
http://kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1072790&postcount=21
http://kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1072791&postcount=22
http://kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1072796&postcount=25
how difficult is it to find out?
But if you like to think you know and expect I am to present what you think you know, then that is your view issue not mine.
Levitate in chinese is . Float in chinese is both with . they both are describing what it is in that state.
taai gihk yahn who knows taiji is nice enough to propose “buoyancy” based on his experience which I am ok with it. and buoyancy in chinese is . and notice is there.
So what is the problem when I said anyone in that state feel like “floating” in my above post to Robert?
So, why is it so important to complain all about words and words? Use any words one likes I care least of that. I am sharing what exist and it is absolutely not Grounding. and the rest how one wants to name it I careless.
Finally, it sure is not a translate IMA term but anyone who get close or get to that state will recognize it and if there is no such term in English yet. well, make one now. But if one is doesnt get to that state yet. then one doesnt know and time to go experiment on it.
Read the following and it is there
http://kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1072724&postcount=1
So if you really really really want to dig into TCMA IMA, if one implement the following in one single instant,
or
As soon as there is movement, the whole body should be fluid, agile, and light
having all parts connected like a string of pearls. The energy is arousing, pure, and full.
The spirit is gathered and refined. No place for gaps or deficiencies. No place for unevenness.
No place for disconnection.
At that instant, one will experience Levitate or “floating”. So do you want me to
post
As soon as there is movement, the whole body should be fluid, agile, and light
having all parts connected like a string of pearls. The energy is arousing, pure, and full.
The spirit is gathered and refined. No place for gaps or deficiencies. No place for unevenness.
No place for disconnection.
where your mind could read and lost in words or just simply tell you at that state one is feeling " levitate"? I am fine with both.
KFF,
the whole body should be fluid, agile, and light + string of pearls is the snake engine.
No place for gaps or deficiencies no place for unevenness no place for disconnection is the 6D force vectors balancing.
The energy is arousing, pure, and full. The spirit is gathered and refined. is Awareness and Qi…
Levitate = float = virtue ground = the point where the force vectors from the six direction in the 3 D axis cancel and balance each others.
I truly don’t know what you are talking about here.
Why don’t you just call it “dynamic rooting” instead?
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1072825]Why don’t you just call it “dynamic rooting” instead?[/QUOTE]
What root?
where in the world the IMA said it is a Root?
or
As soon as there is movement, the whole body should be fluid, agile, and light
having all parts connected like a string of pearls. The energy is arousing, pure, and full.
The spirit is gathered and refined. No place for gaps or deficiencies. No place for unevenness. No place for disconnection.
You see, let’s not trying to use our mind to guess what it is not.
as I says again and again, attain the state then describe it with you own words and any words. this is not the realm for guessing. one needs to attain the state to play there.
otherwise it is doing a dis-service and mislead the heck out of others.
I am trying to expand the horizon into the dynamic structure realm instead of falling back to the static structure and rooting…etc.
A car doesnt root it moves, a plane doesnt root it takes off and fly. so it is time to move on.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1072821]Unfortunately I feel the same way as Wayfaring does. The levitation is not WC term. It’s not Taiji term either. It’s not even IMA term. It was a term that only used by Hendrik. Without futher clearfication, Wayfaring and I won’t be able to know what Hendrik was talking about (does it matter?). The word “(Piao) - float” and “(Shun) - raisin” are both used in TCMA but that doen’t seem to be what Hendrik was talking about.[/QUOTE]
I agree as well… but it doesnt really matter what anyone thinks.
Hendrick tells all how he wants to present his case/theories/agendas, call them what you like, to help all understand WC… but ultimately when asked a simple question such as “will this help my combat skills and how?” he patronsingly responds “read my past posts” as if the questioner is an idiot.
Yet when someone, for example Theo (just as a case) asks a question the response is something like “thanks for the input into this discussion” or something similar.
He’s selective on who/how he answers posts to push his agenda… simple as that
And the really sad thing is, there might be some young person who wants to learn real WC, buys his nonsense, and then wastes maybe 10 years to find out he has nothing to offer in a practical sense.
That, is thetrue tragedy of his ramblings
GlennR
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1072826]What root?
where in the world the IMA said it is a Root?[/QUOTE]
You will need “rooting” for everythig. When you lie down, sit, or stand, you have “static rooting”. When you walk, run, and jump, you have “dynamic rooting”. No MA can exist without either “static rooting” or “dynamic rooting”.
you are sure to give you opinion.
The following is an example of the answer for your
“will this help my combat skills and how?”
in a classical TCMA IMA way
Addendum (attributed to Yang Lu-Chan (1799-1872)
This treatise was left to us by the founder, Zhang Sanfeng.
offering the promise of longevity to the whole world,
It is not just for trivial martial skill which is consider to be the the least important.
[QUOTE=GlennR;1072827]I agree as well… but it doesnt really matter what anyone thinks.
Hendrick tells all how he wants to present his case/theories/agendas, call them what you like, to help all understand WC… but ultimately when asked a simple question such as “will this help my combat skills and how?” he patronsingly responds “read my past posts” as if the questioner is an idiot.
Yet when someone, for example Theo (just as a case) asks a question the response is something like “thanks for the input into this discussion” or something similar.
He’s selective on who/how he answers posts to push his agenda… simple as that
And the really sad thing is, there might be some young person who wants to learn real WC, buys his nonsense, and then wastes maybe 10 years to find out he has nothing to offer in a practical sense.
That, is thetrue tragedy of his ramblings
GlennR[/QUOTE]