The old masters were amazing !!!!

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Wing Chun
1

http://mplay.donga.com/dkbnews/2004/0401_ohvsjin.wmv

not :stuck_out_tongue:

kind of makes you wonder of the ''real skill ‘’ behind those stories , i’m sure there is a ton of ‘‘stories’’ of how good these guys were and there lineage and there secret training Jing inch blah blah

but they fight like children HMMMMMMMMM!!!

keep reading the fantasy fu people . :wink:

2

Hey Bro,

thanks for posting this. I had downloaded it before, but lost it.

It’s a true gem! :smiley:

-L

3

Great timing Ernie. Was just talking about this video to a great and powerful Kung Fu master this weekend ( he teaches one of the styles). One of my favorite kung-fu videos thanks for the link.

4

No problem guys ,
i love this clip , lost it as well and stumbled on it on another forum , were guess what they were making fun of the “”“” kung fu master ‘’‘’‘’’

now back to school yard b*tch slapping :smiley:

5

The Old Masters were good … Leonardo, Michelangelo, Donatello, Raphael, Titian, etc. … or as my tour guide in Europe called them, the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

6

Now that sir , , is what I call a sense of humor , good one anerlich :smiley:

but were does the old rat fit in :wink:

7

Oooh! I know! Center-Slot Bun Time! Yeeeoowchie!

8

Those old clips remind me of the first Wing Chun books I bought when began my training in WC. One of them was by James Lee (Bruce co-wrote it). It was terrible IMO. The techniques demonstrated were very very basic and James didn’t look that skilled in the Wing Chun. Even the first Bruce Lee book with him in his Kung-fu uniform was lousy IMO. I bet you all if we have some good footage of Wing Chun before the early 70’s it would all look terrible. IMO the Wing Chun of today is at a much higher standard and quality. Although lots of people on this forum do not agree with using WC as a business, the best part of just that is the fact it inspires quality and constant revaluation of what one is offering to the public, bad quality and no customers or repeat customers. The key in WC business is quality control and offering a quality product.

James

9

"Although lots of people on this forum do not agree with using WC as a business, the best part of just that is the fact it inspires quality and constant revaluation of what one is offering to the public, bad quality and no customers or repeat customers. The key in WC business is quality control and offering a quality product."

James

What happens when you don’t stock enough product for the customers demand? :smiley:

10

I don’t think is has ANYTHING to do with the “Wing Chun of Today.” In fact, I would venture that a LOT of ANY martial arts of today are so watered down, it’s sick.

I believe there are very few who learned what they got from their Sifu and didn’t change structure or violate the principles of their family’s Wing Chun out of ego, etc.

Look at Gary Lam and Ernie and Victor(just to point out a few)…they test it out - put their Wing Chun under pressure. My Sifu hits me during Chi Sao. I haven’t sparred with him yet - but I’m sure he’d knock my block off! That’s as close to real as it can get in a controlled environment. After doing crap Kenpo where you stop 1" from the target and crap Wing Chun where you stop, oh, 1" from the target…the first time I even got a tap - I was dazed!

Just like anything in life…you’ve got people who take what they’ve learned, apply it and get to the meat of the matter…and people who water it down and sell it to all the really stupid people.

Peace,
Kenton Sefcik

11

It was good. All that it needs is Hail Mary Chain Punching and we’ve got a series!

12

Actually ernie, if you look at the White Crane fighter he is using his system most of the time. The “wild” swings are typical of some White Crane techniques. CLF would probably look wild compared to boxing as well. You’ll also notice some strikes to the arms that are part of White Crane.The older Sifu even tries to copy some the White Crane Sifu’s techniques unsuccessfully. I have this clip on a CD and at first I thought they looked like children fighting until have watched it over and over with a White Crance practitioner from the mainland who pointed out certain techniques.
Philh

13

sorry phil the can point out this or that till the cows come home , all i see is really bad timing , really bad footwork , no clue on distance

techniques , hand shapes animal postures mean nothing to me

so if that is what it is supposed to look like , i stand by my point , they suck!

but you do prove another point funny how the ‘styles’ spin doc’s will try and twist the obvious to fit there imagination :wink:

14

I agree with Mr. Redmond. I watched this clip over and over some time ago and came to realize their is a lot more technique going on than first appears. These guys may not be great fighters by any standards, but they are using their styles more than today’s kickboxing gung fu matches demonstrate. This was a freindly match too I’ve been told and rules were set up that restricted a lot of techniques. Still, even if you think its a demonstration of what not to do, I think we can all say its entertaining to watch.

15

Well…

Ali/Frazier it wasn’t.

Thanks for sharing, Ernie…zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

16

The clips you posted weren’t Ali/Frazier either…snore

17

Yeah wasn’t this like a famous match between some bagua guy and a white crane guy?

I remember reading something about it or what not. As for the white crane techniques, I have sparred crane boxers, and one of my friends studied 5 animals of shaolin for many years. It looked like crap compared to what I have seen first hand. However, I digress, it was filmed on some lame old 8mm camera, so it could be the angle or the quality of the film itself. I was not there that day so I will preserve judgement to a full extent, and leave a little for the benefit of the doubt.

Phil,

My sifu also holds high ranking in CLF, and I have seen some of the stuff he knows, it doesn’t look very sloppy at all, no more than wing chun would look in a real fight.

18

Now that we have seen the ‘’quality ‘’ of what people back in the day considered ‘’masters’’ enough so they would plan an event around it and televise it!

Let’s look at what this really means,

  • this is what they thought top notch martial arts was supposed to be like
  • this then would reflect that above average skills that people were exposed to from the past up until that time of that fight
  • They were obliviously proud and excited so they felt it was a good showing!
  • since style often fought styles back then and this was the product of generations of training methods , family secrets , lineage holders , battle tested techniques and applications
  • yet when you watch it , the have horrible body mechanics, horrible balance , horrible timing , horrible footwork , complete over commitment and lack of recovery
  • I’m sure when they practice there forms and you just sit there and let them hit you they seemed great!
  • But the obviously had no experience , or a decent training method in dealing with a live opponent
  • For all the generations and inspiring stories , the real end result is as apparent then as it is now , there training methods were not up to par with the concepts of they thought they were doing
  • Phil if you have to sift through tons of crap to find the technique or one or two % good things weighed against the 98 % crap end result is you still have a lot of crap!
  • So for those that keep living in the past , the past has spoken and guess what it didn’t support itself very well
  • Sure you might say well this is just 2 guys and you can let them sum up all other people [because I’m sure you heard a STORY or saw a DEMO that lit your fantasy fu fire] but this is respective of the training methods and results of the old guys! right there in moving picture ,

I have to agree with James fighters are so much better now , training is so much better now , real life skills not story or demo skills are so much better now , the camera’s are rolling people can’t hide the truth !
Keep reading your fantasy fu scrolls, keep your head in the dirt, keep asking how I stop a jab or deal with a take down

-this was a message from our sponsors on the emergency broadcasting system supported by the wake the f*ck up foundation for positive growth

19

Now that we have seen the ‘’quality ‘’ of what people back in the day considered ‘’masters’’ enough so they would plan an event around it and televise it!

Let’s look at what this really means,

  • this is what they thought top notch martial arts was supposed to be like
  • this then would reflect that above average skills that people were exposed to from the past up until that time of that fight
  • They were obliviously proud and excited so they felt it was a good showing!
  • since style often fought styles back then and this was the product of generations of training methods , family secrets , lineage holders , battle tested techniques and applications
  • yet when you watch it , the have horrible body mechanics, horrible balance , horrible timing , horrible footwork , complete over commitment and lack of recovery
  • I’m sure when they practice there forms and you just sit there and let them hit you they seemed great!
  • But the obviously had no experience , or a decent training method in dealing with a live opponent
  • For all the generations and inspiring stories , the real end result is as apparent then as it is now , there training methods were not up to par with the concepts of they thought they were doing
  • Phil if you have to sift through tons of crap to find the technique or one or two % good things weighed against the 98 % crap end result is you still have a lot of crap!
  • So for those that keep living in the past , the past has spoken and guess what it didn’t support itself very well
  • Sure you might say well this is just 2 guys and you can let them sum up all other people [because I’m sure you heard a STORY or saw a DEMO that lit your fantasy fu fire] but this is respective of the training methods and results of the old guys! right there in moving picture ,

I have to agree with James fighters are so much better now , training is so much better now , real life skills not story or demo skills are so much better now , the camera’s are rolling people can’t hide the truth !
Keep reading your fantasy fu scrolls, keep your head in the dirt, keep asking how do I stop a jab or deal with a take down :smiley:

-this was a message from our sponsors on the emergency broadcasting system supported by the wake the f*ck up foundation for positive growth
:wink:

20

Based on todays fighting standards you are absolutely right. They’d both get creamed by most modern fighters. I’be been watching boxing footage on the life of Jack Johson and some of their fighting looks terrible compared to boxers now. But you have to give at least give the White Crane guy props for staying within his system. I can’t say that about the Tai Chi master however.
Phil