are there certain kung-fu styles that tend to have more involvement in the competitive san shou arena than others? if so, what are they?
San Shou
We at Wu Tang are very involved. Alot of other guys on here are as well, I Know
Jow Ga guys are heavy into, along with David Ross’s NY San DA (basically san shou with minor differences) Also if you hear LEi Tai then it is another form of full contact Chinese Fighting (the original). I am sure several guys will speak up on this subject.
THe strange thing is many have foresaken the traditional fighting for the glitz of televisions MMA events. So there are alot fewer teams in the USA. There still remains a large force outside of our borders where there is less comercialism and more focus on the athletic (as in forced to fight till KO or until rounds are over (no submission) ) and traditional fighting styles.
is your wu tang school more the exception or the norm compared to other wu tang schools regarding san shou involvement?
what about other styles like preying mantis and wing chun and monkey and white crane and shaolin etc etc
i’m sure there are schools here and there of lots of styles that do it, but i want to know if there are particular styles that really gravitate towards it more than others. for example, do a lot of preying mantis schools train for competitive san shou?
It’s not a style issue (unless you are going to a San Shou school). Some teachers empahsize San Shou, some don’t. You will just have to find a school, regardless of style, that emphasizes a curriculum that fits your needs.
but do you think because of the mma phenom that this will be a credibility issue for kung-fu schools?
if they dont advertise the fact that they do hard sparring/san shou, then it is just assumed the school just does forms and theoretical applications.
i think the reality check mma is bringing to the kung-fu world is huge, and is gonna stay. i bet more and more schools are gonna get more involved in san shou, just so that they can have public credibility. i wanted to see if stylistically if some kung-fu systems were ahead of the curve…beyond just an individual school choice.
wrestling, muay thai, judo, and boxing do well;)
[QUOTE=Sifu Darkfist;752514]THe strange thing is many have foresaken the traditional fighting for the glitz of televisions MMA events. So there are alot fewer teams in the USA. There still remains a large force outside of our borders where there is less comercialism and more focus on the athletic (as in forced to fight till KO or until rounds are over (no submission) ) and traditional fighting styles.[/QUOTE]
Many what? CMA does not have a big presence in mma at all. If you mean the mainstream population, they were NEVER interested in san shou anyway… a lot of them aren’t interested in mma either. Pro wrestling and boxing are both much bigger.
[QUOTE=SevenStar;752544]Many what? CMA does not have a big presence in mma at all. If you mean the mainstream population, they were NEVER interested in san shou anyway… a lot of them aren’t interested in mma either. Pro wrestling and boxing are both much bigger.[/QUOTE]
to further expand, why do you think this is the case?
why, if practically every other martial art is involved in MMA why not kung fu?
whats the big deal, i dont really get it.
kungfu guys must all just be scared i guess.
I mean i understand the idea of carrying on your art the traditional way it was taught and not changing your program to fit the needs of an MMA venue, but i mean if i was a kungfu instructor, i would feel like quite the chump if i didnt have even one guy i was training for the cage/ring…
i guess more people like me need to teach.
[QUOTE=xmma;752525]i think the reality check mma is bringing to the kung-fu world is huge, and is gonna stay. i bet more and more schools are gonna get more involved in san shou, just so that they can have public credibility. i wanted to see if stylistically if some kung-fu systems were ahead of the curve…beyond just an individual school choice.[/QUOTE]
What “systems” are there? Schools are not affiliated with a “system.” They teach a certain lineage. Sometimes, you have a few schools banded together through that lineage, but there aren’t any “systems” out there forcing curriculum changes in individual schools.
It’s not like all Hung Gar schools are going to wake up one morning and suddenly start fighting more.
Some schools fight. Some don’t.
kungfu guys must all just be scared i guess.
Reply]
No, they just all go to San Shou and Kuo Shou.
[QUOTE=PangQuan;752549]to further expand, why do you think this is the case?
why, if practically every other martial art is involved in MMA why not kung fu?
whats the big deal, i dont really get it.
kungfu guys must all just be scared i guess.
I mean i understand the idea of carrying on your art the traditional way it was taught and not changing your program to fit the needs of an MMA venue, but i mean if i was a kungfu instructor, i would feel like quite the chump if i didnt have even one guy i was training for the cage/ring…
i guess more people like me need to teach.[/QUOTE]
maybe its cos losing a match will shatter the illusion of invincibility. but i think because of mma, lack of participation may be what shatters the illusion of invincibility
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;752551]What “systems” are there? Schools are not affiliated with a “system.” They teach a certain lineage. Sometimes, you have a few schools banded together through that lineage, but there aren’t any “systems” out there forcing curriculum changes in individual schools.
It’s not like all Hung Gar schools are going to wake up one morning and suddenly start fighting more.
Some schools fight. Some don’t.[/QUOTE]
then what lineages of what styles of kung-fu are known, have reps of doing san shou? is it really as random as you’re making it seem? or are there lineages in different styles that have a reputation for competing in san shou?
[QUOTE=xmma;752521]is your wu tang school more the exception or the norm compared to other wu tang schools regarding san shou involvement?
what about other styles like preying mantis and wing chun and monkey and white crane and shaolin etc etc
i’m sure there are schools here and there of lots of styles that do it, but i want to know if there are particular styles that really gravitate towards it more than others. for example, do a lot of preying mantis schools train for competitive san shou?[/QUOTE]
WuTang’s background in protection of people as well as military, and the old challenges historical with Figures such as GGM Li Shu Wen.
A long tradition of Lei Tai and combatant training coincides perfectly with the need to hone skills and sport fighting. Many of our schools continue this strong tradition. My opinion is all schools need to fight if for nothing else to allow someone the experience of being hit so that they can develop the ability to rise above it and defend themselves. I have seen many fall due to the inability to transcend the first few seconds and deliver devastating response (in the case of being blindsided or hit first) Plus if you have never hit a human you might not deliver anything devastating (the human body is different than a bag).
I am an advocate for all sport fighting, I just feel very strongly that a strong influx of MMA at this time in history should not preclude other venues (i for one love boxing as well as several other venues Kumite, etc.)
[QUOTE=xmma;752564]then what lineages of what styles of kung-fu are known, have reps of doing san shou? is it really as random as you’re making it seem? or are there lineages in different styles that have a reputation for competing in san shou?[/QUOTE]
Completely random.
Sifu Darkfist is speaking about his lineage. But there are plenty of other “Wu-Tan” lineages out there that do not compete at all.
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;752571]Completely random.
Sifu Darkfist is speaking about his lineage. But there are plenty of other “Wu-Tan” lineages out there that do not compete at all.[/QUOTE]
of course theres gonna be those who do and don’t. what styles have more with lineages that do? example: are there folks who enter the san shou arena with a certain monkey kung-fu lineage? if there are, how does that compare proportionately to folks who enter the san shou arena with a certain wing chun lineage?
Modern wushu schools produce the most fighters.
[QUOTE=xmma;752579]of course theres gonna be those who do and don’t. what styles have more with lineages that do? example: are there folks who enter the san shou arena with a certain monkey kung-fu lineage? if there are, how does that compare proportionately to folks who enter the san shou arena with a certain wing chun lineage?[/QUOTE]
Sorry, bro. It don’t work that way.
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;752582]Sorry, bro. It don’t work that way.[/QUOTE]
that means every style has a lineage that competes in san shou. i don’t see that.
[QUOTE=Sifu Darkfist;752568]WuTang’s background in protection of people as well as military, and the old challenges historical with Figures such as GGM Li Shu Wen.
[/QUOTE]
I’ve said it before, TCMA people need to learn that just because your ancestors were fighters doesn’t mean you are. You are only as good as what you are doing TODAY. Lama Pai doesn’t rest on what Wong Yan Lam did 100 years ago.
i have never seen wing chun people do san shou. the concepts are differnent. as for lineages that do san shou i think it was already stated it doesnt go by lineage it goes by school. some schools teach san shou some don’t. the only style i have ever seen that does san shou with a great deal of consistancy is jow ga. there may be jow schools that choose not to fight san shou and use the traditional stances or whatever but i have not seen them. otherwise i have seen some hung gar schools that do and some that don’t, some choy li fut that do and some that don’t. its abotu the school.