Re: If anyone here on the KUNGFU magazine forum actually pactice kungfu, chinese TMA, tha
Originally posted by Oso
FTR, I go to my meathead meeting right after my secret society meeting…but it’s hell keeping he hand signs straight.
LOL!
Why is this thread/discussion any different than any other one about the same thing?
no debate will ever settle this silly argument.
strap 'em on and step in with what you got and hopefully learn something in the process…
…ok, I think I’m merging into ‘old and crabby’.
Cheer yourself up and visit my website. Fencing vids. [/pimp]
I am going to resist the urge to post in this thread 
ufc = ***** sport.
There is some kung fu competing in San Shou.
I’m not discussing whether one is better then another, from any angle you want to look at it. It just doesn’t seem like there are a whole lot of KF guys on this forum anymore and I think alot of it is fad following.
I am! I am!
But then again to someone whose definition of traditional isbowing,uniforms,line drills etc. then I’m not.
But I think in a more realistic sense then I am. Wahey!
Becuase although we train tai chi, and fulfill all the requirements of a ‘traditional tai chi school’, we also work strength and conditioning, ring endurance, takedowns etc. so I really don’t feel the need forany MMA training.
It just doesn’t seem like there are a whole lot of KF guys on this forum anymore and I think alot of it is fad following.
as opposed to?.. that’s your call…
Suntzu - the martial arts are as faddish as some other aspects of our society. Back in the 70’s and 80’s it was karate and TKD, before that it was kungfu, now its grappling and “reality fighting”. When kungfu was big it was because of the movies. People wanted to look like that, and fight like they did in those movies.
Karate and TKD started doing large scale competitions and branching out into chains of dojos, then people began to take those.
UFC hit the scene and every decided that grappling and “reality fighting” is the way to go.
There’s even a not so small movement in the “martial arts” community towards for your health type workouts, taichi, some others.
None of these fads really invalidates any of those classes of arts, kungfu, TKD, karate, grappling, all of them can be used effectively in a “real fight”, or in the ring if you just train apropriately, but when I stated on this forum a little over 4 years ago there were quite a few actual kungfu guys on the forum who appeared to be studying traditional arts- buy the way, some people use “traditional” as nearly a bad word on this forum in particular but elsewhere as well, I do not - and suddenly the amount of grappling and “reality based” martial artists sky rocketed over especially the last 2 years.
There are plenty of traditional guys here, R5. They just don’t scream as loud as the modern guys.
Red5angel,
How do you see yourself fitting on that spectrum now? You sound a bit like you did when you first got here. (Please, don’t take that as a criticism. I’m just interested in your line of thinking.)
In a sense, it’s an unfair question. I can’t really imagine how I’d answer it myself.
Stuart B.
Good thread, R5.
I practice a tma. And I fully agree on meeting good fighters and how there doesn’t seem to be much discernable pattern based on style regarding who is good. I know one teacher who is somewhat lame, and one of his students is an amazing fighter. I know some mma guys who aren’t particularly good, and some who are very good. I know a bunch of tai chi people who aren’t inspiring, but I’ve been fortunate to meet six or seven really impressive tai chi exponents.
By the same token, my style is not common, so the topic doesn’t come up much here.
Anyway, anyone who thinks studying style X will make them a good fighter is probably insane, since I’ve heard just about everyone on here gripe about multiple slackers/criers in their classes, and even the suggestion that separate classes be held for them, which means that the slackers/gripers in any style outnumber the serious practitioners, probably in all styles. Which suggests that the style can only do what you do with it.
I think some methods are better used as portions of a curriculum(mainly kicking arts, solely ground arts, solely stand up arts) than whole styles on their own, but aside from that, I think there’s more to choose from than some mma crusaders would like people to choose from.
And since most tma are not exclusively empty hand based, I think there’s room enough for both. I know I made this point before, but I’ll still put a guy with live steel above any unarmed man. Of course, the question then becomes “fencer versus chinese sword stylist”. But that’s complicated, because are we talking competition fencer, or european stylist who has a broader range of knowledge than epee, sabre, and foil, instead including shield and dagger and armoured fighting and all. In which case, there’s several groups that do train that way, again with varying degrees of proficiency, some lame as all hell, some excellent.
There are plenty of traditional guys here, R5. They just don’t scream as loud as the modern guys.
Some anyway!
Ap - as I said before I don’t have a problem with cross training, and if your goal is to compete then it’s necessary. I guess it grows tiring seeing all the arguments. If there has been one consistant truth in my martial experience so far it’s that ultimately most about 98%, martial artists aren’t have as good as they would like to be and not do to humility but lack of will to train hard enough. Of course admittedly most martial artist do it as a hobby so no big deal that’s their perogative. I do get tired of seeing the infighting, internal vs external, reality vs. traditional, grappling vs. striking. It’s such a ridiculous arument when it comes to it. This is mainly why I rarely return to this forum anymore.
ultimately the point of this thread was just to find out who out there is still training traditional martial arts. I find it ironic that a forum called the KUNGFU MAGAZINE FORUM seems to be filled mostly with non kungfu guys.
With the big push for reality based fighting I have now met 6 people who I consider ot be excellent fighters, 2 are grapplers - one studies muy thai as well, 3 are kungfu guys one of those plus another guy also study TKD. these guys are all good. They may not last long in a UFC ring in their current stats but that certainly doen’t make them less effective fighters since there is always going ot be someone else out there better then you.
I agree… MA IS faddish… there is something for everyone… the movie/UFC fan boys… the people I need of someone to follow(worship)… people that like to compete(be it forms or cage fighting)… people that need to protect themselves daily……… maybe over the past couple of years those people found out that “traditional” wasn’t the direction they wanted to go… maybe they are too busy actually doing work at their job to post… i don’t know…
I guess it grows tiring seeing all the arguments.
arguing helps the work day move along a little faster…
I find it ironic that a forum called the KUNGFU MAGAZINE FORUM seems to be filled mostly with non kungfu guys.
that’s by YOUR definition of KUNG FU… now if it said CHINESE MARTIAL ARTS MAGAZINE AND EVERYTHING ELSE GETS THE GASFACE… than i see your point…
I’m not opposing the idea of intermixing, I’m not even saying it’s necessarily a bad thing suntzu, just wondering where they all went?
kungfu guys in the mist…
just wondering where they all went?
they are in some old chinese dudes basement in horse stance and can’t come out to play…
Originally posted by red5angel
Ap - as I said before I don’t have a problem with cross training, and if your goal is to compete then it’s necessary. I guess it grows tiring seeing all the arguments. If there has been one consistant truth in my martial experience so far it’s that ultimately most about 98%, martial artists aren’t have as good as they would like to be and not do to humility but lack of will to train hard enough. Of course admittedly most martial artist do it as a hobby so no big deal that’s their perogative. I do get tired of seeing the infighting, internal vs external, reality vs. traditional, grappling vs. striking. It’s such a ridiculous arument when it comes to it. This is mainly why I rarely return to this forum anymore.
I agree. I get fed up with the arguing as well. And with myself when I contribute to the arguing.
ultimately the point of this thread was just to find out who out there is still training traditional martial arts. I find it ironic that a forum called the KUNGFU MAGAZINE FORUM seems to be filled mostly with non kungfu guys.
Well, I won’t lie to you. This saddens me a bit. I know this is technically supposed to be a kungfu forum. But I’d like to believe that various non-kungfu guys (myself included) add to rather than take away from this forum. So while it may be ironic, I think the bigger tragedy would be (is?) when the number of arguments and trolls outweigh the valuable contributions.
With the big push for reality based fighting I have now met 6 people who I consider ot be excellent fighters, 2 are grapplers - one studies muy thai as well, 3 are kungfu guys one of those plus another guy also study TKD. these guys are all good. They may not last long in a UFC ring in their current stats but that certainly doen’t make them less effective fighters since there is always going ot be someone else out there better then you.
I hear ya.
Stuart B.
I agree. I get fed up with the arguing as well. And with myself when I contribute to the arguing.
yep.
This saddens me a bit. I know this is technically supposed to be a kungfu forum. But I’d like to believe that various non-kungfu guys (myself included) add to rather than take away from this forum. So while it may be ironic, I think the bigger tragedy would be (is?) when the number of arguments and trolls outweigh the valuable contributions.
Absolutely and I thought I would mention it when I posted but just didn’t get around to it. When I began on this forum there was still a pretty good mix of arts out there, and if you scoot over to the other forums you can still find the mythical kungfu guy for sure, and mostly unharrassed. When I started posting here there was a pretty good mix, and the ubiquitous arguing about what is and what is not, but it seems as of late that I have noticed a disturbing trend in the general forum anyway for traditional guys to be attacked for what they practice or believe by packs of those “others”. Some of it’s polite, most of it is borderline, some of it is offensive, all of it comes out of the woodwork when a traditional guy mentions his techniques or training. As a result I have noticed an decreased amount of posting on traditional or CMA type arts.
I think over the last year it has become more a playground then a discussion forum, where most people are just sort of hanging out, some people are competing for post counts, some are bullying others and in general there isn’t as much quality discussion as there once was. This for some reason in my mind has coincided with the increase of “reality” or “grappling” related threads.
You know what I would really like to see, is some discussion and not arguing on martial arts. Instead of telling someone he’s dead wrong or trying to shoot holes in his theories whatever happened to discussing how to translate techniques from forms work, or other traditional methods to real world fighting? What happen to those guys and girls who instead of retreating to another art to cover holes try to find ways to do that within the frame work fo those arts they study? Grappling is a great example, why does one always have to study BJJ to understand grappling?
R5A
Remember when you were harrassing everybody on the Wing Chun forum about your Wing Chun (Dechiara) being the only real and good one?..Then you had that “paradigm” change and you went MMA,at the same times attacking Wing Chun as a whole and now,you are complaining about the low imput from Kung Fu guys on this forum!..