The Bear Hug thread is wandering off into apps for a section of Bung Bo so I thought I would kick off a new thread for this discussion.
At the end of the first run you turn and execute a right kick behind the left leg. First off, anyone have a name for this kick?
lee kam wigs book refers to this technique as rear treasure plucking. Not sure how good of a translation that is.
Its app (in the book) is to take the opponent off balance. I dont think that is very applicable to stand on one leg and put it behind the other to try to take someone who is in a solid bo stance off balance.
Prabably a basic explanation for the book.
Hua lin
What is the app for this in your bung bo?
Do you have another version of bung bo? If so which?
18 elders
still interested in your app for this technique.
Names and applications
The mentioned Technique is called:
Bui Tek Ma - the stance or kick (transl.: Back Kick)
Yam Yong Jeung - the Hand Movement (Positive/Negative Palm - Yin Yang)
Together the technique is named “Rear treasure plucking”.
For the application: First you push aside a coming attack and counter with a palm strike at the same time. While doing so you also kick at the kneecap or to the groin.
It is applicable because of the momentum that you concentrate your opponents attention to your hands. The kick than is quite surprising.
I once applied this move in a sparring session at my opponent while he was avoiding a punch from me with a sidestep. The kick went straight to his groin and some first aid was necessary … I felt really sorry!
Sayloc: off balance you force the opponent with the following move: baak wong ching haak - invitation of the mighty king!
You grap your opponents arm and go back in Ma Bo while applying an armbar and pluck.
rear treasure plucking
Dont you love the names of some techn.! Did you make this one up 46? 
Juz kidden now.
One way:
The kicker applies the kick to shin/knee while slapping either face/chest/stones… at sametime. In a hurry, I`ll be back.
Thanks GBL, I figured the app was something like that. Seems like they had a little trouble trying to get the point across on certain things like that. I am in total agreement with you and yushan on the apps.
GbL
What technique is invitation to a mighty king?
Fascinated with the poetic names for the techniques.
I would be glad to compenstae you for your time for any of these "poetic names out of bung bo.
Yushan, I just make it up as I go!
sayloc
used as GBL has describled, also can apply as a take down
Originally posted by sayloc
[B]
What technique is invitation to a mighty king?
Fascinated with the poetic names for the techniques.
I would be glad to compenstae you for your time for any of these "poetic names out of bung bo.
[/B]
Hi Sayloc,
Baat Wong Ching Haak or Seung Fung Sau (Double-grabbing Hand) is the following technique, when you go back in horse-riding stance.
BTW
Tong Long Bou Sin (Mantis catches the cicarda) = Seung Diu Sau Kwa Fu Bou (3rd technique of bung bo)
Greetings from Germany!
German Mantis
Thank you sir!
I love your country, It is beautiful!
Great topic what about this app?
3rd move, how do you use it?
I notice in alot of the videos posted that this motion is very …how do I say…short… small…almost not there…so what is your app for this?
Is it a full move or just a transitional move?
.
White monkey if I’m thinking of the same tactic, I concider it the second move in the set though, after the LH block RH punch in the cat stance. Well here is one ap.
The opponent throws a left right punch combination. You slap with your RH at his Lwrist, your LH wedges from underneath. (That is the first motion that is done almost at the same time, it starts the figure eight motion you see). Then comes his RH punch, after you LH wedge (this is where the second part of the figure 8 motion comes in) you circle your R arm over and grab is R wrist, your left arm circles over and at the same time your body steps back into a cat stance and you execute an arm bar with your left arm attacking his right elbow.
hope this helps.
sayloc
Wah Lum does the move the same as the Pong Lai Bung Bo so the app would be pretty much the same as yu shan and GBL mentioned. I guess you guys are better with the kick than I am. My foot doesn’t get very high (ruling out groin attack) or very far with any amount of power (lead leg needs to be very close which is why I see it used against Chut Sing Ma). I also feel awkward and don’t like exposing my back like that unless I continue all the way around. Seems to me if you can reach the groin he’s so close the hands are past the target.
Sorry I don’t have a definite answer but I haven’t learned Big Mantis (Wah Lum’s Bung Bo) yet. For some reason the core mantis sets are at the higher levels of Wah Lum.
GBL
Thanks for the technical info. Rear Treasure Plucking sounds like a groin shot to me.
Is the LH block and RH punch counted as one move or two?
Thanks shirkers1, but thats not the move, thats move #2 .
The move after that with the left palm strike,#3, with the hoping step, before move #4, the forward right hand punch?
How do you use it ?
Is it a full move or just a transitional move?
What is your target when used?
Why the step?
The 3rd move is a palm strike to the chest.
It is a full move. After move No. 2, use the left back hand to push away (outer) a right hand slap or grap of the opponent and then stomp up to deliver the chest strike with the same hand.
The stompping is like a re-coil, to harvest all our energy and deliver it through the palm.
Hualin,
Do you train in Pong lai also or know their bung bo? Do they teach the 7 star bung bo? I have read on the forum of a laiyang and a yantai bung bo. Is it one of them?
Tha master of that system seems to have done some very extensive training. I like the fact that you can see all of the masters teachers on the web site. Looks very indepth.
Like to learn some of that some day.
Do a forum search on your big mantis. I can remember reading some very in depth info on that here.
oops
sorry white monkey for some reason I was thinking of gbl’s 3rd move and that stuck.
I think of it as a sticky hand motion, trapping down on the opponents right hand/arm with your left hand. As you step through you block with your LH to his RH attack and you punch to the chest area. All the while eating up his ground.
I’ve seen the first hand motion as an outward block then cross over to the right side to block the opponents LH as you step through to the punch as well. Just depends on your teacher I guess.
If you look at my bung bo video you can see the rolling sticky hands I’m speaking of.
Hua Lin: its one move.
WhiteMonkey: I agree with Mantis Cool on that. He described it very good. I often teach that move without blocking, because in move two (the Tong Long Bou Sin - Mantis Catches Cicada) you catch the opponents arm and follow him while he was retreating. Not necessarly a new block is to make, but of course could.
The palm strike must be powerful and main target is the chest. But also you could attack the face.
It´s not only a transitional move!!! It´s a full move and must be performed like one (in both roads!).
So what is your application for the three techniques after Ba Wong Ching Haak (Double grabbing hand in Ma Bo)?
I mean:
Dang San Bo - Diu Sau followed by Pek Cheui (Bow Stance with Mantis Hand and Chop)
Dang San Bo - Au Lau Choi (Hook Grapple Pluck)
Step - Kwa Fu Bo - Siu Fan Che Cheui (Step in Tiger Riding Stance - Little Turning Wheel Punch)
sayloc
I don’t train in Pong Lai which is why I defer to yu shan or 18elders to explain what they have. I have seen some of it though on video and in person. Believe it or not we get along fine offline. They have multiple lineages but I believe they do the 7 Star version.
I think the Big Mantis thread you refer to was the analysis of it as a version of Bung Bo (Mantis108 and Tainan Mantis).
GBL
Thanks. Counting moves confuses me. There doesn’t seem to be any standard. At a Bagua seminar in China the teacher’s idea of a move was a long (very long) string of movements. To others it’s one block or one punch.
I believe WL Bung Bo is different after the double grabbing hands so the only ones that can comment on that are yu shan and 18elders.
I’m working on getting Big Mantis and Bung Bo so I’ll have more input later.
By the way I wasn’t implying that what I said before was the only way. Lately that’s how I’ve been playing it, because I like the stickiness of attaching to the limb and striking with the same hand. I would rather punch then do a cutting palm strike to a hard target like the head or chest but that’s what the form calls for so I see it played both ways.
Hua Lin Laoshi
Appreciate this thread, Beng Bu is an awesome form. IMO, a person could easily spend years on getting all the benefits BB has to offer. Also thanks for asking my opinion/view on this move in BB. I totally agree with MantisCool with his explanation on move #3. I might add, this block we do with our left (followed by attack to chest) we do as a quick parry combined with the recoil stomp going after the opposing force.. kind of fast if ya know what I mean. This whole road is done quickly, JMO. Look forward to hearing more about BB. And yes ours is 7*, but has Master Shrs flavor. If Tainan Mantis is out there, I really would like to know who taught this form to your Shifu, and laiyang or yantai? BTW, HLL Im brushing off the moth balls with Big Mantis, this form is toooo nice not to share, plus I`ll be the only kid on the block who knows it. 
New years resolution… going to put more soft warm fuzzies in my posting.
MantisCool
Thoughts and Prayers to you Sir and your countrymen.
Originally posted by GermanMantis
[B]Hi Sayloc,
Baat Wong Ching Haak or Seung Fung Sau (Double-grabbing Hand) is the following technique, when you go back in horse-riding stance.
[/B]
GBL and GM,
In the WHF lineage, the two instances of “ma bo seung fung sao” have different names. “Baa Wong Chang Haak” is the name of the second of the two which is #16 in the WHF Bung Bo book. The first one, #10, which follows the “bui hou chui bo” technique is known as “suen sao heen yeurng” - “conveniently capturing the sheep”.
The names are different because the action leading up to them are different. In the first one, after the low back kick, you are stepping down from the kick and so you use that momentum to pull the person in hence the “suen sao” - conveniently. In the second, you are stepping back from a right bow stance. This is a power move requiring you to pull the person forward as you step back. The names give a lot as to the intention and flavor of the movements even though they individually make look the same.
YM