I’m glad the century old workout routine is working for that guy.
Wow… just wow.
Yeah, if I started working out with four pound dumbbells exclusively, I’d most likely never get injured. I’d also never experience any real strength building benifits either. Now if endurance is your goal… well that’s another story. Anyone here remember “Heavy Hands” exercises?
I couldn’t read the article. It hurt too much. I got not much further than “My friend was lifting using a system of heavy weights for low reps. For example, he would press 50% of his body weight five times …” 
I skimmed the rest, but even that hurt.
I expect nothing less from you Andy62.
Well I’m glad I’m not the only one who notices. Andy, why, oh why do you insist on posting such obviously incorrect information? I gather that you’re not trying to troll, like most people who purposely post stuff like this, but if you’ve really been training with these methods for years, you already know it’s just hype. Why do you keep posting articles written by charletans and hucksters from the 1890’s? Do you think if people start believeing you it’ll somehow negate your lack of results? I honestly don’t get it.
I got bored after the second word in that article. I scrolled down and saw a pic, tho. Can I have the Cliff’s Notes?
Dude was sucking in his gut.
Originally posted by IronFist
Can I have the Cliff’s Notes?
Fuck you’re lazy.
Heavy lifting:
(i) is dangerous. You’ll hurt yourself because concentrating while lifting is hard.
(ii) makes you less flexible.
(iii) is useless for MAs.
(iv) will cause muscular imbalance.
(v) causes loss of endurance.
(vi) is boring.
(vii) won’t give you “moving strength” like “Zen Judo, Aikido and Shotokan Karate” will.
(viii) will exacerbate imbalance due to defects or injury.
His advice: use 4lb dumbbells. When you get really good, progress to 5lb. You’ll get really strong and be most excellent at MA. You’ll solve all 8 of the shortcomings of heavy lifting, and you won’t have to lift heavy like his friend, who is so strong he benches 50% of his own bodyweight.
The article is so incorrect it makes me cry.
I think we have a lot of mind locked people here. Try new things- open your minds. Weights are right for a lot of people,but maybe not for you -see what works. Many martial artist including Renzo Gracie do not recommend weights. Be creative,-be strong, have the courage to leave the crowd-your strength is in your mind.
All 8 of the guy’s points are myths perpetuated by people like you.
[B]Heavy lifting:
(i) is dangerous. You’ll hurt yourself because concentrating while lifting is hard.
(ii) makes you less flexible.
(iii) is useless for MAs.
(iv) will cause muscular imbalance.
(v) causes loss of endurance.
(vi) is boring.
(vii) won’t give you “moving strength” like “Zen Judo, Aikido and Shotokan Karate” will.
(viii) will exacerbate imbalance due to defects or injury.[/B]
(i) if you have the attention-span of a goldfish. Driving a car is dangerous if you don’t concentrate too.
(ii) if you don’t stretch, sure. If you do stretch like you should, no problem. If you don’t lift and don’t stretch, you’ll be inflexible too.
(iii) strength is useless? Right.
(iv) if you only bench. OTOH if you bench, squat, deadlift, Olympic lift, etc you’ll end up as balanced as you want. Tailor your routine to how you want to perform/look.
(v) sure. Not doing endurance will cause loss of endurance. Look at Ironfist. But doing strength with endurance on the side won’t cause loss of endurance. OTOH doing endurance while not doing strength will cause loss of strength.
(vi) opinion.
(vii) whatever.
(viii) why? use dumbbells or one-handed/legged lifts if you want to focus on one area.
Sooo much crap in that article. As I said earlier, I expect nothing less from you.
As to your Renzo comment, :rolleyes: I addressed that yesterday or the day before didn’t I?
Originally posted by Andy62
Many martial artist including Renzo Gracie do not recommend weights. Be creative,-be strong, have the courage to leave the crowd-your strength is in your mind.
Please stop saying this. I already posted proof that Renzo lifts weights regularly. Having personally trained with him, I’ve also heard this info first hand.
Being open-minded is one thing. I think you’d find that a lot of us have incorporated or still incorporate a wide variety of methods in our training and see usefullness even in those that we don’t use. Listenning to obviously bad information is another thing. What your posting is akin to articles about how the world is really flat.
That is not true. I am not saying that Renzo Gracie has never lifted weights,but that in not what he says is the most important type of training.
“Mastering Jujitsu” by Renzo Gracie page 209, “It makes perfect sense, to think of exercise that involves the movement of your own bodyweight [and to a lesser degree, that of your opponenet’s] as the most important form of conditioning for the MMA fighter. Thus it is calisthenics[exercises that involve the movement of your own body weight] that has consistantly proven to be the most important form of conditioning for the jujitsu fighter. Always remember : if you gain weight, you have to carry that extra weight as you move during the course of the fight, with the result you will tire more quickly.”
Not what he told me and not what he said in an interview. It was in a book that was most likely written for him based off his dicatations… Big deal. Yeah. We’re the oned with the closed minds… lol!
where in that quote of renzo did he advocate not using weights, as your quotes allege? the quote simply states that doing calisthenics was the best way to do it. i question whether or not the intention of this quote has come across properly, as most people who would read a book by renzo are going to be recreational martial artists. most people who train with renzo are the ones to whom he’d give advice that would make them a notch above the basic, recreational stylists.
and to address his line about weights, i’ll offer a question to some other forumites:
Ford: how much weight have you gained when on PTP?
Iron: how much weight have you gained when on PTP?
Toby: how much weight have you gained when on PTP?
Jack: how much weight have you gained when on PTP?
LOL
"..After my morning session of Strongfortism, I feel (and look) much more limber than before. "
huh? how do you LOOK more flexible?
LOOK everybody!! it’s REED RICHARDS!!
:rolleyes:
yo–if you wanna do this, then fine–some exersice is better than none
i guess
Different strokes for different folks!
Originally posted by Andy62
[B]That is not true. I am not saying that Renzo Gracie has never lifted weights,but that in not what he says is the most important type of training.
“Mastering Jujitsu” by Renzo Gracie page 209, “It makes perfect sense, to think of exercise that involves the movement of your own bodyweight [and to a lesser degree, that of your opponenet’s] as the most important form of conditioning for the MMA fighter. Thus it is calisthenics[exercises that involve the movement of your own body weight] that has consistantly proven to be the most important form of conditioning for the jujitsu fighter. Always remember : if you gain weight, you have to carry that extra weight as you move during the course of the fight, with the result you will tire more quickly.” [/B]
Does anybody else notice how this excerpt is talking about the most important form of conditioning?
Conditioning isn’t strength. They are two separate things.
Conditioning for fighting is an overall process that gets you in good fighting shape. This involves not just strength but also stamina / endurance.
Pure strength training is just that. Stuff to get you stronger. Renzo could advocate that the best way to CONDITION yourself for fighting is to do bodyweight exercises, but that has nothing to do with Renzo being against weightlifting.
Good point, Reggie. Like BWE circuits to replicate in fight conditions.
I guess we are getting into sematics,but to me conditioning means the whole process[strength, endurance, timing,flexibility etc] Stuff flys over the internet and in casual conversations,but when someone publishes a statement in a copyrighted book that is widely distributed he takes ownereship of that statement and it is his responsibility to see it is correct. I think there is some clintonesque type squirming here trying the fit the statemnet into the belief structure.
I agree weights are the preferred method of training for top athletes in most sports,but not for everybody. All I am trying to show is some flexibility. Here is another to MMA competitor that uses bodyweight:
Fedor Emelianenko (Pride Heavyweight Champ) did a 2 hour online interview the other day and he says he doesn’t like weights but only uses his own bodyweight and the resistance offered by partners in wrestling practice.
Q: Is it true that you don’t use weights in your training (weightlifting)?
A: Yes, that’s truth.
Q: Which is the best strength training?
A: With an opponent and with your own body.
fact of the matter is, these are exceptions to the standard. the vast majority of professional athletes use weights as an integral part their training. using only body weight will get you results, but for maximum results, you have to go beyond body weight. since most want the best results they can get, and they consider the financial obligation and additional focus on safety to be negligible, particularly when held in contrast to the benefits of weights, the wind naturally pushes the cat-tail toward the gym.