[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;1181859]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCliek3Oqy4[/QUOTE]
oh thx man
I like a form that’s connected by a set of drills.
- You repeat drill 1 several times.
- You then turn around and repeat drill 2 several times.
- …
I think people just shouldn’t do sucky forms.
[QUOTE=TenTigers;1181864]I think people just shouldn’t do sucky forms.[/QUOTE]
I am beginning to have issues with this “common sense”, “logic” and “understanding” view points you have.
There is no place for that kind of crap in kung fu !!!
There is no place for that kind of crap in kung fu !!!
no free thinking! the way is kungarate~!
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1181850]I don’t understand why people don’t just train solo drills (when they don’t have training partner)? A simple drill such as
- hammer fist,
- groin kick,
- face punch,
If you repeat this combo 20 times, it’s just like a form with 60 moves.
To only repeat any technique 1 time in form training can hardly develop any “muscle memory”.[/QUOTE]
Do you know many chinese traditional styles that neglect jibengong in favor of forms training? You have to train both. Firstly be good at the jibengongs, danxiang lianxi etc.. Sure. But then it is not the same to do 60 hammer fists in a row (especially when you already do it correctly) as when you do one hammerfist within a form, weaved between two other, challenging in terms of body work, movements and cannot repeat it if it goes not so well. Different thing. Forms are not the essence of cma, but should be trained imo. As hskwarrior said, you can tell a lot by just watching a form done.
[QUOTE=taaigihk;1181868]Forms are not the essence of cma, but should be trained imo. [/QUOTE]
Disagree!
Form is for “teaching” and “learning” only. It’s not for “training”.
Forms when demoed either display physical ability or the distinct lack of it. They are a viable method to demonstrate what you offer as a school.
Weapons especially! Who doesn’t love a sword form, full blast? Who?
I sure do. I also appreciate when forms are done solid and well by a practitioner.
I appreciate a good boxer shadowboxing. It’s music in motion after all.
Besides, kung fu demo are often a lot more than forms demos. Usually there is a good lion dance, some fan dance as well and then some forms, a two man set, some weapons, two man weapons and so on.
Most Tradition Chinese Martial Art or Kung Fu uses forms to teach and learn. That’s life, get over it. 
Some forms are not designed for training. I had created a form that the 1st 13 moves are 13 standing training postures. The purpose is trying to help my students to remember those 13 different standing postures. The order among those 13 ZZ postures is not important. One should not train this form “from the 1st move to the last move”. He should try to hold any individual posture as long as he can. The order is not important.
Form is for “teaching” and “learning” only. It’s not for “training”.
blasting through your forms full blast and cleanly is GREAT cardio.
music in motion or a train wreck?
reitirating the original post
I’m not saying forms or forms training is bad - like my sig says, I like forms.
What I’m saying is that solo empty hand routines are a bad way to demonstrate kung fu to the general public. IMO I say we need to think about how we demo TCMA to the world.
Why is he wearing a badge? Is he a cop?
[QUOTE=MightyB;1181877] solo empty hand routines are a bad way to demonstrate kung fu to the general public.[/QUOTE]
To show “ability” is better than to show “technique”. The following demo may be fun to watch:
- touch your elbow to you toes (show flexibility),
- stand on one leg and go up and down (show balance, leg strength),
- jump in the air and throw 3 punches before feet land back down (show speed),
- drop into a perfect floor split,
- do a 360 degree floor sweep followed by a tornado kick in the air, and
- end with “5 phoenix flying in the air - jumping double kicks, jumping back heel kick, jumping crescent kick” (show you can fly),
- finally, pick up a dumb bell and start to hit on your own head (show you are crazy, don’t mess with you).
Just a short demo sequence that audience can easily see it can’t be done without training.
What I’m saying is that solo empty hand routines are a bad way to demonstrate kung fu to the general public. IMO I say we need to think about how we demo TCMA to the world.
i don’t think so. a solo hand form can determine by the viewer if the performer has any skill i.e. balance, fluidity, aggression, power, concentration, focus, intent and so on. does this leave the viewer clueless because there weren’t two individuals up there fighting? sure. they have no idea of what their watching in most cases.
i agree a mixture of form, applications or weapons would be great to watch. but as a teacher, i don’t want my students giving up all our goodies for others to just pocket. so a simple gung fu demo is sufficient for public demo’s..
david…he was a cop. he makes all his students wear a badge and learn to dance like him. hahahahaha…the badge is related to their ranks
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1181869]Disagree!
Form is for “teaching” and “learning” only. It’s not for “training”.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know, maybe it’s the language thing.. You mean to say forms, are merely a tool in process of learning? If so, I agree with you. 
[QUOTE=hskwarrior;1181872]blasting through your forms full blast and cleanly is GREAT cardio.
music in motion or a train wreck?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjaCAbhOOHE[/QUOTE]
So horrible
[QUOTE=MightyB;1181877]I’m not saying forms or forms training is bad - like my sig says, I like forms.
What I’m saying is that solo empty hand routines are a bad way to demonstrate kung fu to the general public. IMO I say we need to think about how we demo TCMA to the world.[/QUOTE]
If that’s the case, then you’re missing the point.
ok, here’s how it all went down;
a gazillion years ago, when TCMAists were fighting for their lives and trained their soldiers for combat, did they do forms, or drills, drills, drills,conditioning and fighting?
Answer? Drills, drills, drills, etc.
Fast forward a bunch’a years-people are overthrowing the Chings and training in secret, etc.
Ok, so did they practice forms, or drills, drills, drills, etc.?
Answer?-Drills, drills, drills, etc.
ok, Fast forward another bunch’a years, and nobody’s fighting. Instead, all the teachers are trying to eek out a living from their Martial Art.
So..they start doing demos, to show off their skillz and lure, oops, I meant attract students to their school.
What do you show? A bunch of sweaty guys doing conditioning, and beating the bejeezus out of each other, or the Cool Tiger/Crane set?
And..how do you attract people to YOUR school instead of Master Lee’s school down the street?
“We do the Drunken Fist!”
“Well, WE do the Monkey Fist!”
And so it went.
Originally, forms (the textbook)were only taught to lineage bearers who were chosen to pass on the system.
Students don’t need the textbook-they have it right there. Their Sifu.
Only NOW, forms are taught to all the students as part of the curriculum.
NOW, we teach forms to maintain interest and enrollment.
*I am speaking only of textbook/kuen-faht type forms.
my next post will contradict all of this…sort of.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1181869]Disagree!
Form is for “teaching” and “learning” only. It’s not for “training”.[/QUOTE]
If that’s the case, then you’re missing the point.
In most systems, forms are divided into two categories;
Developmental/Gung-Faht and textbook/techniques/Kuen-Faht
Gung-Faht/developmental forms are exactly that-training stance, structure, power generation, breath. They develop ‘the Gung-Fu body.’
ok, my mistake. There is a third category, more of a recent development, and that is the demo form, purely performance.
This is how I train my body method in my Taiji system.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s3Cbt2Hsjo
()
The XingyYi system has different method for
- training,
- combat, and
- performance.
Today people use combat method for training, and use performance method for combat. Those are the major mistake.
what do you guys think about this taiji video?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=sw3Fyf133qo