[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;847683]One more piece falls into place…[/QUOTE]
I think I previously mentioned it on TMA in a similar thread…
Facts for iron training are hard to reproduce on the INTERNET.
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Very little scientific studies have been done. SJ told of his personal study, referenced the facts involved.
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Most facts about iron training will be seen in person, by a master of the method, or by yourself.
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The internet is a pretty horrible place to start asking for iron training facts.
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Real life is the place to seek answers if you are really curious.
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;847746]Not sure how you found out about my past in the circus… [/quote]
What made you think it wasn’t obvious? 
But I can say that after starting IP I have been more “heavy handed” on my sparring partners when demoing stuff, giving them bruises on their arms and bodies from what I though were “love taps” IE: Shard enough to work, not hard enough to leave a mark.
the reason is assume is because of the combination of being more “dead handed” and what Baxierboxer wrote.
“Heavy handed” is a “good description” as far as it goes.
My own teachers look down on a “dead hand”…
[QUOTE=Lucas;847758]Facts for iron training are hard to reproduce on the INTERNET.
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Very little scientific studies have been done. SJ told of his personal study, referenced the facts involved.
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Most facts about iron training will be seen in person, by a master of the method, or by yourself.
-
The internet is a pretty horrible place to start asking for iron training facts.
-
Real life is the place to seek answers if you are really curious.[/QUOTE]
I have noticed that, and this isn’t a slight on you Black jack, modern sport MA tend to disavow things from TMA simply because they are Traditional.
Not very “progressive” or “critical” of them.
They have no issues in going to a BJJ ( for example) school to test their views, but seem reluctant to do the same for something like IP and perfer to ask about “studies” and “proof” instead od doing the same “hands on research” they apply to modern MA.
After reading all the comments, few quote come to mind:
“Ya never know till you try it”
“Results may vary”
You asked about pros and cons.
Pros too many to list, I’ll stick with the cons.
Cons Finding a reputable teacher with iron palm skills and the right hand medicine then it’s TIME TIME and TIME. For iron palm it takes 20 minutes twice a day for at least one solid year (NOT MISSING A DAY, HERE AND THERE) then you may back off to once a day for another year and then you must keep it up or you’ll loose what you have. That really doesnt seem like a lot but it is.
Iron vest or body you still must find a reputable teacher that has access to the right medicine and again TIME, TIME and MORE TIME. It takes ONE HOUR AND 20 MINUTES, try that every day for a year or two before you can back off.
There are only a handful of people with real iron palm/body capabilities in the entire world and most of them are old men. No one on this board is capable of real iron palm/body, sure they might have scratched the surface and I’m including myself in this catagory. Wanna argue with me that you are an iron palm master then get yourself some 2" patio blocks, DO NOT BAKE THEM OR SCORE THEM, USE NO SPACERS BETWEEN and DO NOT BE A SISSY AND USE A CLOTH DRAPED OVER THEM…IN OTHER WORDS DO NOT CHEAT. Take them right from where you got them, support them on the ends with building concrete blocks and SLAP through them with an open hand. Anyone can slap through 1, I’ve seen guys with no training get through 3 blocks, but after you get up to 4 blocks(and that’s 8" solid) you got a little training. At 6 blocks i’d say you’re on your way to having something that will last, at 8 blocks or more you have REAL IRON PALM.
My point is, in our society today with the hustle and bustle of day to day life even a single guy would find the demands of undertaking such rigoris training programs just too much to complete.
SW
PS: No, I dont want to see any of your youtube videos
[QUOTE=stonewarrior67;847857]
For iron palm it takes 20 minutes twice a day for at least one solid year (NOT MISSING A DAY, HERE AND THERE) then you may back off to once a day for another year and then you must keep it up or you’ll loose what you have. [/QUOTE]
So…what does this mean about the bone-building aspect of this training. Wouldn’t the bones in your trained hand remain harder?
as you get older, you lose calcium from your bones-osteoporosis. Bones, like muscle atrophy when they are not used, so you would have to maintain your training. Theoretically, you have to train harder as you age.
(that sux)
[QUOTE=TenTigers;847908]Theoretically, you have to train harder as you age.
(that sux)[/QUOTE]
Or does it just seems harder due to age? 
This is why energetic development is much better to focus on most of the time than hitting something. Besides, how many times is a block of concrete gonna get up and throw itself at you? I have yet to see it.
RonH,
Agree whole heartily that the bricks wont hit you back. and yes you got to have the skill to deliver a damaging IP strike. If you can crush a mountain of bricks but cant get it from point a to point b then you’ve waisted a lot of time.
The brick thing is to be done once in a while, say twice a year, to gauge yourself so to speak.
SW
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;847533]FYI:
http://www.maniacworld.com/karate-chop-in-slow-motion.html
Goos reason to do IP.[/QUOTE]
Re-quoted for informational purposes.
[QUOTE=Lucas;847758]Facts for iron training are hard to reproduce on the INTERNET.
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Very little scientific studies have been done. SJ told of his personal study, referenced the facts involved.
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Most facts about iron training will be seen in person, by a master of the method, or by yourself.
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The internet is a pretty horrible place to start asking for iron training facts.
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Real life is the place to seek answers if you are really curious.[/QUOTE]
These are all very good points. The only problem is that most people can’t find “real life”. As Stone Warrior said, they’re only a few out there.
[QUOTE=Steve Hamp;848334]These are all very good points. The only problem is that most people can’t find “real life”. As Stone Warrior said, they’re only a few out there.[/QUOTE]
Too true. Unfortunately if someone was really serious about testing iron skills, they would most likely have to travel, and spend some cash.
Kind of a catch 22. The only guys willing to do that are the guys who want to train iron. Not the guys wanting to defraud it.
Lucas, not necessarily true about the travel and money part. There are a few kick ass real deal IP guys in the US that can train you and get you the right medicine without draining you of your life savings. The only testing part is up to you in front of your peers or alone in your basement as I already spelled out in a post or two back. Guys that are the real deal want to spread their knowledge not secrete it. They pretty much show you how it is done and it is up to you what you do with it. It is a long hard journey but one well worth taking.
SW
[QUOTE=Lucas;847758]Facts for iron training are hard to reproduce on the INTERNET.
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Very little scientific studies have been done. SJ told of his personal study, referenced the facts involved. there are plenty of studies on what makes muscle dense and what make bone grow and what will toughen skin. Iron training uses methods taht develop these areas. In other words, tere is loads of scientific support for the toughening of the human corporeal form literally
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Most facts about iron training will be seen in person, by a master of the method, or by yourself. one can surmise a lot about the value of a strong build vs the value of a weak build
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The internet is a pretty horrible place to start asking for iron training facts. not really, the internet is a vehicle and a resource and can be viewed as such. Using it as the final answer for any given query is folly though, I do agree with that sentiment
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Real life is the place to seek answers if you are really curious.In fact, this is the only valid teacher you will ever have imo[/QUOTE]
my comments on this are in bold. These words are metrely to pass the 10 letter thing. 
So, for those of you who have trained IP/IF for a good length of time, how do you feel about beginning your training via internet and video.
Without having to go to a teacher to start.
Anyone know any Iron trainers in Portland OR?
My point being, even to go to another state can be spendy, not to mention the whole having to find a new job and housing deal.
I could see going to a teacher for “updates” and corrections. If this is the case how often should this be done, and should one begin with this or just start at home with the basics.
From what I understand the basics are…well. basic.
[QUOTE=Lucas;848566]So, for those of you who have trained IP/IF for a good length of time, how do you feel about beginning your training via internet and video.
Without having to go to a teacher to start.
Anyone know any Iron trainers in Portland OR?
My point being, even to go to another state can be spendy, not to mention the whole having to find a new job and housing deal.
I could see going to a teacher for “updates” and corrections. If this is the case how often should this be done, and should one begin with this or just start at home with the basics.
From what I understand the basics are…well. basic.[/QUOTE]
IP is not a fine motor skill, can one learn how to skip rope from a DVD ?
Yes, and rope skipping id more “fine motor” than IP.
Its the quality of the instruction that is crucial, the quality of understanding that is vital and a nice balance of common sense.
That and a good product (Jow).
Some people can screw up anything, no matter how well instructed and others need minimal instruction and they seem like they have done it for years.
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;848568]IP is not a fine motor skill, can one learn how to skip rope from a DVD ?
Yes, and rope skipping id more “fine motor” than IP.
Its the quality of the instruction that is crucial, the quality of understanding that is vital and a nice balance of common sense.
That and a good product (Jow).
Some people can screw up anything, no matter how well instructed and others need minimal instruction and they seem like they have done it for years.[/QUOTE]
Got any links to a good place to begin IP/IF?
[QUOTE=Lucas;848569]Got any links to a good place to begin IP/IF?[/QUOTE]
What is IF ?