In Park's defense

Nei Jia: the Qigong and Taijiquan Forum Taijiquan and the Internal Martial Arts
81

BT hates Park’s Pa Kua

I don’t hate, I just tell you my opinion.

BT issues challenge

All I want to do is crosshands, You know do a little Ba Gua Zhang freefighting, test the waters of this great Ba Gua Zhang method you talk so highly of. whats wrong with that.

BT curses.

This is America, who don’t.

BT get’s angry.

Angry I don’t think so. In fact I see you guys are the ones upset and angry. At the same time I find you guys are comical.

Your obsession with Park is unhealthy. Look at how much bad Pa kua is out there. Why do you focus on the good?

If anyone have an obsession with that old Koren man, its your ass. Anyone reading your posts replys can see that $hit.
I only post my opinions (VIEWPOINTS.“) about ParKs System My Veiws have nothing to do with an obsession or being angry, as you trying to make it seem. My opinion is just that, MY OPINION.” The only obsession I have is Real Ba Gua Zhang Teachers, beer and LADYS." So kill all the other Bull$hit you are trying to make up.

If you good , your good. But the only way to find out is someone is good in the martial arts, is to crosshands not be talkative. I can name off of the top of my head, ten of my students that can exhibit some Ba Gua Zhang in freefighting, if someone was to come see me, and wanted to test the waters of what I teach, and they be willing to show them too.

So I don’t see way you guys can’t do the same, if your school is a Fighting school of Ba Gua Zhang as you are claiming.

But Like always people love to talk, nothing wrong with that I guess, After all this is a martial art talk forum where people love to hide behind the P.C. and talk alot of Bull$hit about the internal martial arts, but when its time to show and tell, that when all the excuse and you should be more humble Bull$hit is discuss. Because most practicing the so called internal martial arts, know their full of $hit. Being full of $hit is they way of keeping it real in the so called internal martial arts.

No need to test, just take my word this teacher is the best. I hear this statement all the time.

I myself met many individuals that claim they was all that in chinese boxing, but when I met them they had none of the great skills they was claiming.

So when I met up with other Ba Gua Zhang practitioners. My motto is:

KILL ALL THE TALK, AND LETS CROSS."

I find this method works very well to weed out all the Ba Gua Zhang fakes out there.

82

If one ever ‘finds the time’ to commence this encounter–presumably in a week,year,decade or two,by all means spill your guts.

Of course time like that is hard to come by.After all there must be at least another million or so horses to thrash.

83

Black Taoist

Have you even called up Park bok Nam? he has his number on his website.

i was able to talk with him once when he was giving a seminar in Houston,Tx. im sure he would be willing to speak with you.

                         MRTWS
84

evolutionfist,

Originally posted by EvolutionFist
Actually, a picture can tell a lot soemtimes. In this magazine alone, sometime son the Burt’s offerings or soemthing, many times the photo is displaying a technique where Burt is hitting someone witha stick, but the trained eye can see that his attacker, if really attacking, could just as well reach him. Also, a sharper eye will note he’s holding the stick a good three inches up from the but. An inch is a mile with a weapon.

actually, the sharper eye backfired on you, my friend. not to be incendiary, but a picture can tell you a lot more when you already understand what you’re looking at. whether the picture in question shows good technique or no, i can’t say. but he’s holding the stick a good three inches from the butt for a reason. it’s called ‘punyo.’ the butt of the stick is used for short hammering hits. but more importantly, it’s used to trap and manipulate the opponent’s limbs (which you would be less able to do without the punyo). an inch is a mile with a weapon. but that only helps if you want to be a mile away. if you want to be closer, you’re going to need the capability to control the opponent. and for that, it helps to have the punyo.

as i said, you can tell some things from a picture. but the conclusions drawn will only be as solid as the experience upon which they’re based. i’m not suggesting that your experience is weak. only that it varies from the experience upon which that technique is based. judging it within context and with a similarly experienced eye seems appropriate.

stuart b.

85

Actually, I’m well aware of the difference and why. If you remember we had this discussion a while ago agreed to disagree.

Some people will teach you how to use the butt end of a pistol to beat someone over the head. Is that wrong? I guess not.

I’d rather invest in pulling the trigger. Someone has to get close to use the butt for trapping, or God forbid hitting. By that point, someone’s wrist should me smashed.

But I must admit some ignorance in this department because I am not comfotable fighting with weaponry – yet. That’s just being honest. Hand to hand I’ll fight anyone. When it comes to weapons I’m all ears.

The major point was, in most cases these photos never account for the other guy. He freezes while the “master” does several – allmost always unrealistic – moves.

In another thread today I made mention of a Bruce Lee student in IKF who’s kicking a bag and practically falling backwards. Why would they choose this photo? Terrible form? Zero function with his hands out and down trying to correct his balance. There should be a bar for being published in these magazines, and if there is it needs to be raised. Otherwise it becomes a laughing stock.

86

Originally posted by EvolutionFist
Actually, I’m well aware of the difference and why. If you remember we had this discussion a while ago agreed to disagree.

i don’t remember specifically, but i know you and i have discussed things before. but if it’s a question of you simply disagreeing, then it would have been nice if you’d acknowledged the other side rather than holding it up as a perceived mistake spotted by a keen eye. it’s not a mistake. it’s a deliberate difference noticeable by any eye because it’s not being concealed.

Some people will teach you how to use the butt end of a pistol to beat someone over the head. Is that wrong? I guess not.

I’d rather invest in pulling the trigger. Someone has to get close to use the butt for trapping, or God forbid hitting. By that point, someone’s wrist should me smashed.

But I must admit some ignorance in this department because I am not comfotable fighting with weaponry – yet. That’s just being honest. Hand to hand I’ll fight anyone. When it comes to weapons I’m all ears.

if that’s so, please trust me that the wrist smashing thing isn’t sure fire and that there is a time and place for the punyo (and for pistol whipping too, i suppose).

i fought full-contact stick for several years, including a match with a largo mano fighter who’s tactic was to stay at long range and beat my hands stupid. did it work? well, i won. my hands were killing me, but i won. would that have been different in real life? well, i think we’ve all played out that ‘real life’ argument enough times to know that it’s impossible to say for sure. but based on the most empirical research i could stand to perform, the wrist smash wasn’t sure fire.

The major point was, in most cases these photos never account for the other guy. He freezes while the “master” does several – allmost always unrealistic – moves.

and it’s a sound point. sound enough that it need not be strengthened by false or inaccurate examples. if you knew his rationale for doing that, it only weakens your argument not to say as much. or to use that as an example of bad form knowing full well that it’s an example of differing form.

stuart b.

87

"In this magazine alone, sometime son the Burt’s offerings or soemthing, many times the photo is displaying a technique where Burt is hitting someone witha stick, but the trained eye can see that his attacker, if really attacking, could just as well reach him. "

That was my main point. The hand position was subsequent.

But I have to ask, how were you able to withstand multiple blows to your hand? Were you wearing protective gloves? La cross gloves? Because that would make some sense to me. Who could withstand ONE full power swing from a weapon? And following that logic, who could get so close then to use that last inch instead of the leading 20 inches?

Very dangerous fighting. Not my cup of tea. Too risky. I like to be in a position where I can hit without being hit. Won’t say its wrong though.

Martial arts is not a black and white thing.

Some people pull their punches back. They do it consciously. Train it. I view it as a wasted movement. A withdraw from captured territory. I view any wasted move as the move that get’s you killed. An unnecessary pawn move … checkmate.

So it’s not wrong to pull back the punch. Just that I think (my opinion) that there is a better way, and that’s what I am always looking for.

88

That was my main point. The hand position was subsequent.

and i agreed with your main point. sorry if i didn’t make that clear. my fault.

But I have to ask, how were you able to withstand multiple blows to your hand? Were you wearing protective gloves? La cross gloves? Because that would make some sense to me. Who could withstand ONE full power swing from a weapon?

yeah, exactly. we wore lacross gloves. now, without the gloves, if i just gave you a free shot on my wrist, you’re d*mn right i’d drop my weapon. but anything short of that clean shot and i’m not guaranteeing anything. ‘who could withstand one full power swing from a weapon?’ not me. but then, if i’m moving the target (i.e., my wrist), the odds of you landing that full-power swing are relatively slim.

And following that logic, who could get so close then to use that last inch instead of the leading 20 inches?

actually, if you’re comfortable and skilled there, that last inch is the safest place to be. just like boxing. if i’m a shorter fighter, am i better off being right at the perfect range for lennox lewis’ jab cross combination? or am i better off being in tight, where he’s got to struggle to bring his longer limbs to bear on me? very often, the answer is the latter. same with stickfighting. if the largo mano fighter is perfectly comfortable backstepping and taking long-range swings at my hands, do i want to stay there? no. i want to take it where he’s less comfortable. but only if i have the skills to make that closer range work to my benefit. and part of that process is a familiarity with punyo.

at long range, footwork and speed will get you a long way. but if i get the impression that my opponent has those two things in spades, then i might opt to change the scenario and close range. at that point, sensitivity and control become the order of the day. close-range striking becomes a viable option, especially if the opponent isn’t used to it. and to do either effectively, you need the punyo.

Very dangerous fighting. Not my cup of tea. Too risky. I like to be in a position where I can hit without being hit. Won’t say its wrong though.

well, fighting tends to be a little dangerous. but how are you able to hit without being hit at long range? even with a significant height difference, it only takes some decent footwork and angling to get to you at long range. there’s no such as a position from which you can hit without being hit. not in the overall picture of the combat. perhaps in a freeze-frame instant.

Martial arts is not a black and white thing.

agreed.

Some people pull their punches back. They do it consciously. Train it. I view it as a wasted movement. A withdraw from captured territory. I view any wasted move as the move that get’s you killed. An unnecessary pawn move … checkmate.

well, that’s a big part of the tactics of punyo. don’t flit around at long range doing hit and run. and don’t always stay where he can hit you as readily as you hit him. create your opening, close in, control, and finish it. capture territory. don’t withdraw.

basically, there’s an optimal range for a weapon. if you’re both using that same sort of weapon, then that optimal range is going to be the same for both of you. so if you’re going to avoid taking as good as you give, you’d better be prepared to make the best of another range. if you fade away from optimal range, you’re too far away and you’ve created a null solution. if you close in past that optimal range, you need to be good at close-range stickwork. hence the punyo.

stuart b.

89

Alright, that’s enough of that.

I’ve gotten a few complaints about the tone of this thread. Please tone it down and be civil to each other. No more obscenity. No more potential libelous claims. I don’t want to have to start deleting and banning people just because some one sends a lawyer after me.

Thank you all for your cooperation.

90

Apoweyn, always enjoyable conversing with you becuase it leads to details.:slight_smile:

My reply will show my understanding regarding the main points: how can one hit while not being hit and how to get in on a lewis jab.

I would argue, that for all purposes, you can’t. Well, Mike Tyson couldn’t. He has reach. He’s bigger. If he’s a good fighter he’ll keep you out. You may try to come in, but he’s a good fighter – and he’ll keep you out. Watch the Tyson/Lewis fight.

So then what?

Well, I would offer not to try to fight “capital to capital”. Do not try to rush the jab so you can hit his head, it is very likely to work against you. I do not want to take his blow.

How about instead, offering the head for bait. And when he strikes, simply move the head back a bit and strike his strike. Ifyou are reaching for my head and it it now 6-icnhes out of range (could be more, lean forward, lean back, see how much space) I am safe, you can’t hit me. But I know where you were going and I can reach out and hit your attack.

The better one is with this, the less they move their head. In fact, no need to move the head. Back hand feels your strike, lead hand attacks your bicep. You can’t hit me (reach me) but I can hit you. No one believes it – and I am glad.

Same works with the stick. When you swing, I bet you lead with your hand, your stick following behind like this \ .

Most do. Check those photos. The hand is the target and most lead with it.

There is also some high-tech stuff regarding traingle theory (two sides of a triagle are longer then the remaining side) that my master teaches. But again, my focus at this time is on hand-to-hand. So far though, the principles seam the same.

Have a great day.:slight_smile:

91

Evo

So you’re into attacking them limbs..huh!LOL

It’s kinda funny cause we do the same thing in YKM. One of my favorite moves works like what you described. Opponent (left lead) throws a jab, I(left lead) smash his inner forearm with a soy quil and use the rebound energy to bin choy he’s face/head.

Sorry for the rushed description, but I’m pretty sure you know where I’m coming from.

Take care,
Buby

92

Originally posted by EvolutionFist
Apoweyn, always enjoyable conversing with you becuase it leads to details.:slight_smile:

likewise, my friend. we’re way off topic now, but given the hostility that resulted from the actual topic, perhaps that’s actually for the best. at least something can come of this.

My reply will show my understanding regarding the main points: how can one hit while not being hit and how to get in on a lewis jab.

I would argue, that for all purposes, you can’t. Well, Mike Tyson couldn’t. He has reach. He’s bigger. If he’s a good fighter he’ll keep you out. You may try to come in, but he’s a good fighter – and he’ll keep you out. Watch the Tyson/Lewis fight.

actually, i did watch the tyson/lewis fight. and you’re right. tyson didn’t get in. partially that’s because lewis is very good. and partially that’s because tyson is done.

here’s the thing though: what you suggest about baiting them into jabbing and then attacking the limb is a very viable strategy. and a time-honoured one in both CMA and FMA. i won’t debate that it doesn’t work. but it’s not the only tactic. in the boxing example, if lewis was good enough to keep tyson outside with his jabs, then he has the jabbing skill to make that baiting game an extremely dangerous one for the baiter. i can present my head (knee, hand, etc.) as a target to draw him in, but if he’s actually fast and skillful enough to hit it or something else anyway, then it doesn’t really profit me much.

So then what?

good question. :slight_smile:

another viable tactic is to close distance. from personal experience, it worked on the largo mano guy (though i wish i’d been more skillful at the time and done so more quickly). and when i spar the 6’5" 230-lb. boxer at the gym, the safest place in the world for me to be is right up against him.

Well, I would offer not to try to fight “capital to capital”. Do not try to rush the jab so you can hit his head, it is very likely to work against you. I do not want to take his blow.

well, if you try to rush the same line that the jab is travelling, then yeah, you’re going to end up taking the dirt nap. but if you close smart, then that’s not the same result. in FMA, we do this using our own triangle footwork. (actually, having read your paragraph below, i’m interested in seeing your triangle footwork to see how they compare. i wouldn’t be at all surprised to learn that the filipino footwork was gathered from chinese sources.)

another tactic would be to combine yours and my approaches. bait the jab then follow it back in to close range to tie up.

Same works with the stick. When you swing, I bet you lead with your hand, your stick following behind like this \ .

very astute observation. yeah, the hand leads. well, more accurately, the hand leads in slashing motions. in flicking (witik) or thrusting motions, the weapon leads. that’s my the grandmaster of my primary style (doce pares) advocates flicking motions. wraps around defenses and doesn’t offer the give away you pointed out.

that said, having you point it out to me like that has made the idea seem much more pertinent. and for that, i thank you.

Most do. Check those photos. The hand is the target and most lead with it.

i think we agree on a lot of this. i still maintain that getting closer and controlling the limbs is a very valid tactic, mind you. but that depends largely on the individual’s choices. what they’re comfortable with, where their strengths lie, etc.

Have a great day. :slight_smile:

you too, evolutionfist.

stuart b.

93

Like all martial artists that have been studying for a long time, we run across fakes and wanna be’s all the time. It doesn’t help that there are people that put it on video (not complaining, i wouldn’t remember half my material without them!!). But, because of it, we do get people that think they know a lot, that actually don’t know much at all.

I’ve even had my own occurance reguarding the video thing. My ex senior student decided to buy Sifu Lams 10 Northern videos and then came into class showing me Shaolin 7, acting like he knew it all. He did this becuase he wanted to get his rank faster. He couldn’t get enough knowledge fast enough. But, he still didn’t get much of the point of the form.

Like Gene said one time, he can see a fake that learns from videos. Well, theres others out there that can also see them, including myself. But, its still not a reason for me to go up to them and say “you’re a fake”.

Put yourself in John Do’s position…he’s from Alaska. He doesn’t have a kung fu school to study at, and does a corespondance program for his training. Personally, I think it’s awesome to offer like this. There’s no need for this person to learn 4 forms and open a school just because he thinks he knows kung fu. He should test, practice, learn all, practice more, spend time with the real teacher when he can afford to see him…THEN open his own school.

When it comes to Parks, I have no idea about if it’s real or fake. Mainly because I haven’t seen any of his stuff. But if you know the real stuff, why does it threaten you so much? Guys, it’s not a big deal. Let people be people. There’s always going to be someone out there that you don’t agree with, but you can’t always go around pointing fingers, etc. Put yourself in the OTHER place. What would you think if everyone was saying it about you?

You guys really need to start being civil, and stop the mud slinging. It’s getting old for everyone. The whole point of Martial Arts is to teach humility and humbleness!! Try it!!! :slight_smile:

Jason

94

This turned out to be a worth while conversation. And to think, two people and agree and disagree and no hostility. Can you believe it?

Anyway, the traingle footwork I have seen from friends who study Philipino arts seems very similiar, if not exactly like Wing Chun footwork I learned. I mean, it just kind of makes sense: step out and up and then in: \ and then / against an apponant’s straight right say. But tight.

I falling in love with Hsing-I thought, which goes more like this: ------>.

Anyway, I agree with a lot of what you said, but would add one point to my tactic of “hitting without being hit”. It’s all in how you do it, as in anything else. I remove the timing and speed game.

I take a lead right. Right hand down a bit left hand up in a rear guard. I let the attack come. When it hits the rear guard as I pull head from range, I know its there. Bottom hand shoots up and hits.

Now, that’s the basic. When you do it fast and tight both hands kind of form a shield in front of oneself. It’s striking from a shielded position.

And yes Buby, I know you know what I’m talking about. Of course it propels in further. I like to fight inside. It’s my range of choice. But I like to cut the tree down little by little.

Who was it, Bob Marley? “If you are a BIG tree, I’m a small ax … waiting to cut you down.”

Well, thanks for the ideas and information. I’d like to spend more time on weapons but can’t right now. My hands aren’t to where I would like them to be. Though I broke open my case of Sais and Nunchuks from when I was a kid and had some fun last night.

Why don’t Chinese use the chucks. It’s a flexible stick. I have some ideas I’m playing with. Maybe I’ll ask my master tomorrow.

Peace
Ray

95

Tao of Wushu (Jason)

Originally posted by tao of wushu
[B]Like all martial artists that have been studying for a long time, we run across fakes and wanna be’s all the time. It doesn’t help that there are people that put it on video (not complaining, i wouldn’t remember half my material without them!!). But, because of it, we do get people that think they know a lot, that actually don’t know much at all.

I’ve even had my own occurance reguarding the video thing. My ex senior student decided to buy Sifu Lams 10 Northern videos and then came into class showing me Shaolin 7, acting like he knew it all. He did this becuase he wanted to get his rank faster. He couldn’t get enough knowledge fast enough. But, he still didn’t get much of the point of the form.

Like Gene said one time, he can see a fake that learns from videos. Well, theres others out there that can also see them, including myself. But, its still not a reason for me to go up to them and say “you’re a fake”.

Put yourself in John Do’s position…he’s from Alaska. He doesn’t have a kung fu school to study at, and does a corespondance program for his training. Personally, I think it’s awesome to offer like this. There’s no need for this person to learn 4 forms and open a school just because he thinks he knows kung fu. He should test, practice, learn all, practice more, spend time with the real teacher when he can afford to see him…THEN open his own school.

When it comes to Parks, I have no idea about if it’s real or fake. Mainly because I haven’t seen any of his stuff. But if you know the real stuff, why does it threaten you so much? Guys, it’s not a big deal. Let people be people. There’s always going to be someone out there that you don’t agree with, but you can’t always go around pointing fingers, etc. Put yourself in the OTHER place. What would you think if everyone was saying it about you?

You guys really need to start being civil, and stop the mud slinging. It’s getting old for everyone. The whole point of Martial Arts is to teach humility and humbleness!! Try it!!! :slight_smile:

Jason [/B]

You have both raised some excellent points and brought the thread back on topic. I hope I wasn’t misunderstood here as I was not judging Park one way or the other, except in questioning his marketing approach to martial arts. Personally I thought the thread was a lot more civil than many I have seen here.

My question for you is what is valuable to put out there if you wanted to market yourself to everyone and not just to your own students? The tapes in question are obviously to show the basics of Parks system, which may or may not be useful to his own students. But presented as the “fundamentals of pa kua chang”, the implication is they would be useful to people in general. Maybe you could sell a few more tapes that way, but whether or not they would be useful within another program is questionable. You even mentioned your own student trying to learn from another teachers tapes was not even close to the point. So what would you put on your own tapes that would be worth the price of the tapes to people outside your own system?

As far as your whole point of martial arts teaching humility and humbleness, that’s a debate for another time.:wink:

96

Count-

I personally wouldn’t sell videos EXCEPT to my students. But that’s just me. As far as marketing and stuff of Park…that’s not for ME personally to decide. It’s not important to me that others sell videos to “outsiders”. It’s their gig, and in the end, they’ll either make it, or won’t. Just because someone sells a video and says it’s “real” or not, doesn’t mean anything. Have you personally seen the videos? I have not, so can’t make a sound judgement on if what he’s doing is Morally Ethical or not. I just feel that everyone’s headhunting needs to be tamed!

And as for humility and humbleness being taught in MA…what do you learn??

Jason

97

Originally posted by tao of wushu
Count-

I personally wouldn’t sell videos EXCEPT to my students. But that’s just me. As far as marketing and stuff of Park…that’s not for ME personally to decide. It’s not important to me that others sell videos to “outsiders”. It’s their gig, and in the end, they’ll either make it, or won’t.

That may be true, but as a consumer you certainly have the right to question or criticize anything. Liable is something for a court to decide, but I don’t think anyone in this thread was not being truthful based on their own experience. As far as promoting yourself as a teacher, why wouldn’t sell video’s except to your own students? BTW, when will your website be back up?

Just because someone sells a video and says it’s “real” or not, doesn’t mean anything. Have you personally seen the videos? I have not, so can’t make a sound judgement on if what he’s doing is Morally Ethical or not. I just feel that everyone’s headhunting needs to be tamed!

First of all, I stated in my first post in this thread, I have seen the video’s. However, throughout the entire thread, my questions have been about marketing. Not necessarily about truthfulness in advertising, but the usefulness of the tapes themselves. And to be totally truthful, I didn’t even purchase the video. I only borrowed them.:smiley:

And as for humility and humbleness being taught in MA…what do you learn??

Well, I have always been taught that martial arts is for learning about fighting. As to what you get from that is up to the individuals perceptions and goals. I’m not suggesting “humility and humbleness” is a bad thing. Just that it might not be the main point and certainly a topic for a different debate.:wink:

98

Count-
I’m not arguing the fact that he is or isn’t a fake. I could honestly care less. It doesn’t effect me or my school at all!! That’s why I don’t care! So, why do you care? Does he affect you in any way? Not trying to argue, just honestly curious!

My website will be back up soon. We’re currently trying to get it all done so i can just throw the whole thing up and be done with it!

Jason

99

Originally posted by tao of wushu
Count-
I’m not arguing the fact that he is or isn’t a fake. I could honestly care less. It doesn’t effect me or my school at all!! That’s why I don’t care! So, why do you care? Does he affect you in any way? Not trying to argue, just honestly curious!

Now see, words in a forum sometimes are misunderstood. I’m not arguing that fact either. Nowhere have I stated that I care about anyone. Let’s be clear. My interest is purly from a marketing standpoint. And from martial arts standpoint. Read what I have been asking all along. I question the expenditure involved with producing video’s balanced with returns in terms of profits and results. I have been questioning the gains the students are making and the value to the teacher. I am quite simply asking if I were to make video’s and market them myself, what would be of real value and how could I use them in combination with hands on instuction from a qualified teacher. I entered this topic in the first place to discuss, “In Park’s Defense”, if the tapes he markets work for some, many or all who purchase them. If my words are misunderstood it is either because of my communication skills or the readers comprehension skills. I suggest that might be true of other people here as well. I suggest before people start crying about this thread to the moderator of the forum, they might take a moment and objectivly read some of the facts that were brought out here. It’s only words and opinions on an internet forum.

My website will be back up soon. We’re currently trying to get it all done so i can just throw the whole thing up and be done with it!

Jason
I am an internet developer, which is why I am frequently online here. Is there anything I could help with for your website? A discussion forum maybe?:smiley:

100

OHHHHHHHH, now I understand!!! Sorry, I guess I didn’t get the whole gist of your question! Hmm, personally, if I was to make a video, it would be for our students just for their OWN “notebook”. Many students that I have come across haven’t remembered their sets because they don’t practice every single one of them every day! I’ll only go back over a form so many times! I would sell it in my school so that they could buy it and have it ON hand to go back over when they want/need to! When it comes to the imput/output of the money part of the video, it’s not very worthwhile unless you sell tons of them! I was going to do DVD’s, since most my students have DVD players! Of course, this wouldn’t be for “home studying” only, it would also go along with the classes, and they’d learn the set even before they got the vid!

As for help on my website, I thank you VERY much. For right now though, I think we have most of it covered! And, we do have a discussion forum! You are in fact on it!! www.fu-ragz.com

That’s Wens discussion forum, but we have our own forum down at the bottom under school forums! It’s good for now…most of the students aren’t even on there yet, but soon probably will be!
Thank you though!

Jason