Go to
http://pages.zdnet.com/niwah64/Ba-GuaZhang/id20.html
and read
The Interview part II
He (the blacktaoist) is denigrating Park’ Ba Gua and is ablity as a teacher. What do you think of this?
Guandi
Admittedly, Blacktaoist is a bit brash…
But he often makes some good points. Here, he’s just speaking his opinion and relating what he was told. Big deal.
Park has a lot of students that are part of study groups that only train with him a few times a year. These people will never achieve a high level. If they’re the ones Blacktaoist saw, I understand how they performed poorly. I have nothing against Park personally, as I’ve never trained with him, but It’s his own fault if people see how his students perform and judge him accordingly.
The way of the samurai is in desperateness. Ten men or more cannot kill such a man. Common sense will not accomplish great things. Simply become insane and desperate. - Hagakure
Park Nam students
Guandi,
As you know I don’t even post up here. One of my friends email me your response. Let me set the record straight for you…
I don’t care what people think because I only speak truth not lies. I touch with Park’s so called advanced students. I’m not going by what other people have told me – I’ve touched with his students. I have nothing against Park personally but if he is going to around claiming that other Pa Kua practitioners is not good shouldn’t his students and study groups be good? In his book, he states that most practitioners don’t know how to use Pa Kua effectively. The bottom line is (my opinion as many others but I speak for myself on this topic) Park students don’t have real fighting skills isn’t a student a reflection of his teacher? I’ve seen one of his students on a videotape – Glen Moore – fat and out of shape – the man can barely move. I’ve seen some of his students compete in New Jersey. The worst thing of all I’ve met some of his students from New Jersey. They were nice guys but when it came to skills they didn’t have anything – NO BRIDGE, NO POWER, THEY HAD NOTHING. I’m not trying to start any problems but I’m keeping it real. I have no problem with anyone coming to see me because I don’t talk ****. I can back my **** up believe me. Believe me, I train in Pa Kua for one thing – unrehearsed fighting and I deal with real masters. If we want to really get raw – they are not doing Yin style. Its Pa Kua but its not Yin and that’s a fact. The fact is – most of Park’s students can’t fight. It’s all hype, I want someone from his camp prove me wrong. In fact, he has supposed to have high level students in the NJ and NY area – one guy is supposed be able to shoot 11 palms in one second. I would like to see that.
theblacktaoist
“Keep the Tao real even when it’s controversial”
Dear blacktaoist
>I have nothing against Park personally but if he
>is going to around claiming that other Pa Kua
>practitioners is not good shouldn’t his students
>and study groups be good?
I am on your side with this!
>I’ve seen one of his students on a videotape –
>Glen Moore – fat and out of shape – the man can
>barely move.
I have never seen him move, but I must admit that at least on some pictures I saw, he did not make a good figure – in my opinion.
Have anyone on this board here experienced him – beside his students?
Guandi
Yo Black Taoist…
You might be wrong on this one. The question you need to ask before casting these accustions is simple.
Is Park claiming the students, or are the students claiming Park.
It doesn’t matter how terrible somone is if they are claiming Park as a teacher. He needs to claim them for any of this to be valid.
But then, you probably already know this.
Most actions of men can be explained by observing a pack of dogs. Not wild dogs, just neighborhood dogs who all scurry under the fence on the same night and set off together to reclaim a glimmer of the glory their species possessed before domestication.
Black Taoist
You know BT, I’m not surprised at all…I began bagua only a year ago…I study bagua xingyi, Zhang Zhao Dong lineage…one year is nothing, I consider myself an almost total beginner…but it has always struck me how in the books about Park I would come across it was totally opposite to what my sifu teaches me…I mean, I was looking at the picture and was wondering “isn’t the line broken here?” I could picture my own sifu say “here it is broken, here, too much squatting, weight is not on the right tendon, joints are closed”…I was telling myself that I was nothing so I should shut up, that it was because I was a beginner and didn’t understand everything etc…
Happy to see that I wasn’t totally out of way and that you share these remarks to a certain extent…
Phoenix
Welcome back, Novell. Sounds like you had a very fruitful journey to Beijing. I’m hoping with your new connections you’ll make many more such trips. I’d like to see a lot more attention paid to Yin Fu’s heritage in our country, and you’re bringing back some great material.
You know that some people will be looking at your interview and statements and be thinking it’s all marketing. Truth is, you are marketing . . . to raise the standard of bagua practice and awareness of Yin Fu/Ma Gui’s martial arts. People will be thinking yeah so he went to Beijing for two weeks and now he comes back and casts aspersions on most of the baguazhang in America, including a number of people he’s never actually met or practiced with (like Glen Moore). Well, you sure aren’t shy about stirring up a big pot.
Park made the same kind of wholesale criticisms when he was working up his baguazhang school back in the early 90s, with the help of Dan Miller’s books and videotapes. Your Chinese mentors are doing the same thing, watching videotapes of American practitioners and teachers and making wholesale judgments without actually having seen their teaching or sparred with them. You know full well you can’t credibly judge internal martial arts skills from watching the externals on videotape. You actually have to get out there and see them move in realtime and then mix it up with them. But I guess in building your market you have to try to make use of all the tools available to you, including Internet forums like this.
I’d like to see you succeed in bringing true quality Yin Fu baguazhang to a wider and more dedicated group of practitioners in the U.S. My own thought is that you’ll have more success attracting dedicated students in the long run by focusing on the quality of your own training and emphasizing important points like daily basics practice, rather than slinging **** at all the other bagua traditions and teachers in our country.
People who are serious about learning true martial arts will be intelligent enough to make the comparison. They don’t need to hear a kettle whistling to know your water’s hot (where the hell that metaphor came from I don’t know).
I’m glad you and your group are back. I for one will be paying attention.
From what I see…
I am one of Novell’s students, I have been studying for a little over 2 years and I was there when three of Parks’ students came to check us out. I dont want to turn this into a Park bashing episode cause i don’t know the man, never
met him ect. but Those three students who were claiming to be parks students had a whole lot to say about everything.
One example: Novell was trying to explain to these guys what a “bridge” was and how it is used in combat. The guy was not convinced that it was pratical because he said if someone put their bridge out he was going to pivot and get a better angle to counter attack. Sounds good in theory,
when it came time for homeboy to apply all he had just said he was shocked at the fact he was hemmed up on the bench unable to move any part of his body to pivot and counter attack.
This is what Novell is talking about on a grander scale. These American Pa-Kua Masters will
will talk a good game but when it’s time to apply all that talk, It just don’t come out exactly how they planned.
By the way that day it was three of Parks students and three of Novells students.
We all had less experience in M/A than the people we were paired up against, and from what went down you would have thought it was the other way around. That is no disrespect to those cats They are all nice fellas they were just misled by someone claiming to teach them BaguaZhang.
And for Wuji dude:
“you’ll have more success attracting dedicated students in the long run by focusing on the quality of your own training and emphasizing important points like daily basics practice”
That is all he does.
I must say.
What A Riteous Brotha we have here!!!
Comin from the school of hard knocks,and spoutin ego all over the place… from NY NEWWWWW YORRRKKK!!! what a disrespectful person that has polluted the internal portion of this forum. downing Master park and his students,Pakua is more than fighting bro,or are you so inept at comprehending an art that is a healing art. you know i can agree with you that most practicioners here in this country are not attuned with the fighting aspect..but not all people want to be GANGSTA Pakua MC FLASH AND DASH.
yo bro put yo balls back in yo pants and be internal for a change. :rolleyes:
MAny Respects,Willow Sword
Whatever you think i am or want me to be, i am.
oh and,Jesus loves you, everyone else thinks you are an a$.
The crap some guys do to get attention
BLACKTONGOIST
WHAT A PATETIC LOOSER YOU ARE.
Not only your mouth stinks more than Chinatown garbage but also your attitude and facts.
Those students that you met were NOT master Park,but from one of his instructor.
and so what,they are better than you,I have seen you move and fight and maybe that is SAN SHOU,but PA KUA,LOL,you wish.
When somebody like you that calls himself a "teacher"trashes the level of understanding of students of a Pa Kua System that you have no idea what it is,and you never met the teacher,not only is a shamefull act but also a sign of limitless stupidity.
You pass judgemt on Master Park System and teachings without ever seeing or meeting him in person?,your ignorance is overpowering.
Is not true,Master Park NEVER talk bad about anybodys PA Kua or any other MA,he says CMA is all same family,yes he says the level of skills is low here,and that is for all CMA,but he NEVER said anything bad about any particular teacher or school,if you ask him what does he think about this or that Pa Kua or teacher,he will tell you:
I don’t know that PA Kua System or that MA or teacher to say anything,I can only talk about my PA KUA.
You can BS beginers with your story,but it is SO OVIOUS that you are trying to make a name for yourself by spreading false information and lies about Master Park, his students and other teachers.
If it bothers you so much the skills of Master Park students or instructors,you mention Glen Moore as been too fat,why don’t you show up there in Virgina and taste some of his lard,
Naaahh..you are just barking and not bitting like a little toy dog.
You go to China for two weeks and voila…you found Nirvana,not only that,also a “master” that after seeing and beeing impressed by your dedication and drive, decides to make you his rep here,oohhh!!,how noble,LOL
I can see the picture…
The master, upon seeing BLACKTONGOIST perform,suddenly becomes agitated and starts salivating continuosly, overpowered by the sweet,irresistible dream inducing aroma of US Dollars,says to himself…
(MMMMHH… Here comes another stupid ass**** from America,I think I am going to make some money,yes sir).
Blacktongoist come here,only me and my friends can teach you the REAL thing,the rest forget it,they are not good,after all this is China,how can we teach you crap ,right?,
Yes,but Master just two weeks training and I can start geting students and promoting you?.
Yes,you learn very fast,you have good green power,you very good,I know secret training,trust me.
Thank you master,after all let me tell you something that is been bothering me for a long time.
One of the reasons that I came here ,is because due my big rotten mouth and attitude,after studying MA and PA Kua with many well known teachers in the US,all they showed me is basic stuff,no body want to teach me deep,do you think that if I come here ONCE or TWICE a year,I can learn REAL skills of Pa Kua and become your final disciple,please,please I beg you ,accept me,accept me.
Also,I am deseperatly trying to make a name for myself and believe me,try many things I did…figthing in tournaments,challenging other people(but not always showing up),critisizing other teachers and their students,posting on the internet and many other things that nobody should know,and yet,not many students,not fame,at all,why?,do you think I am a BIG MOUTH with a big EGO master?,
MMMHHHH!!!,right now big mouth and big ego ,are good.
Master, the market is there,think I need a new teacher, a new name,a new line…now if I could represent you perhaps…you and me…and yin fu Pa Kua could…
MMMMMHHH!!!..right!!.
Blacktongoist,since you have a new teacher,change your name,for if you are a taoist ,I am Dong Hai Chuan.
To show you your level of hipocresy, you wrote how much you respected Master Park not long ego and now I guess is not good for business,so here you are,how sad,how low.
My question to you is Why you picked him,there is something here that you are not telling,and I am going to find out.
My condolences to your students and I feel sorry for whoever your teacher is for having a student like you.
And yes,I know you are going to come back barking for a challenge,sure that will make you feel manly,but you know what,for me you don’t even qulify as a spec of dust,and even if I fight you and win,still there is no gain for me.
How can I make you understand?,How can I change your brain if you have none.
VF.
VF.
[This message was edited by virus fist on 08-22-01 at 10:19 PM.]
reply to all this
Yo Wujidude,
First, it was not just the two weeks, we’ve been to china before. In fact 3x prier to this. When we went it was to learn, we didn’t have a lot of money, again we’re from the ghetto. We didn’t go to get our picture taken with the first master we saw and come back to America to make a name off that that bullcrap. Again we went to learn. They liked us and they trust us. Why? Well one reason was because when we were out there we chilled in the Xuan Wu District of Beijing, to everyone else, that’s Beijing’s ghetto. We were in a place that even the Chinese are afraid to go. And had a good time and got mad respect because no forener would dare come there. You think Novell became his US rep with only a 2 week visit? Come on man, or are just trying to impress this image in the minds of the people that frequented this forum?
How do you think that the master came out to teach Novell if he didn‘t know him, we meet the last time we were there. you can’t just walk around and find a master. There are many frauds in Beijing. The deal is you have to be brought to the master. A proper introduction must be made. It killed me that I missed this trip. But I have the footage on tape so it’s all good. And I can go whenever I want to.
As far as marketing goes, what was written was on our sites. Not Kung fu online. It was for our people associated with us. In our community we are the voice of the internal, there is no one else of our level here to teach the truth. We’re not sipping tea and dancing around the circle discussing philosophy. With us we have always kept it real. And we get results. Park can’t say the same.
All of our students at least have some substance. If you don’t like what we put on our sites don’t go there. We don’t have a national publication, we only have our sites and there are millions of sites,
If you come to us then you choose to do that. Which we have no problem but don’t pop **** about what we do or say. It is for us.
And as far as marketing truly goes we don’t have to worry about that, Cream always rises to the top.
Now as far as watching video’s of people that have no skill goes, YES you can tell. I don’t have to touch hands with you to see you have no alignment or root. You don’t have to fight to see someone has no balance or is uncoordinated. We have been martial Artist for years. We didn’t start 2 weeks ago. We’ve learned from the middle aged to the very old. And all of these masters were able to get across to us what they were trying to teach. For a not quit middle aged practitioner not to be able to do what a man 20-25
Years older can do easily is a true testament of the quality of martial arts here in America. We’re here for Ba-Gua, we’ll get paid anyway because we’re teaching the real thing and we have people that expect certain things of us so we really have no choice but to teach the real.
<you’ll have more success attracting dedicated students in the long run by focusing on the <quality of your own training and emphasizing important points like daily basics practice, <rather than slinging **** at all the other bagua traditions and teachers in our country.
First of all we’ve been doing that anyway, as you know, this is how we came on this forum. But the slinging, this needs to be done to expose the frauds and let the population know what’s up.
And we will continue to be as we are.
REAL TO THE CORE
DONâ€T TALK, PRACTICE!
Willow sword
First Ba-Gua is a Martial Art. The healing aspect is a side effect. The scholars are the ones that jumped on that.
2nd, parks students came as martial artist and were dealt with as such.
And what’s with the gangsta crap? we’re fighters. Do you call boxers Gangstas? or what about tai boxers?, how about wrestlers ?
What are you saying, You talk like a wimp trying to be hard with a strong base. It’s a contradiction.
Virus fist
You’ve just made it very clear that you are a student of parks
Oh here we go again. Yo virus, you claim to have seen the Taoist fight and you say it was not ba-gua but maybe san shou. that’s what you saw stupid.
<When somebody like you that calls himself a "teacher†trashes the level of understanding <of students of a Pa Kua System that you have no idea what it is, and you never met the <teacher
BT: if your getting beat up like that I don’t want to know.
Maoshan: What do you mean we don’t know what it is, he claims to be teaching YIN FU BA-GUA ZHANG. That is what we do.
I’ve trained with park twice in the late 80’s He does not teach Yin style. He couldn’t stand with my late sifu Kenny Gong. Your young virus. at least in this art, you better get some real history and stop Hero worshiping.
BT: yo Vagina,
Your just a punk, I’ve seen you before having arguments with people before. If you’ve seen me fight that just goes to prove that you’re a punk.
Maoshan: Yeah why didn’t you make your self known. With all the junk we talk.
BT:You don’t know **** about me. So your words have no substance. As I said before and I’ll say it again. None of Parks students have any skill. Then you have the audacity to say I don’t know what I’m looking at. Oh I know what I’m looking at you don’t know what your learning. basic Xing-I foot work no that’s not correct it’s just bad boxing foot work. Now let me get technical on your None of you people knows anything about push hands how can you be doing ba-gua. without roushou how the hell do you apply the Bagua principles of wrapping, coiling, spiraling, Hooking ,locking, or parrying. Man I was doing Ba-Gua when you were in diapers.Your a disease and you need to die just like your system but pardon me ya’ll don’t even know what lineage your from.
Maoshan: What you don’t understand is that we haven’t paid a dime in so long for any instruction. They give it to us. their payment is our work. Virus you’re a wannabe and that’s all you’ll ever be. I’ve said enough.
BT: the problem is I speak reality I don’t live in a fantasy land thinking that I can hit a melon a and make it soft or say that I can hit someone 30x in a minute. If you believe that, I think you boys need to call†riply’s believe it or not.â€
You can BS beginners with your story, but it is SO OVIOUS that you are trying to make a name for yourself by spreading false information and lies about Master Park, his students and other teachers.
As far as making a name for myself I’m already known I have nothing to prove to you or anybody else. I mean your not putting any money in my pocket. As far as parks students go I have witnesses which you’ve just seen above I have no problem coming over to your NJ school. Because the result would be the same. You talk mad **** virus. Why don’t you step up to the plate. After all you were supposed to have seen me already But I already know who you are. Of course your just like the rest of these guys you changed identities that’s what an internet warrior does. How would you know that they were from the NJ school, that these where students of parks student unless you were the guy in had hemmed up on the bench. Bottom line I don’t need Ba-Gua to fight any of parks students. I put this challenge out to you and your whole bogus ba0-Gua Crew. I’ll fight any of parks students any of them and use straight up san shou on them. Because as I said before e none of you have no real skill. And I know many people who’ve trained with park and said the same thing. It was a waist of their time. If you want to fight Iâ€ll meet you or come to your little NJK school with my crew and we can do this and if you don’t want to do it on this line than e-mail me. Or meet me at the WONG FEI HONG SEP 29 SIFU Cepeda knows me very well.
And as far as slandering other teachersi only slandered fakes.
But you tried to slander my sifu biting of our interview.
One thing I can say about my teacher. They didn’t pay to getthier names on DONG Hai Chuans Tomb because of a big donation he gave. I’ll break you down like I did your classmate 8 immortal
Your other classmate Mike, and your other classmate Mark I know your One of them. All of your schools are wack.
Enough said
I’m not a politician im a fighter. Be a man and step up to the plate.
Maoshan: Alright virus fist what’s it gonna be, we don’t want to talk let’s just make it happen.
But ion truth you really don’t want to go to war the casualties on your side will be quit high.
Maoshan
>How do you think that the master came out to
>teach Novell if he didn‘t know him, we meet the
>last time we were there.
Even if it was the second or maybe the third visit, it is still very, very, short for becoming a representative. Far to short in my opinion.
>If you don’t like what we put on our sites don’t
>go there. We don’t have a national publication,
>we only have our sites and there are millions of
>sites
hey you wrote there not just about your trip but you denigrated all Ba Gua teachers and practioners in america that give everyone the right to step in an comment on what you wrote. Publishing a website is not a national publication it es an internatinal publication.
You wrote that they viewed some Ba Gua tapes and laughed about it about the poor quality. On the other side there is “twardows tom” in bejing who is living (not just for two short weeks) and is studying Ba Gua there and he says that no high level bagua man in bejing has ever heard about your teacher there.
Guandi
TWS,
While I don’t agree entirely about the way BT posts, it’s not cool to make fun of the way someone talks 
also on another board(Shaolin) you insult other styles for having movements that apear to have no fighting aplication. This is despite the fact that Shaolin-Do(your style) is loaded with these type of movements. Now you say the healing aspects are more important than how to fight. What gives?
Ben:
>We’re not sipping tea and dancing around the circle discussing philosophy.<
You don’t serve tea? Damn no way am I going to study with you then.
Listen. We don’t disagree on the importance of diligent training in basics and applications.
I’m with you on the philosophy: yin/yang is the only traditional Chinese philosophical concept that I can consistently apply in bagua practice. “Change” is an awfully vague principle, and one not unique to baguazhang (all good martial artists and arts change and flow with the fighting situation). Zhuan zhang was developed first and foremost as a fighting art; only later in his life did Dong Haichuan (no longer actively fighting or working in Imperial Palace security, growing old in the comfort of one of his senior student’s homes)vaguely suggest some correlation of his art with the Yi Jing and the Eight Trigrams (after he and Yin Fu began taking on some Palace intelligentsia as students).
The healing aspects of baguazhang are secondary to training its martial aspects; you don’t have good health without sound physical conditioning. In the Yin Fu tradition, go to www.traditionalstudies.org or to Jarek Szymanski’s site and read interviews with Xie Peiqi. He clearly states that he learned virtually all of his traditional healing skills NOT from his baguazhang teacher, Men Baozhen, but from another guy who had been connected with the Imperial Family’s physician (who in turn had been a baguazhang student of Yin Fu). The traditional Chinese medicine, like the Yi Jing philosophy, was an overlay onto the original FIGHTING art.
But back at ya. It’s cool to know Novell’s people have gone to Beijing a couple of other times. I hope you find the wherewithal to continue going to study there, AND to bring your teacher(s) over here. I’ve never been to China, and would love to go some time. The fact that somebody else hasn’t heard of your teacher (see Guandi’s post)doesn’t mean anything. Beijing is a huge place; if your teacher is focused on fighting and teaching, not media relations, he’s not going to be widely known; and what matters most is the connection/feeling Novell and crew get when studying with the man. To me it just shows he’s focused on the martial art and teaching it well.
I still say you can’t really judge a person’s internal skill by their external movements. The best internal martial artists I’ve encountered look rather unspectacular, and perhaps even a little sloppy with respect to external parameters like alignment–but their power is unmistakable. I’ve left a teacher who’s a great athlete with excellent alignment, swift sure movement and who just looks beautifully polished on the outside–but is comparatively empty on the inside. I’ve been thrown by a guy who moves in an ordinary way, who’s got decent alignment but no spectacular speed or moves . . . but he’s got the power. He’s one of my teachers now. Compare the two on videotape and you’d be dismissive of the second, just like your teacher was of whoever you showed him tapes of.
I’m kind of surprised Park’s instructor’s students didn’t seem to get Novell’s point about bridging. I know Park teaches getting in on opponents, but maybe doesn’t use the term bridging. I think it’s most likely the guys who came hadn’t practiced or been taught much that way. Hopefully they learned something after Novell jammed them up.
Moore is semiretired from teaching now, from what I understand. I’ve also talked with a couple of people, decent martial artists themselves, who got floored when sparring him. He moved in fast and furiously and left them no room to respond. So, again, looking fat and out-of-shape in a photo can be a little deceiving.
But Ben why even bother with putting down other bagua people? Focus on the positive truth of your experiences, which is that diligent correct training in basics and applications and strategy is what makes Novell’s baguazhang shine.
>And as far as marketing truly goes we don’t have to worry about that, Cream always rises to the top.<
Yeah, but what people perceive from postings by you and Novell so far is a lot of methane gas, not cream. You don’t need to say **** putting down people you haven’t met. That’s negative truth. Let the positive truth of your practice shine a light on what real baguazhang is all about.
Now I’m starting to sound like I’m your mother or something. Sorry. Lecture’s over.
For clarification, Park is on record back in the early 90s putting down baguazhang in America (the irony of history). There was a conference of well-known (I didn’t say “top”) baguazhang teachers to try and establish standards for tournaments and judging. One of my baguazhang teachers was at that conference. Park acted disgusted with all the talking (especially about YiJing philosophy)and left, refusing to participate any further. He basically stated that what he experienced there was not “real” baguazhang and that he didn’t see any real baguazhang in America.
Since then Park has mostly focused (in interviews and articles) on what HE teaches, and what he feels is real baguazhang. He hasn’t needed to express disrespect for other teachers or styles in order to attract students and teach well.
Just a thought.
Let the truth be known
Virus fist, your own teacher Park Nam Bok does not know whom Lu Shui Tien teacher was that could mean only one thing. Park Nam bagua is bogus. Some of you may say, that Park Nam teacher was Li Ching Wu (1864?). This is what Park says in Fundamentals of Pa Kua Chang volume 1 Page 10. There is no Li Ching Wu individual in any of the lineages of Pa Kua Chang. As any Pa Kua historian knows the lineage of Tung Hai Chuan and his top students is well recorded. This so called Li Ching Wu individual does not exist. Park Bok Nam is a fraud and a fantasy. Park needs to call his style the Fundamentals Total Distortion of Yin Style Pa Kua Chang. Park has an audience in America that doesn’t know what they are looking at like your dumb ass Virus Fist. I know I’m hard on other Pa Kua practitioners but one thing I can say about them, it’s my opinion that most people can’t fight but they at least they are trained under well known masters. They are not some gimmick master that doesn’t exist in the Pa Kua Chang lineage. You can roar like a lion but truth is truth. Try to disprove me. Anybody can check the Yin Style lineage, the Cheng style lineage, the Ma style lineage, Sung style lineage, and the Liu style lineage. This so-called master is not in any of these lineages. As far as Tung Hai Chaun lineage–is concerned - Park’s teacher teacher is not in any of his top students lineage. You talk about marketing – you guys wanted to start it, now I’m going to finish it. By the end of this month, I will have a whole lineage section to discredit Park’s claim. Any person will be able to go to my site and will see that this man does not exist. I will have the lineage chart in Mandarin and English. Park system is not even practiced in China. It tells you that his fake Yin style system is alive and well in America. This is it, I will not continue posting back and forth Virus Fist. If my students choose to defend me, that is their decision. But as far as I’m concerned talk is cheap and people are aware of my location just, as your school knows my location. The result will be the same; I will hem your boys up.
Maoshan/ Brad
Maoshan: Pakua taichi and hsingi is what i do as well,and i am of the INTERNAL ASPECT of these systems,fighting and the physical is only on the surface level of these internal arts. you know i could get a hammer and make up a form with it and call it fighting as well as a rock a blade of grass,a basketball,a can o anchovies,all this is surface level crap that you and your teacher are spouting,these systems go deeper than your nuts hang BRO. to disrespect a man who has been doing pakua ALL HIS LIFE shows all of us that what you guys do is just teach more brutality and are on the surface. So you guys are from the ghetto huh?
lets see you do a bridge when a tech 9 pops yo dome brotha man. like i said before you guys better start getting internal with your art, im sure that what you do is all good but the fighting aspect being first and foremost in pakua,YOU are mistaken.
Brad: i dont insult arts that have no fighting techniques i just call them what they are DANCES,PERFORMANCE WUSHU…didnt say that they sucked or were a fake or fraud…did you know that TAi chi and bagua have helped people to reduce some cancers and ailments in thier body? chinese systems are not all about fighting kiddo.
when you get out of your ball shifting stage in your life and start learning the other aspects to those peoples arts and martial arts,youll wake up. OH and about the SD comment braddy :rolleyes:
Many respects,Willow sword
Whatever you think i am or want me to be, i am.
oh and,Jesus loves you, everyone else thinks you are an a$.
Wuji
I dont have beef with Park or anybody else, As far as marketing goes, I dont know where you’re coming from with that line. I’m not out looking for students. People come to me from word of mouth. As far as China is concerned, I’ve been there a few times and have trained with many masters. Going to China doesnt make you a master overnight.
I disagree with you on your video point! From what I’ve seen on Park’s video, Glen Moore and a few others look terrible. Any highly skilled practicioner can tell about another person by looking at their posture and body alignment. Anyone looking at Glen can see he’s not conditioned for fighting. I’m not saying I am a master but unless Glen has skills like Wang Shu Jin, It would be a cold day in hell before he beats me!!!
I’ve touched with some of Parks students and I know people that have also touched with his students. They have all come to the same conclusion: no power, no bridge, and no foot work.
Wuji I have nothing against you, I dont even know you. Many people know where I’m at and I’m not hiding. I can back my sh*t up!. Everyone has their own reasons for getting into Bagua, my reason is for fighting. I have no problem sparring anybody. I am not a fraud, and this isnt marketing! If you think I’m talking crap, look me up. No hard feelings, just keeping it real!
The Black Taoist may be brash and harsh, but I can only respect what he’s doing for Bagua. He’s fighting the biggest problem many traditional martial arts have these days and keeping it real.
Maybe he just hits a bit too close to the mark and gets people pissed off? Well, if so, that’s only good.
Sure, the internal arts (or kungfu in general) maybe about more than fighting, but you can never say they aren’t about fighting too. That’s where they come from, being martial_arts.
It’s nice to debate philosophy and all that, I for one find it interesting, but when it comes to martial arts there is only one way to test it.
Just my few thoughts and respects to the Black Taoist.
TWS: I lose more and more respect for you and your school with each post you make.
Just FYI, watching “Mennace to Society” hasn’t given you quite as much insight on black America as you think. Some of the racial comments you’re making are very base, and insulting to any educated person.
“lets see you do a bridge when a tech 9 pops yo dome brotha man”
Just what the hell is that? Are you seriously that ignorant?
Also, when someone tells me “fighting and the physical is only on the surface level of these internal arts” I become very skeptical of that person’s training. I’m not gonna crack on your school (there are plenty of others on this board for that), but I will say that your attitude is exactly what’s wrong with IMA today.
Dear Wujidude
>The fact that somebody else hasn’t heard of your
>teacher (see Guandi’s post)doesn’t mean anything.
I did not mean with that statement that their teacher is not any good, but that it very is to discredit somebody. tbt is doing this with Park, but their own claims are not better verifyable, too.
Guandi