Fighting from a Horse stance

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Fighting from a Horse stance

[QUOTE=Darthlawyer;1124837]http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61532

I thought this thread was kind of interesting, before the mod got into a PP measuring contest, then locked the thread. Apparently, he’s the only one allowed to have a condescending attitude. So, let’s continue the discussion.

Personally, I think a lot of martial arts end up being defined more by the clothing than by the actual stylistic elements. The same stances, if done wearing silk pjs and frog buttons, vs. a spandex singlet, become different things.

I’ve always wanted to see someone actually fight in an MMA ruleset from a traditional low stance–partially because I’m curious as to what effect it would have on a shooting-in, ground game oriented fighter.[/QUOTE]

Darthlawyer , you can fight in a horse stance if you really want to , but I
would ’ nt , depending on how strong you horse stance is , your attacker can easily sweep you off balance . The horse stance in kung fu for example was mainly used for developing the foundation of the human body . If you practice on your horse whenever you can and consistantly practice it , then as times goes by get together with a partner or a friend , then asked them to try and push you . If you can ’ t move at all then that ’ s progress right there , but if you move then you need to keep on practice .

I would use a short bow and arrow stance to fight my opponent depending on what kind of martial art you ’ re training in . You can shorten the horse stance , to make yourself more movable .

And darthlawyer , you probably not see a low horse stance in a MMA match , today people don ’ t take horse stance seriosly that ’ s why . It ’ s either going to be Muay thai or jujutsu , grappling . Since traditional martial arts uses horse stance ,
ofcoarse I may be wrong , but if you look at other threads topic on this forum , they prefer Muay thai , jujutsu , and grappling . But you never know there might be a MMA fighter who use a traditional horse stance in a match against anybody .
But if you ’ re going to use horse stance in a fight against anybody , then it should be in a way that it can be movable not immovable .

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Bow and arrow isn’t a good read stance, imo, for the same reason a lunge wouldn’t be one in fencing: you have no forward pressure.

Horse is vital for some throws.

A neutral stance is more apt for a ready stance.

All transitional.

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bow stance in application. also keep in mind this is still transitional, this will immediately be followed by footwork, knees, sweep/trip. i just googled ‘clinch’ for this, its image hit #3 looks like the kid on the right is ready to throw a knee to me.

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[QUOTE=Lucas;1126300]bow stance in application.[/QUOTE]
The bow-arrow stance is quite useful in the throwing art.

  • You can use low bow-arrow stance to run your shin bone at your opponent’s leading leg. This will force him to step back.
  • When your opponent sweep or low rounndhouse kicks at your leading leg, if your turn your strong shin bone into it (bow-arrow stance).

Before he lands his leading leg back down, since most of your weight is already on your leading leg, if you use your back leg to hook his standing leg, he will be down.

The bow-arrow stance is the ready posture before you attack with your back leg on your opponent’s single standing leg when the timing is proper.

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[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1126320]The bow-arrow stance is quite useful in the throwing art.

  • You can use low bow-arrow stance to run your shin bone at your opponent’s leading leg. This will force him to step back.
  • When your opponent sweep or low rounndhouse kicks at your leading leg, if your turn your strong shin bone into it (bow-arrow stance).

Before he lands his leading leg back down, since most of your weight is already on your leading leg, if you use your back leg to hook his standing leg, he will be down.

The bow-arrow stance is the ready posture before you attack with your back leg on your opponent’s single standing leg when the timing is proper.[/QUOTE]

I’m not saying it doesn’t have uses, but pre-contact, unless you’re initiating something(which is no longer a ready stance), a more neutral stance is what most people use.

And I love using the bow to drive my shin in!

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[QUOTE=Lucas;1126303][/QUOTE]

Sandals?:smiley:

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[QUOTE=Lucas;1126303][/QUOTE]

They’re not fighting. They just haven’t seen each other in a long time.

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[QUOTE=Taixuquan99;1126335]Sandals?:D[/QUOTE]

They’re just showing how things go down in da str33ts. On concrete in a construction site/alley way. The broken glass and needles are just out of the picture. :stuck_out_tongue:

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Lol!* just noticed the sandals. You guys are a riot

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Here are two example of horse footstep which is four point horse and the half horse:

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Fighting from a Horse stance

[QUOTE=Taixuquan99;1126288]Bow and arrow isn’t a good read stance, imo, for the same reason a lunge wouldn’t be one in fencing: you have no forward pressure.

Horse is vital for some throws.

A neutral stance is more apt for a ready stance.

All transitional.[/QUOTE]

Taxuquan99 , okay if the bow and arrow stance is not good for a ready stance ,
then ? Then what type of stance would you use then ? As for fencing , example if you ’ re in a right stance , and you mentioned forward pressure , what if the rear foot was on the heel part ? You can get power from there , there is one martial art that uses those type of stance , but I ’ ll let you figure it out .

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[QUOTE=Darthlawyer;1125259]The first competitive fighting style I ever really focused on was wrestling in high school (in a very competitive program that was typically close to number 1 in the state). In wrestling, the lowness of a stance was to prevent a quick single leg or double leg takedown. In my kung fu training, we typically practice our forms in lower, deeper stances, but spar from higher stances. I would think that low stances might prevent a striking-oriented fighter from going to the ground against a BJJ or other ground-oriented fighter. Its really hard to shoot-in effectively against a lower stance.[/QUOTE]

True hence in wrestling you see lots of lower stances and the shot has to be low with the knee touching the mat, and you see a lot more ankle picks and low singles, in MMA even the wrestlers stand taller and this is for a reason and its the same reason they hold the arms high and don’t have one down protecting the leg ass you often see in wrestling….in MMA you can kick and punch as well as takedown

low stances open you up to hits, either in the leg because the weights too much on the legs and they are difficult to lift up or move quickly out of the way, or the head because its lower and closer to the opponents arms knees and feet. Low styances allow trhe plum and knees to the head as well.

As for fighting out of the 50/50 stance I was always taught that In wrestling 50/50 stance is for defence mainly aloowing good lateral movements on either side but to actually attack a staggered stance is used, for the reason john mentioned you have to move your leg forward out of a 50/50 stance before you attack, making too many movements

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siping = 50/50, fighting stance

siping ma = 50/50 horse, trainnig stance

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[QUOTE=Lucas;1126300]bow stance in application. also keep in mind this is still transitional, this will immediately be followed by footwork, knees, sweep/trip. i just googled ‘clinch’ for this, its image hit #3 looks like the kid on the right is ready to throw a knee to me.

[/QUOTE]

This is exactly when the guy on the left should change levels, pick that loaded front leg and drop the guy on the right.

Being that the guy on the right has his lead leg in a pulling position (knee behind the toes), if he picks up the back leg to knee he loses all pushing angle and will be dumped.

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ah i see that, good call there.

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ah i see that now, good call there.

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Well, it’s not that it’s wrong… it’s just, at that moment in time, that is the danger. What needs to be protected against. He could pull and circle to disrupt the other then knee, or takedown.

These positions are never static, and when you’re tied up things can change quickly. You’re always fighting for under hooks, positions… it’s a real fun part of the game. And if you understand this aspect of the fight you have a great advantage over others who don’t. You can tie up a bigger man who could hurt you with strikes and tire him out. Back then into an object, etc, etc.

Pummeling is a great drill.

Another drill I love: Have a partner stand with his feet shoulder width apart. Shoot through their legs, come out the back with back straight, clasping the air, turn around, leap frog over the partner and repeat with sets of 10. Better to have two partners and just go back and forth between the two… works shooting mechanics and conditioning.

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[QUOTE=Ray Pina;1126826]This is exactly when the guy on the left should change levels, pick that loaded front leg and drop the guy on the right.

Being that the guy on the right has his lead leg in a pulling position (knee behind the toes), if he picks up the back leg to knee he loses all pushing angle and will be dumped.[/QUOTE]

i wouldnt drop into a single when the opponent can jnee, for me its too dangerous

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[QUOTE=lance;1126605]Taxuquan99 , okay if the bow and arrow stance is not good for a ready stance, then ? Then what type of stance would you use then ?[/quote]

A more centered, natural, neutral stance. In fencing, the lunge is not a position you maintain after the lunge. For striking, really the sme, with a little less urgency.

If you use bow as a ready stance in striking, your opponent pretty much knows your forward momentum is extremely limited, to about a half step, or you must risk switching lead feet in the face of an opponent, which, if you don’t have any sort of grip on them, is a high risk. I could see bow as a ready in some grappling, since any but the most predictable motion requires you control your opponent’s upper body if you are in bow as a ready stance, except grappling really isn’t a range where “ready stance” applies to anything but competition formats.

As for fencing , example if you ’ re in a right stance , and you mentioned forward pressure , what if the rear foot was on the heel part ? You can get power from there ,

Power is only one issue. A ready stance requires mobility.

I’m not familiar with a branch of fencing that considers the lunge a ready stance. Even if the rear foot is on the heel, this only allows a half step further without stepping through and changing leads, that half step has uses, but if your opponent knows you are limited in a direction, and is at all competent, that half step is not likely to be something you’ll get the opportunity to use.

there is one martial art that uses those type of stance , but I ’ ll let you figure it out .

I’m not arguing against the use of bow, I’m saying it’s not a great ready stance, I still think that, but I’m curious what art you say uses the bow as a ready stance. My guess would be branches of kendo where one is trying to draw an attack, but my knowledge of kendo is limited, I do not know that branches of kendo act5ually use bow as a ready stance