Tom ,
i think you hit on something it’s in the energy you give off
i have walked into martial schools and been cool and just worked out with guys
this is something i picked from working with boxers and other ring people
getting in and moving around and feeling the skill level is just as common as a hand shake
never delt with the nut bag trying to get to silly a couple of big ego’s sure and yep you got to zap them and yes they do tend to keep trying to one up you for the rest of time
wow, thank you all for the great suggestions and advice! i wonder if all the opinions will make my choice easier or harder… (on the other hand, i noticed nobody welcomed me to the forum :~( ). i guess my next step will be to actually try the classes and see how it goes!
Originally posted by tallazngrrrl wow, thank you all for the great suggestions and advice! i wonder if all the opinions will make my choice easier or harder… (on the other hand, i noticed nobody welcomed me to the forum :~( ). i guess my next step will be to actually try the classes and see how it goes!
DOH!
For what it’s worth after the fact, welcome (he says, trying to salvage his image and brush up on one of the “good” traditions. :o ).
Originally posted by Ernie
… why would any skilled wing chun person have a problem with a friendly test
i don’t understand
Context— someone coming to your school- right?
Firstly,
If you have the time you can try and sort out the show offs, the hoods and those sincerely trying to figure out what to study and where.
One behavioral response is not appropriate for all.
Secondly- its one thing to compare hands with Ip Bo Ching and then Ip Man in Hong Kong in the early 50s…
and to have a comparison in 2004 in the US no matter how controlled with someone who is not your student, on your property in most states.
Specially without a waiver or insurance that covers visitors.
Unfortunate- but there it is.
Claims of an unwanted touch can cause both civil or criminal complaint - no matter how unwarranted- can cost you.
Originally posted by tallazngrrrl
[B i guess my next step will be to actually try the classes and see how it goes! [/B]
Yes, you’ll get a much better feel for what they offer by trying it on for size yourself. No one can be a better judge of what is right for you than you.
Terence’s concern about the initial difficulties in judging technical and instructional quality is a valid one. Like him, and so many others, I too have experienced that dilemma. While we need to put a rational amount of faith in our training (emphasis on “rational”), blind faith can be disastrous. It’s healthy and constructive to question things, and also to do periodic reality checks. If, like me, you’re not inclined to just go out and pick fights with people, then meeting and exchanging with others, incrementally pressure testing your skills, and working out with as many people from as many groups, schools and even styles as you reasonably can, can help in working through the dilemma.
FWLIW, I myself would be strongly inclined to check out the grassroots type of school (even if I didn’t know John Kang, whom I highly regard). All things being equal (which they never are), the type of environment you describe fits my personality and inquisitive learning style much better than some more formal and hierarchical environments. Sometimes learning “with” someone can be as fruitful as learning “from” someone.
Having said that, I also don’t mind peering beyond the superficial layer of things as Tom astutely suggested - especially if there is real value to be mined. So I would want to experience both kinds of schools in order to make the most informed longer term investment.
On that note, be sure to let me know if you’re ever in our neck of the woods. We are very proud of our humble podunk training group, and would welcome you to share in our experience.
Last but not least - indeed, a belated welcome to the forum.
Originally posted by Vajramusti
[B]Originally posted by Ernie
… why would any skilled wing chun person have a problem with a friendly test
i don’t understand
Context— someone coming to your school- right?
Firstly,
If you have the time you can try and sort out the show offs, the hoods and those sincerely trying to figure out what to study and where.
One behavioral response is not appropriate for all.
Secondly- its one thing to compare hands with Ip Bo Ching and then Ip Man in Hong Kong in the early 50s…
and to have a comparison in 2004 in the US no matter how controlled with someone who is not your student, on your property in most states.
Specially without a waiver or insurance that covers visitors.
Unfortunate- but there it is.
Claims of an unwanted touch can cause both civil or criminal complaint - no matter how unwarranted- can cost you. [/B]
joy
i would have to take your word and experience on this
never seen it though
sure when i was working with the boxers and thai guys people would come up and get all ****y but as soon as they got in ring they would run out of gas or get tagged and they would cool out
or get beat down and that would be that no crying or lay suits
i have been knocked out by gary a few times and i have knocked some of my gung fu brothers just in the flow of things
no problem at all there have been hospital visits and sprains
and blood
but this is par for the course it’s fighting after all
not dance class or tai chi
if i put myself in a fighting or testing of skill enviroment
i take what comes , i know i’m not going really try and do something stupid to some one that i’m training with
and sure guys get emotional when they get hit but that’s just all part of it
but different strokes i guess
edit in
also the show offs and the hoods are the exact people you want to work off thats the guy in the street that will try something
great real energy:D
The best school or teacher is hard to define as it depends on your goals and mentality. For example who is better Kenneth Chung, Emin Boztepe, Gary Lam, Garrett Gee, Wong Shun Leung, Wang Kiu, Moy Yat, Chen XiaoWang, Yip Man, Uyeshiba, Mas Oyama…? Which one will get you to where you want to get? Do you like hard military style training or do you like a more casual approach. Do you like the approach where the head master is the closest thing on earth to a god or does a friendly coach fit the bill? What’s better, someone who has a valid lineage or a modern mixed martial arts fighter who can handle the Thais, can handle the BJJ and has a fighting reputation in the ring? What’s better someone who teaches a pure art or someone who mixes it with the best of other arts? What’s really better in the short run: Thai boxing, Western boxing, BJJ, army combat, Judo or Wing Chun? What’s better in the long run? What art is really best for your body type? Is your mentality aggressive or passive or somewhere in-between? How much time do you want to put into learning how to fight? Do you want to risk learning something, learn it for a few years and then be told that what you were learning was crap? Should you check out every other school first? If they don’t suit you up and give you a rough time sparring on day one like Terence recommends, then should you look elsewhere real fast? Do you like large classes or small classes? Are private lessons better or public classes? How about try a few things where you don’t get locked in first for a few months and then decide. If all else fails and the locked in approach doesn’t suit your needs then you have only wasted a year’s worth of tuition fees but you now will have some useful base to use for comparison against anything else.
It’s difficult for a beginner to judge who is good so bringing a friend who can fight or who can judge something is a good idea. Sometimes even that is not that important. Just having a good feel about the place might be enough. Do you like a ranking system? Some people have that, and others don’t. Some people feel the need to have a concrete measure of success. Other people don’t care and just train and train all their life. Some clubs compete and other clubs don’t. If you want to compete then you need a club that trains tournament fighters. Some people deal with grappling and other’s don’t. Some talk about the psychological aspects of real world defense and others don’t concern themselves with this.
In some clubs you might be the only lady, in others there might be many. Sometimes being the only female can be of benefit but in some clubs it can be the opposite.
Too much thinking will get you nowhere however. At a low level, lots of clubs are OK.
Originally posted by tallazngrrrl wow, thank you all for the great suggestions and advice! i wonder if all the opinions will make my choice easier or harder… (on the other hand, i noticed nobody welcomed me to the forum :~( ). i guess my next step will be to actually try the classes and see how it goes!
Welcome to the fold.
IMO, I would stay quite far from any kind of contract in MA. The thought of one just makes me feel…icky.
Personally, I think contracts in MA schools are a product of a crappy instructor trying to keep students around, but that is probably an extreme view.
Personally, I think contracts in MA schools are a product of a crappy instructor trying to keep students around, but that is probably an extreme view.
This is a really extreme view. It all depends on what condition the school is in. If someone who teaches outa their garage, of course it shouldn’t be expensive. If someone has a proffessional school and has a nice environment and equipment, I would think it would cost a little more. Being just business minded, it’s not easy to open a MA school. That’s why most people just teach in their garage.
when it comes down to it, it’s up to the individual! Don’t hate on schools that charges more or uses contracts. Don’t be so cheap people
Some people spend $20,000,000 on a pice of famous art. It’s still some paint on some canvas worth about $10. A diamond is just a useless mineral when used for show yet people pay thousands for it. So what people pay is not a criteria of a school being good or bad. People that really value something will pay any amount to get it. Once something is easy to get everywhere then the value goes down.
My comment is in regards to the contract itself not the cost. If something is worth the price pay it, I’m not suggesting to be a cheapskate.
The problem is the contract. Can anyone give a good reason that a contract is nessisary? If the instruction is good and the student is happy, there is no need to have a contract. A contract is a legal binding document, what kind of legal binding is required to learn MA? To me, it just seems like bad chess.
I don’t like the contrcat idea also. I guess it is just a business security thing. When I studied Karate there were no contracts. Later the teacher got very rich with the contract method. He made many millions doing that stuff. He learned the marketing system from Ed Parker and his Kenpo approach.
ah, but “beauti” is short for beautician… and my real name is beau t. (it’s french)… and i want to “be” “au” (gold)… and the list goes on… but its like the david chapelle skit, “just because i’m dressed like a police officer doesn’t mean i am”
ah ha! i’m sensing ‘energy’ between tallazngrrrl and mat.perhaps we could start a wing cun dating agency.sticky [no pun intended] hands across the sea.romance,bliss,and hand to hand combat.
Nice thought, but I think you’re a bit quick off the mark… my GF might have something to say about that!
Anyway Ms Beau, you seriously want to think about changing your address on forums and BBSs to something like sf_beauti @ yahoo.com or sf_beauti 8 yahoo.com or something, or spambots’ll pick it up and will fill your inbox with nonsense.
And don’t forget to come back and tell us how it goes!
