Rebuttal Concerning Professor Lau Bun and Hung Sing Elders

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Southern Chinese Kung Fu
21

whoever you are buddha…

I got information directly from Jew Leong, My Sifu, His Si-sooks, and so forth.

this you have no clue on, and for your information, my sifu was the one who set up many of these interviews. You, i can’t even say are a hung sing member, and that i really don’t care.

You quote a magazine article that was written by a student of Jew Leong. I Interview, showed Jeong Leong what I wrote, and again for your information, I have been personally thanked by Jew Leong for being the one to preserve our history. So, obviously you are an outsider to my lineage, or you would know this.

SO you say Lau bun’s papers were in order? How can that be when he entered the United States under a false name? You are a fool, you know nothing about Lau Bun, my sifu, or anyone else in my lineage for that matter.

IF you want to say what Lau Bun did was a crime, then you are also calling my sifu a criminal. All his information is found on his website, I don’t need to point that out here.

Troy, I have spent my life with my sifu. I don’t and will never need a piece a paper to tell me I am a senior disciple of GM Salvatera. The only one to ever do the tea ceremony was Chad.

I say you have never learned any new sets from my sifu. The only times i’ve seen you there was for your own missions. To tell you the truth, I have never in 25 years of my training seen you practice in our studio. So, I know what I’m talking about.

Troy, what ever your beef is, back off dude. I know more about you than you realize, and if you don’t want me to bust you out here publicly, back off. You know, although I never seen you practiced one single day under my sifu, my sifu says you were his student so i had your back. But you obviously got beef now, so spit it out, or do what you’re gonna do.

You stepped up first, speak up. I know for a fact you don’t know much about fut san sets. and to answer your question, the sets Lau Bun teaches are not taught in Fut San, but the signature moves, the openings, and closings are exactly the same with a small modification.

How, do i know you don’t know fut san CLF, because you never show up at the studion when you say you will. I have never once seen you practice under sifu at all, so if you want to flex, then flex. but know i will flex back.

Buddha Joe, you don’t know me, so your words get dusted off my shoulders. keep talking smack.

22

SO actually sifu dunwood,

I am a senior disciple of Dino Salvatera. Aside from Hannibal, I am the only senior student of “Dino Salvatera” who is actively doing something in the name of Hung Sing.

You, i can’t say are a senior disciple, because as you already know, I am very close to sifu, and the question of when do you or have you EVER come to practice has come up many many many times, in front of my sifu. There has yet to be an answer.

Kicking him down some money, and only coming around to learn a set doesn’t make you a senior disciple, you actually have to practice under him, know him, do things for him…I have done everything a disciple thats gone through the tea ceremony, but I will never do a tea ceremony with my sifu because a certain ex-student of his cheapened it, and hurt my sifu in the end.

So, in contrary to your lame try to insult me, no piece of paper will ever explain how much of a true disicple I am to him. You on the other hand, won’t even carry the Hung Sing name, even when you were asked to. Hung Sing is tatted on my chest so till the day I die I will always be a Hung SIng Man.

23

and to buddha joe,

you say “Sifu’s version” what sifu? who is your sifu?

Are you aware that any information I got about Lau Bun came directly from his direct descendants, not just word of mouth.

You say Jew Sifu’s sources are better than mine, he is one of my sources, so where do you think i got the information from?

When the only person Lau Bun requested to teach, and Lau Bun asked permission first because of his past, where do you think i got that informaion from? Here on the forum? HA!

Guess, what…Quote me now…"Any thing I’ve ever written about Jew Leong, Lau Bun, or My sifu, came directly from their mouths. On Lau Bun, I’ve interviewed many people you most likely don’t even know of.

So you can talk all the smack you want, you sound stupid because you are clueless to my extent with the Hung Sing Kwoon.

Keep talking, I need a good laugh, i had a bad day today.

24

troy,

you’re my classmate but i don’t know how, but I do know this, you don’t represent Hung Sing, you represent Tung Mo, Ying Hung, The prancing fairy style( I think thats what you called it) but you don’t represent Hung Sing.

No, i never bi-see’d my sifu, but that doesn’t mean i’m not his disciple. I know more about him personally, than alot of my classmates. I am the one he would go to the movies with, get coffee with, take him here, take him there. Cover the school for him when he works. So, yeah…with everything i’ve experienced, learned, and so on for the last 25 years, there is no piece of paper that will tell me i’m his disciple.

See, I’m the one that many call his son. they all think he is my father.

and in one big way, he is.

25

what happened buddha joe,

you attack me, spit out some bs about something my sigung told your classmate.

But you fail to realize, that I got my information from Jew Leong directly, not from my classtmate. I can call my sigung anytime I want.

So to you and your classmate, Professor Jew Leong personally thanked me about the efforts and what I wrote about his sifu, and Sigung, and Di-sigung. He thanked me at the grand closing of my Si-sook Tenny Lee’s Gung Fu school in the east bay.

So, whatever you are talking about, as long as I have the blessings of Jew Leong, I all good, man.

so what now, plebian?

26

man you guys got me on a roll,

Plebian buddha Joe

How can you say that Lau Bun’s papers were in order when he entered the united states under the name of Wong On Low, and that he worked as a laundry man?

How do I know, because I have Lau Bun’s death certificate, that’s why.

If his name is Lau Bun, but he entered undered Wong On Low, I think there was some shadiness going on, there. but you won’t see that thru beer goggles while looking thru a pair of binoculars.

So now what?

27

Re:

You can say anything about me you like, people that know me know the truth, Sifu will tell you when I began training with him, it was just me and him. You have no idea. Then most remember me but you. Valerie remembers me, Vern remembers me, Brian remembers me, Yusef knows me, Florence knows me, Dan knows me, Sifu used to tell me to go to Spotford Alley and train with his teacher as well. You can say whatever you like, but any claim i’ve made I can back it up. I never said Lau Bun teachings was any less traditional than anything else, what I am saying is the curriculums are different even though the foundation is the same. Lau Bun’s student and your si gung classmate Johnny Ma made this statement when he retired he’d refer students to two teachers myself and Sifu. I doubt very seriously if he’d do that if I wasn’t adequate. Frank you must understand if I never showed up when I said I will, it was probably a good reason behind it, but none the less, ask Sifu if he ever taught me any of the Futsan sets, and then ask him what I had to say about them. I know Sifu didn’t go back to re-learn anything, believe me we talk more than you think we do, and thats just my point why go learn the same thing, thats my point, it is different, yet the foundation is the same, but then that can be said about most kung fu styles.

Troy Dunwood
Ying Hung Yat Ga Association

28

then why didn’t you put it that simply instead of sounding like you’re attacking me?

So what the sets are different, all that matters is that the foundation is the same. That means we’re from there.

Personally, what ever you feel about the Fut San Stuff is your opinion, and for my self, I see many many many similarities in movement, concept, techniques, but like you said, the sets taught are different.

so where’s the problem here?

don’t act like i don’t know you were around, but i never seen you learn anything, or practice with us at all, or even just in the school. You’ve helped out when you could, but I just don’t remember you learning anything.

But if you got some beef with me man, then spit it out, because I’ve always had your back, but now you’re attacking me, and publicly disputing things i’ve researched about my branch. you act like i’m lying.

but you and i both know i’m not.

29

Re:

And this truly will be my last post. I’ve never inmy life buddied up with any of my classmates, it’s just not my style, and truly enjoyed my time alone training under Sifu. I like to think of myself as representing kung fu as awhole and not limiting myself to one particular style. I don’t have to explain things i’ve did for Sifu out of a willing heart he knows. Frank i’ve been learning kung fu since 1969, my first Sifu passed away my second style was hunggar, then came wing chun from one of sifu’s students before I started learning from him,in actuality my loyalty should be to my first teacher and system north shaolin, but he taught us to always learn new stuff. No the relationship between Sifu and myself haven’t always been great, but in the end our friendship out weighs all else, I knew enough gung fu before I met sifu to last me a lifetime, it is my choice to hang out with hung sing gwoon because of Sifu and not so much gung fu. Well, as far as the prancing fairy style, people have come all the way, prancing from australia to learn it and so some folks are interested. Maybe you should ask Sifu abouta few weeks ago when I was there and we compare clf drunken and the eight immortals style, by his request not mine, I know you consider him old school, so now ask him if its BS or not. In any case I think this got way off base so i’lls ign off now.

30

troy,

I know more about your background than you realize. I know what’s a lie, or what’s real. Your business is your business. what you teach, or create is your business.

Truthfully, it doesn’t matter to me that I’ve never seen you practice at our school, and I was going everyday for a while. But I’ve always recognized you as my classmate, and have stood up for you.

but for you to come at me like the way you did with no explanation, leaves to burned bridges man.

do your thing, i’m gonna keep doing mine.

to everyone Including my sifu if he checks out this thread, I made up nothing about my elders, and everything i told is the truth. If my elders purposely lied to me, then that’s not my bad. that’s theirs. That would only make them look bad. but I got everything approved before i printed it.

that’s why i’m not worried.

31

Re:

whats a lie and or the truth? go ahead speak on it, all of my learning can be verified, Choy Siu Ming of Chan Family CLF is still around, Man Sing of Eight Immortals lives in SF Chinatown, Chiu Chi Ling is my neigbor here in Alameda, Sifu called for me his friend right there in his house who is also called Dino, who a few years ago had a stroke, and asked him to take me for 7 star mantis, sifu will tell you about Dennis who was Wing Chun, now what is it thats a lie? I don’t have to lie about these things, i’ve been teaching since I was 15 years old, at the east oaklandyouthdevelopment center,in the east bay I’m quite known, just ask anybody here thats been around for awhile, Bill Owens, AlNovak, Max Pallens, Sid Cambell, Steve McCutchins, Luther Secrease etc. My creation is TungMoJingJung, it it has been accepted by the martial arts community from here to china to the extent that most askwhere I learned it from. It’s not important if you seen me practice, you know I was there as well as everyone else that was there during those times. But then maybe I was there when you wasn’t, thats a possibility, Sifu will tell you I was with him before you came along.

32

look, what you do with your own gung fu is your business. If you created it, I hope the best for you.

In fact, I my self, support a martial artists creativity. And no matter what you’ve done, I’ve supported you.

Who knows you is of no consequence to me, I supported you in whatever you’ve done.

on this one, you jumped in on me, took the thread in another direction when it didn’t have anything to do with you. It had something to do with someone who is printing lies.

As i’ve said, I interviewed many of my elders, absorbed and took notes and compared it to my other interviews. I’ve gotten my information directly from my sifu, my sigung, and many of my si-sook gungs who were Lau Bun’s students. I’ve even taught my stick fighting to one of Lau Bun’s students who also shared information on his sifu.

I have no beef with you troy, so you can either back down, or PM me, email me, or call me and let me know what your beef is. If if it’s about something that recently went down, then you only have half the story.

you need to set things straight. you are coming at me hella foul for no reason.

33

Simple as this Troy,

You got beef? yes or no?

if not, explain why you’re jumping on me.

I ain’t gonna argue with you, you do what you do. but if you got beef, let it be known.

if something needs to be handled let that be known.

You started this, not me.

34

Perhaps I can make it easier for you to understand:
I could say that sifu Jew gave the studio’s pictures to David Dea who gave them to dino. which you used in articles without permission.
I could say the weapons, drums and lions from hung sing studio are not in the hands of dino for a reason.
I could also say that the red spear that Lau Bun practiced in his lifetime is in the hands of Larry Johnson the first Caucasian who became a sifu in 1978 and presented to him by jew sifu.
I could say that a sifu who calls himself a grandmaster today was beaten to a pulp by a George Long student over thirty years ago.
i could also say i know the contents of the safe kept by Lau Bun.
Although I know everything I have said is true I cannot verify it! (i couldn’t resist acting like you) Just because someone repeats a untrue, unverified story does not make it gospel. You must have proof or evidence: a newspaper, eyewitness account, or even a police report. It would be better to research Lau Bun good deeds, his huge contributions to Chinatown outside of kung-fu than this puerile interest in blood and gore.

35

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

36

You really are making your style look bad you know…no offense meant, but y’all sound like some strait b!tches.

37

so tell me what is untrue??

If I’m lying, then let me know where.

As I’ve said, Jew Leong gave me his blessings, my sifu approved of it, and so forth.

So, if my elders approved of what I wrote, then I’m not worried about you or what you think.

When I wanted to know about me sifu, I went to him. When I wanted to know about my sigung, i went to him, his higher up students, and so forth. when i wanted to know about lau bun I went to many of Lau Buns students.

so I don’t see where i am telling a lie?!?!?!?!?!

38

Look, I don’t really care who you are, or who you know.

I’m not sure who you are referring to that got beat up, but that makes no difference to me. Even bruce lee got his ass whipped from time to time.

IF you are referring to my sifu, then spit it out. This is something I’ve never heard of in my life.

If i don’t already know what was in the safe, for example a six shooter or something, I could easily find out in a heart beat. See, i’m connected in with my elders, so I see no problem.

why are you so afraid to reveal yourself, either publicly, or privately to me? you’re talking alot of smack for someone who hides behind a false name. are you afraid that whatever you say will get back to my sifu and you will have to deal with him? why the anonymity? what are you hiding from? don’t you think you revealed a little about yourself when you mentioned someone getting beat up.

I can verify if you know anything or not. or if people know you. you know who I am and who my sifu is, so what’s the problem?

39

hey buddhajoe,

you wouldn’t happen to be Fat Joe the Mexican of Hung Sing can you? Oh, and by the way, on the pictures the were given to my sifu, not loaned or to hold, but given to him, it was he that gave me the permission to post any of the pictures I have. How do you think I got them? Stole them out of his school? he let me take photo’s of the photo’s. now, what lies and misinterpretations are you going to come up with?

See, Larry Johson, the white elephant, I know who he is, and have him on film.

but if you’re fat Joe, then it explains why you speak the way you do.

So what’s your Point?

40

hskwarrior

I thoroughly enjoyed reading your zoomshare essays. Its fascinating to read about America’s first Gung Fu teacher. Btw, whats the story with Anthony Quinn? Is he a confirmed Lau Bun student or is this just hearsay?