Sorry but if you posted it here on this board I must have missed it but then again I can be dense at times and may need things spelled out for me. I have trouble with vague references to things which can be interpreted more than one way.
If you e-mailed me, I have not received anything yet. Of course I only checked my e-mail about 10 minutes ago to reply to someone else so maybe it’s still in transit or in cyber-limbo. Could you clarify if you meant here on this board or via e-mail. If on the board could you help me find the answers to the questions like, lineage, height of the dummy arms etc. I still don’t quite get the “locked” reference in either Taun or Bong, but remember I can be dense at times. Perhaps you could post a more detailed explanation which someone of my limited abilities could follow and perhaps, <gasp> grasp. Surely a Sifu could do this, after all I am sure not all of your students are as bright as the stars.
Seriously, if you truly wish to share knowledge and build ties then this is the place to be. If you are not interested in actually sharing and conversing then I am sure you will not stick around too long. Either way the choice is fully yours. I would welcome your input as I am sure you can offer much. Still, if you are not willing to share then perhaps moussells(sp) or the VTAA might be a better outlet for you.
Peace,
Dave
Sorry if I sound a bit terse but I am not in the best of moods at the moment.
Well Dave, it seems that this is a nit picky method of discrediting me on the forum.
Forgive me for choosing not to answer!
Perhaps another time you may benefit from my Knowledge. As I am sure I may benefit from yours.
It is not my wish to discredit you. I simply feel that if one posts here they should be willing to share any knowledge they do have. They should also be willing to accept the fact that others may do something entirely different and yet their method could also be viable.
It does little good to come to a forum like this and post vague generalities and then refuse to answer questions asked. I mean, what is the purpose of posting in the first place? You have made several references to various things and yet have not provided anything specific in response to several questions asked of you. I noticed this with Kathy Jo, Rene as well as myself.
I am unsure of your purpose in posting in the manner you did. By all accounts you seem to be a knowledgable person who could add much to discussions about Wing Chun. Still, you could be the best Wing Chun guy out there but if you are unwilling to share or at least consider others viewpoints it does little, IMHO, good to enter a forum like this.
I may not always be right, just ask my wife . However, I am willing to not only express my views but try to defend them. Sometimes, I have even been known to admit to being wrong and even change an opinion But, this is because the person I disagreed with was able to articulate their reasons and explain why they did what they do. I can assure you that spouting vague phrases or very general explanations does not impress me, perhaps it does others though.
In any event you already have answered the post, thoughn still no “answers” to specific points . If you would like to start fresh then we can try again.
I will open the door by providing my lineage so perhaps you can get an idea of where my methods come from.
Augustine Fong>Roy Undem>Me
Leung Ting>Keith Kernsprecht>Me
Leung Ting>Alan Fong>Me
Ng Wah Sum>Chung Kwok Chow>Me
I have also been priviledged to train with an original student of William Cheung and have met some of the Moy Yat family. In all of these I have found most people to be open and honest. Although our interpretation may have been different we were able to discuss things as adults. In some cases I came away with a new perspective regarding the art I have come to love. I am far from the most proficient person in the art but I have no interest in politics or any agenda. If you want to discuss the art and move forward to make it better for all concerned then I am with you 100%. If you are interested in ego stroking or promotion of one specific way as The Way I am afraid to be of a different mind.
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None of these were broken on my part or yours.
Please see my reply under the Sihing73 thread.
I will start going through the various threads in the next day or so and begin cleaning up any posts which are of a negative nature. I am sure that some threads will become much smaller afterwards.
If you have the book " Roots & Branches of Wing Chun" turn to page 186, you will see a picture of the tilt I am referring to. I tried to attach a pic here but I don’t have the Capability in this forum. As you will note, the shoulders do not pass the heels.
Well on page 162, it’s very hard t judge the Angle, however, Leung Ting does seem to have the shoulder no further back than his heel.
On page 118, The opponent getting hit, his shoulders are not further back than his heels also, however the potential of dodging Emins fistdoes exist, the rest depends on his skill compared to Emin’s.
Good spots, Roy! I think if one took time to analyze the variations displayed by Yip sifu in all the photographs it would send the more narrow minded among us into collective apoplexy (or bring them out of it
I’m not sure, however, if what’s in the photo is a dynamic lean to avoid a head-shot. I could also be part of a systematic structure approach (such as the “C” shape often seen in Tsui Sheung-Tin or Hawkins Cheung).
BTW- What do you make of Yip sifu’s Tan Sao alignment in the picture 8)
My technique is undoubtedly not good, but I can say that the near agony I once experienced during Chi Sao – from bong sao – is not there anymore. in part, I think this is because the skin and bone do toughen. perhaps more importantly, i doubt i throw it up with the same force as i once did, now that i have developed some other defensive measures to complement it.
Beginners can spend hours with photos and diagrams as prepared by people they don’t know, or they can just continue to Chi Sao under the guidance of someone they do know (their Sifu). I think the latter will be the quickest path to progress.
[This message was edited by Meng Shuo on 09-17-01 at 06:17 PM.]
Bong sau is the greatest move in theory but in practice it is the weakest…I’m only referring to the normal high bong and not the pressing bong, the collapsing bong, or the low bong…
the bong’s structure is naturally weak and will cause back and shoulder injury. People especially get injured during chi sau when the opponent uses gum sau on a bong and the shoulder rips. Ligament damage like that usually takes at leat 2 weeks to heal but since most of us practice wing chun at least once within that time frame, the injury just keeps getting aggrevated again and never heals properly. This leads to an ongoing problem and vicious cycle which will never be broken unless one stops using the dreaded bong!!!
whipping hand - ask any doctor or chiropractor about the bong’s structure. It has nothing to do with the “correctness” of the technique…the “correct” way itself is “incorrect” for the human body…
sunkuen - ? i don’t quite understand what you’re saying…or are you being sarcastic? Please elaborate…
"the bong’s structure is naturally weak and will cause back and shoulder injury. People especially get injured during chi sau when the opponent uses gum sau on a bong and the shoulder rips. Ligament damage like that usually takes at leat 2 weeks to heal but since most of us practice wing chun at least once within that time frame, the injury just keeps getting aggrevated again and never heals properly. This leads to an ongoing problem and vicious cycle which will never be broken unless one stops using the dreaded bong!!! "
Man,your’e fighting force against force.Don’t try and say your’e not.
whipping hand - what do you think makes up a “correct” bong? :rolleyes: you’re pretty arrogant…
sunkuen - when and how should you use the high bong? any type of deflection or block HAS TO USE FORCE. Otherwise if Wing Chun was so perfect in the application of such theories, most women practioners should be able to kick your arse!!! …and let’s not forget kids…since I have been practicing since I was younger than 7, I should have been able to defeat most adults but the time I was 12 right?
but then again I can be dense at times and may need things spelled out for me. I have trouble with vague references to things which can be interpreted more than one way.
. However, I am willing to not only express my views but try to defend them. Sometimes, I have even been known to admit to being wrong and even change an opinion 