Ive heard over the years many times that Choi Lei Fut is unique in the fact that it is the only style that claims to be both a Northern and a Southern style in terms of its roots. Im not sure if the style every has reached the north but probably not. However the construct of the style does indicate smoother flow and structure indicative of northern styles. In my opinion. And yes there are so many northern weapons in the arsenal too.
I hope not to bring too much history into this but does anyone know what the Northern distinction arose from? Was one of the predecessors a northern stylist?
What I have access to, Chan Yiu-Chi’s writing made no distinction between northern and southern, but then I don’t have access to all his documents, nor do I have any access to Koon-Pak or Chan Heung’s manuscripts either, so I cannot give you a definite answer from Chan family point of view, may be they don’t divide their kung Fu into northern and southern like we tried to do these days.
Within CLF, some people these days also tried to divide it into King Mui CLF, Kong Men CLF, Guangzhou CLF, Futsan CLF, Northern CLF, Souther CLF, Chan Family and Whatever Family CLF, etc. etc. But at the end of the day it is still CLF.
So there you go, Frank, through your hard-earned research, you now have Chinese Masonic CLF
[B]/B!
Congratulations Grandmaster Frank, you are now the founder of a new style or a new branch of CLF! We can now all kowtow to you, Grandmaster Frank.
XJ
PS: I hope you can take a joke brother Frank, I am just try to get a point across - CLF is CLF, we are family, so don’t try to divide it, it will be bad for all of us. We are like a big old tree, cut all the branches and the roots off and the tree will die.
What you are saying is a bit like accusing the southern Chinese copied their surname with the same “Wang” belonging to the northern Chinese
Could it be that both kung fu shared the same source and origin, cultural, geographical, philosophical and religious wise (ie. Buddhist Shaolin as in “Fut” in Choy Lee Fut)? Hence the similar names are passed down.
oh yes, i can take a joke brother Joseph. for the most part, our little debates are always very amusing to me.
However, funny or not,Chan Heung is/was one of our brothers in Hung Mun. interestingly enough, neither Koon Pak nor Chan Yiu Chi were not according to the Chan Family sources i have.
the Hung Mun was a HUUUUUUGGGGGEEEEE part of southern Chinese life. More than 75 percent of the men there changed their names to include the Hung name in it. And, for Chan Heung’s Choy Lee Fut, and Jeung Hung Sing’s version of Choy Lee Fut the connection to the Hung Mun is far far far more than just the type of bow we perform. The pattern of the Fut San Hung Sing Kwoon can be superimposed over the Hung Character and you will see that mixed with the Hung Mun Bow that it PERFECTLY FITS…PERFECTLY.
What we all know as gung fu techniques are also secret hand signals for the Hung Mun as they were representative of things like the 5 Ancestors, their beliefs, and much much more.
being inspired is ok. when u push it and name “dai lohan” “siu lohan” “dai muifa” “siu muifa” u cross the line. because thats not only very specific northern styles, thats very specific northern forms.
Could it be that both kung fu shared the same source and origin, cultural, geographical, philosophical and religious wise (ie. Buddhist Shaolin as in “Fut” in Choy Lee Fut)? Hence the similar names are passed down.
For the Chan Family of CLF the word FUT is used in a religious sense while FUT in Jeung Hung Sing’s lineage is representative of FUT GAR KUEN as passed down from the monk/ hung mun co-founder “Ching Cho”.
i have trained a little choy lay fut in atlanta and canada and it is a cool style. but wouldnt wuzuquan/ngo cho be considered a northern and southern mixed style also?
no where i have read calls it that but being that it is a mixture of 5 styles(6 really) and 3 of the styles is taizu long fist, shaolin louhan, and monkey foot work from hou quan? im not really sure tho. any insight would be great!
[QUOTE=bawang;1037038]being inspired is ok. when u push it and name “dai lohan” “siu lohan” “dai muifa” “siu muifa” u cross the line. because thats not only very specific northern styles, thats very specific northern forms.[/QUOTE]
What line have we crossed? Who drew up this line? Muifa is a Chinese national symbol and Luohan is a Buddhist term. Many Chinese have the same names, have they crossed THE line as well? LOL.
[QUOTE=hskwarrior;1037040]For the Chan Family of CLF the word FUT is used in a religious sense while FUT in Jeung Hung Sing’s lineage is representative of FUT GAR KUEN as passed down from the monk/ hung mun co-founder “Ching Cho”.[/QUOTE]
Hi Frank,
“Fut” in CLF stands for the Buddhist Shaolin Temple where our MA came from, it is neither religious nor personal. CLF has a lot of Daoist and Confucian, as a philosophy and not as a religion, influence as well.
However, funny or not,Chan Heung is/was one of our brothers in Hung Mun. interestingly enough, neither Koon Pak nor Chan Yiu Chi were not according to the Chan Family sources i have.
[/QUOTE]
Hi Frank,
As far as I know, Chan Heung and his family assisted in the revolutionary cause of the Hung Mun but they were never a member, however many of their disciples and students were, even up to present days, for example Li Iu-Ling, who just passed away a few years ago, was a member of Sydney’s Ji Kung Tong.
As far as I know, Chan Heung and his family assisted in the revolutionary cause of the Hung Mun but they were never a member, however many of their disciples and students were, even up to present days, for example Li Iu-Ling, who just passed away a few years ago, was a member of Sydney’s Ji Kung Tong.
XJ
oh, ok. many of the chan family sites say that Chan Heung was a “4-2-6.” This can’t be unless he was initiated into the Hung Mun…which in southern China was controlled by the Green Grass Monk.
See, aside from history, I love ALL choy lee fut. But, i love my brothers from the Hung Mun family even more. Choy Lee Fut’s three major branches (Chan, Hung Sing, Buk Sing) have all played major parts in the Hung Mun. In Hong Kong, the Dragon Head of the Hung Mun was a Buk Sing Guy. Our CLF brothers in Canada are also part of the family.
its good to know that Li Iu Ling was also a brother. I wonder if he got the traditional Hung Mun send off at his funeral. My Sigung got it, i wasn’t there at the parlor to witness it but from what i hear it was AWESOME to behold.
Ji / Ghee / Chee…its all the same. We use Ghee Kung Tong. Joseph, the Green Grass Monk is the original founder of the Ghee Kung Tong in Canton and Guangxie…but it went by another name originally. then had to change the name.
[QUOTE=hskwarrior;1037056]YEAH… :eek: in YOUR lineage. For us, it is used to represent the Fut Gar in our Gung Fu not a Buddhist connection.[/QUOTE]
Hi Frank,
What Chan Heung learned from his uncle Chan Yuan-Wu is also called Fut Gar, so there is already an earlier Fut Gar connection in our kung fu, and that “Fut” is also referred to the Shaolin Temple, and not Chan himself, because a person cannot be regarded as a “Fut” (a Buddha), it (Fut Gar) would have a to mean a family of Buddhists, ie. a Buddhist temple like Shaolin.
Well, you know that COULD…and thats a small COULD…be true. Fut Gar was a generic term used for Shaolin gung fu. And, its been said that the 5 Ancestors of the Hung Mun all studied Fut Gar Kuen.
Now, joseph, you may be able to answer this. compared to Fukien, is King Mui north? The reason i ask is because the first co-founder of the Hung Mun Tsai Te Chung changed his name to Chan Yuen. I wonder if this could be Chan Yuen Wu…what does the WU in his name mean?
[QUOTE=hskwarrior;1037062]oh, ok. many of the chan family sites say that Chan Heung was a “4-2-6.” This can’t be unless he was initiated into the Hung Mun…which in southern China was controlled by the Green Grass Monk.
[/QUOTE]
Hi Frank,
If Chan Heung was Hung Mun member, then it would have been recorded in the family archive, it is too important a record to miss out. If what Jung Ah-Yim has learned before he met Chan Heung was recorded (Hung Kuen) then what he has learned afterward would also be recorded, but there is no mention of this.
If Chan Heung was Hung Mun member, then it would have been recorded in the family archive, it is too important a record to miss out. If what Jung Ah-Yim has learned before he met Chan Heung was recorded (Hung Kuen) then what he has learned afterward would also be recorded, but there is no mention of this.
XJ
Actually, IF chan heung was a member of the Hung Mun in those days the military or local law enforcement suspected him of being a member, searched his home and found his family archives claiming him as a Hung Mun member it would have been the INSTANT death of Chan Heung and possibly his entire family out of suspicion alone.
Chan Heung NEVER recorded that Jeung Hung Sing or his father was anything near Hung Kuen. if Chan Yiu Chi wrote that down he was incorrect. that right there is an obvious sign of what he was trying to accomplish.