Lee Shing Wing Chun Family

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Wing Chun
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I would like to introduce myself to the users of this forum, as I have noticed a distinct lack of information about my Family of Wing Chun practitioners. Lee Shing was a very humble gent, who never really taught anyone for money as he was a very successful restaurant owner in Londons Chinatown for most of his senior life.

My name is LoneTiger108, and I feel totally alone!

I have my Martial Family, based here in London, but things are very quiet at the moment as there seems to be an overwhelming push from China in the Wushu fields in the UK, which is in some ways undermining the existing Kung Fu fanatics who have been training here since as early as the 1950’s. There are other teachers/uncles like Austin Goh & Joe Lee who I admire very much, but what I practice is still different.

Does anyone here know of Lee Shing (Sing Lee/Li Kam Sheng)?

I have studied under Joseph Man of the ‘Jun Mo’ School. I have read many articles and online information about the Lee Shing Family, but it all seems to point towards the Gulao Village and perhaps even Leung Jan himself. What I do know is that the way I was taught was ‘not’ like any versions I’ve researched but more like a complete individual and bespoke method which incorporated learning Chinese Literature and theories prior to any forms! I, and my brothers, were all pre-practitioners and were taught as teachers, apprentices and Sifu.

I ask anyone who reads this to be open minded to my ramblings, as I am a writer myself and am honestly just looking for people who are interested in hearing about something new that obviously originates from something quite old.

I am also available to answer any questions you may have about my own personal learning. I have been coaching since 2003 with my Martial Brother, as we founded The Yum Yeurng Academy to help preserve our collaborative teaching methods. I have recently atarted to take on personal students and coach demonstration teams in my spare time.

With respect,

LoneTiger108

Weblinks:
http://www.junmo.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=30&Itemid=45
http://www.josephleewingchun.com/
http://www.austingoh.com/
http://www.alanlambwingchun.com/

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Lone Tiger 108

Greetings.

Do you know what happened to Joseph Cheng?

good wishes,

joy chaudhuri

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Is Joseph Cheng still alive?

Vajramusti, if you know the name you may be able to let me know where he is lol!

Joseph is a mystery to even his own family, as on a reprint of his Wooden Man book it was mentioned that he is ‘no longer with us’. This set off the entire family as they all thought he was dead. As far as I’m aware, he is still in China and was last seen in Hong Kong and still training…

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Distant relatives

Hello LoneTiger108, I am a student of Samuel Kwok, who also trained with Lee Sing/Shing I had the fortune to meet him once when Sifu took Yip Chun to his restaurant, 1985 I think it was when we were down that end of the country as part of Sigung’s first UK seminar tour.

I remember sitting around a table with my Sifu and two Sigung! I had such a busy time putting food in Yip Chun’s dish as well as Sifu’s and topping everybodies tea up that I hardly had of a chance to eat much of the delicious meal.

I never had a chance to have any training with him though I have met Austin a couple of times and did ‘play’ chi sau with the late Eddie Yeoh’s students. Apart from that I do not know much of your side of the family, nice to meet you though and hope you enjoy your time in this forum.:smiley:

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Distant relatives for sure…

tjwingchun, at last I hear from someone who has actually met my SiGung! I, unfortunately, didn’t even start training in Wing Chun until he had passed away so I always like to hear from people who met Lee Shing.

Thanks for sharing your experience, as I too have a great amount of respect for Sifu Kwok, or ‘Uncle’ as we tend to call him! I also have met Uncle on a few occassions, most memorable was at The Ip Man Tong Opening Ceremony in Foshan. He has always managed to keep Wing Chun in the limelight, especially in the Chinatown New Year displays, and his team in China really put on a great demo. Where you there?

If there is anything I can help you with in your understanding of our side of the Family, I will try my best to assist. I can’t promise anything magical, as I am still quite young myself, but I did train hard back in the day and I’m forever grateful to my Sifu for teaching me how to grow as an artist. Dialogue can be so healthy, but I’ve seen far too many posts on here already that distract practitioners from their art. I hope I can still enjoy my time here though, but I can’t honestly say how long I will last!

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[QUOTE=LoneTiger108;804512]most memorable was at The Ip Man Tong Opening Ceremony in Foshan. He has always managed to keep Wing Chun in the limelight, especially in the Chinatown New Year displays, and his team in China really put on a great demo. Where you there?
[/QUOTE]I was there at the Yip Man Tong opening, I was the one Yip Chun got to say a few words onstage, introduced as “Master Trevor”, and I was the one in the Leicester Square Chinese New Year demos who used to break the 3x1" boards, and hold impromptu seminar/demo’s around the corner in the Polar Bear Pub on the night time.

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Lee Shing family is in good standings and have alot of great things in store for them in the future. The 2 main branchs (Austin Goh Sifu, and Joseph Lee), are both flurishing. Many DVDs have been produced by sifu Goh. Josheph Lee just came out with a DVD and is working on a series of articles detailing the Kulo aspect of his system.

Lee Shing is a very popular branch in the Europe, just simply not in the west - though almost no mainland WCK is found in the west. Lee Shing was hand picked by Yip man to teach in Europe. He actualy gave him a pair of his BOt Jam Tao swords as a symbol of this. Yip Chun when visiting Lee Sigung many years later, saw his fathers swords and got very emotional. On his second trip he brought Lee Sigung a very nice pair of swords to keep company the swords that Yip man passed on. (according to Yip Chun, and oral traditions passed down from Lee Shing)

Lee Shings branch is very unique as not only does it teach the Yip Man system, but it also teachs the Kulo Pian San System. I think it adds a richness to the WCK world~

My WCK history research group, AWCKRI, in fact has a member of the LEe Shing family. Check out some of our information and I hope you enjoy

www.wingchunpedia.org

                                Brian
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Lee Shing lived in London…

[QUOTE=byond1;804557]Lee Shing is a very popular branch in the Europe, just simply not in the west - though almost no mainland WCK is found in the west. Lee Shing was hand picked by Yip man to teach in Europe.[/QUOTE]

Just a quick note on this comment by byond1.

First off, thanks for your insight. Its nice to read every now and then about how Lee Shing inherited the knives from Yip Man. I would only like to point out that Lee Shings teachings were kept very much within London, mainly Chinatown, and it has only really been future grand-students who have spread the art throughout Europe. Considering this, London played its part in the Wing Chun history more so than any other place in the World, mainly because this is where Lee Shing settled and done business. He had ‘many’ students who went on to become Sifus and Austin Goh and Joe Lee are, by far, the most popular.

Also I would like to say that Lee Shings way of teaching was completely individual, according to the stories I’ve heard. Not one student learnt in the same manner as another, so his Wing Chun was uniquely his own.

He honoured Yip Man by attempting to teach within the guidelines set in Hong Kong, but his students were eager to learn his own personal style. This is where the ‘Pien San’ and ‘Gulao’ versions enter the frame. All in all, I’d like to say it’s just Leung Jan Family, but I think it still may go back further in time.

All to be discussed and researched with the help of forums and threads like this one. Can you help?

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Lee Shing representation in the AWCKRI

[QUOTE=byond1;804557]My WCK history research group, AWCKRI, in fact has a member of the LEe Shing family. Check out some of our information and I hope you enjoy

www.wingchunpedia.org

Brian[/QUOTE]

Brian,

I just noticed that there is nobody representing Lee Shing among your directors. Please tell me I missed something…

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Hi

Perhaps I forgot to update the info?? Let me check!

                       B
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lee family

hi lone tiger and others re joe cheung last year my guro david foogie had a english arnis teacher out for semminars he said joeship is alive and was working in the sudan somewere peace russell sherry

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Thanks for the keen eye for detail. All updated!

                             B
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You’re very welcome!

[QUOTE=byond1;806867]Thanks for the keen eye for detail. All updated!B[/QUOTE]

Thanks for looking into that for me, I noticed my ‘Cousin’ there is Olivier form Kings College! What a small World it is…

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Lee Shing Family

Hi there Lone Tiger 108,

My name is Alan from Australia. It seems that you have found another of your distant relative of Lee Shing. We all belong to the Chiu Van Lineage.

Lee Shing was one of the first group of disciples of Chiu Van in Hong Kong but he had studied other styles of Wing Chun Kung Fu back in Fo Shan (Buddha Mountain) China.

Joseph Cheng was his outstanding disciple. If I am not wrong, Joseph Cheng should be in his 60s now. He used to be the personal body guard of a once Saudi Arabian Prince. So there should be some trace of his teachings in Saudi Arabia.

My Sifu is Lee Man Kit. He is the sole indoor disciple of Chiu Van in the 1960s. Now Chiu Van’s son is teaching in Hong Kong.

One day I hope to organize a family reunion of the Chiu Van’s group and of course with every kung fu relatives’ help.

Lee Man Kit was a younger kung fu brother of Lee Shing but he spent most of the time with Chiu Van and Yip Man.

In real fact Chiu Van is not a student of Yip Man but the closest of all friends. It would be a really long story if anybody wishes to know.

I am now teaching the Chiu Van’s Wing Chun under the name of Lee’s International Wing Chun after my Sifu’s surname.

Hardly in the past had Chiu Van discussed his affairs with anybody except with Yip Man and Lee Man Kit. There were happy and sad days about them in the past.

Neither has many people hear of us because Lee Man Kit never used to teach. If anybody is interest to organize any seminars overseas, we would be very interested to hold one to fully explain one of the last branch of Wing Chun Kung Fu.

From observation, I hope it is no offence to any Wing Chun Seniors, some current instructors in the world has studied privately with Chiu Van.

I am very sure that Si Sok Fred Kwok would be very proud of being Chiu Van’s student. Si Sok Jason Lau is one of my idol instructors.

Through this forum, I also wish to contact and correspond with any body of Chiu Van’s Lineage. My Sifu Lee Man Kit is more happy to meet you all.

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[QUOTE=Snake and Crane;807388]Hi there Lone Tiger 108,

My name is Alan from Australia. It seems that you have found another of your distant relative of Lee Shing. We all belong to the Chiu Van Lineage.

Lee Shing was one of the first group of disciples of Chiu Van in Hong Kong but he had studied other styles of Wing Chun Kung Fu back in Fo Shan (Buddha Mountain) China.

Joseph Cheng was his outstanding disciple. If I am not wrong, Joseph Cheng should be in his 60s now. He used to be the personal body guard of a once Saudi Arabian Prince. So there should be some trace of his teachings in Saudi Arabia…

…Through this forum, I also wish to contact and correspond with any body of Chiu Van’s Lineage. My Sifu Lee Man Kit is more happy to meet you all.[/QUOTE]

Hey Alan (Cousin?) It’s so good to hear from someone from the Chiu Van family, as I was beginning to think that the old ‘Values’ within our styles current culture were being lost to the younger MMA attitude of ‘it just better work, don’t care where it comes from’ type thing!

Chiu Van (Jiu Wan as I would normally write in my ‘yokel’ village script!!) was indeed a massive influence on Lee Shings learning, as far as I know, and he was also the kind gent who introduced Lee Shing to Yip Man. I aslo know of the families you mention from Foshan, who obviously had a slightly less modernized version of this style than Yip Mans HK teachings. I love to see the variations, as I have a genuine interest in our heritage which others seem to dismiss so easily as myth and legend.

I was fortunate to meet with a group of Jiu Wans at The Yip Man Tong Opening, along with my brother and Simo. Even the famous actor Ti Lung was interested in us and payed us a lot of respect, almost bullying his guys to be friendly to these ‘gweilo’ as they’re ‘real’!! I’ve always known that a true Masters talents will be recognized by the oldskool and this was just one occassion I witnessed first-hand.

Thanks for the comments regarding Joseph Cheng! Yes, he was the most ‘famous’ Lee Shing student, but he was still very young when he became a Sifu, like many others at the time. My Sifu has fond memories of them in the early days, especially when the first ever ‘Wooden Man’ book was created and published in 1977!! This was also the main reason Joseph Cheng became so famous, but that book was a team effort, a family guidebook and a real treasure of Lee Shing as he personally helped with the content.

So, whats left to say is ‘thank you’ for introducing yourself here, and I hope the day comes when we can all meet and exchange ideas on History/Traditions/Style & Training. Please pass on my regards to your Sifu, Lee Man Kit and the Family in Austrailia…

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Receipt of message

Hi there again Lone Tiger 108,

Thanks for your reply. When you mentioned Ti Lung, he is my Sifu’s most favourite younger kung fu brother.

To update our activities here, Sifu Lee Man Kit will be returning to Hong Kong to make connection with Chiu Van’s son who went back to HK about 2 years ago. In fact Chiu Van’s whole family is in Canada.

If there is any future personal correspondance with me, please email me at:

kwongkungfu@gmail.com

Keep in touch and I have no hessitation in any queries you would send to me.

Alan

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[QUOTE=Snake and Crane;808432]Thanks for your reply. When you mentioned Ti Lung, he is my Sifu’s most favourite younger kung fu brother.[/QUOTE]

I also should have mentioned Lee Hoi Suen!!! As he was with Ti Lung at the opening and they were so friendly (well, to us they were lol!) It is also crazy that Jiu Wans family is in Canada, as this was the final destination of Lee Shing and his family are still there, somewhere!

Looks like my annual ‘China Trip’ may soon become a ‘Canada Trip’ eh! I was always under the impression that certain knowledge had already left the Motherland…

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Lee Shing Wing Chun on Facebook!

Due to Lee Shing being virtually unheard of in the USA, I would like to add these links to websites promoting this family of Wing Chun:

http://www.junmo.co.uk/index.php?opt...d=30&Itemid=45
http://www.josephleewingchun.com/
http://www.austingoh.com/

There is now a Facebook Group of Lee Shing Wing Chun students!

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=5646373803

If anybody knows of any more sites or resources (other than the wcarchive) that present this family of Wing Chun, I would be grateful if you add them to this thread.

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Lone Tiger 108/re Lee Sing WC

Lee Sing’s wc may not be as unknown as you seem to think. Alan Lamb- one of the first if not the first Brit. sifu- learned from Lee Sing, and Joseph Cheng- as well as from Paul Lam, Koo Sang and others. Alan Lamb moved to the US many years ago- first to NY and later to California.
Your devotion to your version of the art is understandable.

I have evolved in one of the major IpMan lines- but not using the rings does not mean there is a flaw in what we do.Similarly, no problem if you see some benefit in the ring. Thanks for sharing your views ina mostly civil discussion.

Joy Chaudhuri

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[QUOTE=Vajramusti;809057]Lee Sing’s wc may not be as unknown as you seem to think. Alan Lamb- one of the first if not the first Brit. sifu- learned from Lee Sing, and Joseph Cheng- as well as from Paul Lam, Koo Sang and others. Alan Lamb moved to the US many years ago- first to NY and later to California.
Your devotion to your version of the art is understandable.

I have evolved in one of the major IpMan lines- but not using the rings does not mean there is a flaw in what we do.Similarly, no problem if you see some benefit in the ring. Thanks for sharing your views ina mostly civil discussion.

Joy Chaudhuri[/QUOTE]

Thank you for the kind words. I was waiting for someone to tell me about Alan, as I ‘think’ I met him once at the Senishow here in the UK! He’s not the only one in the USA either, as a Sihing has recently informed me that he is now in California. Small World really.

No intention to imply any ‘flaws’ really, on any side of the argument, just an honest query as this was a very special piece of equipment for me. Even my seniors had never even ‘seen’ it practised, but this may be more due to lack of funds to design/produce a quality ring. Even I started with some mad bendy bamboo, before we found a Rattan specialist lol!

Alan Lamb may have been the first Sifu ‘recognised’ by Joseph Cheng, but definately not the only western student under Lee Shing. Even Sifu Dave Lea (aka Batman!) was trained by Lee Shing for a while. Most just ‘passed through’, very few teach today and the few that do will definately remember a significant difference in families…

http://www.alanlambwingchun.com/