Yawn.
At my school we train both Wing Chun and BJJ intensively. We’ve earned the Jiu Jitsu guys’ respect and they ours. It’s much nicer to be able to treat these guys as friends and fellow stylists rather than tie yourself in mental knots wondering how and whether you might be able to beat such people if you get into streetfights with them (a MOST UNLIKELY OCCURRENCE).
"I heard one guy say yeah I might try Wing Chun but hey it won’t help you on the ground. "
“YOu should tell him his grappling won’t help him standing up!”
Both these statements show an equal level of ignorance IMO. Each style can enrich the other. BJJ has standup and most crosstrain. WC has grappling and ground-applicable techniques.
“don’t fight force with force, and ATTACK! ATTACK! ATTACK!”
sounds like sound BJJ strategy. BJJ is an art that relies on positioning, leverage, strategy and technique, not brute strength. The highest level of skill uses the opp’s movements and force to defeat him. Sound like something you know?
"Somehow you find yourself on your back with a guy kneeling over you, choking the life out of you with both hands. "
A BJJ person will not use so dangerous a tactic as his balance is vunerable. And that “choke” is a sad joke, no self-respecting BJJer would use so ineffective a technique.
If he’s choking you from the mount (by one of various means), his head will be right next to yours. You will have no room to throw an effective strike. If not his arms will be kept well away from where you can reach them, like in some sort of modified boxing or WC guard, or his chest will be right on your face with his arms right to the sides where you can’t reach them. Pretty hard to get decent punching leverage from here, certainly not with straight chain punches. Take your elbow away from your body, and the most basic attacks for him will be cross armbar, upper figure 4, collar choke, cross arm choke, or ground and pound with fists, elbows, forearms and head, thumbs in the eye, fishhooking, etc. per WC, and he is in a much better position to do that to you then you are to him.
“If he can reach my neck, I can reach his.”
You can, and by doing so will give him a perfect setup for the cross armbar.
There are shoots and shoots. I’ve met wrestlers who can fake a jab and shoot a double leg as fast as a competent boxer can throw a jab-cross. They are rare, but as someone said “expect the unexpected”. I’m not saying that WC WON’T work against a low shoot, just that it might not be as easy as some would like it to be.
"besides, is the one guy just going to stand there and watch while you try to get his friend into the mount? "
No. The knee ride position, however, is extremely useful for dealing with one grounded person if you are worried about it going multiple (which you always should). You can G&P from here, as well as apply chokes or joint attacks. You can be off and running in and instant. BJJ’s major weakness is multiple opponents. That said, only the best WC guys have any chance in making it work against two or more determined opp’s either.
I train standup and ground, but I also do interval sprints and improvised weapons because in a multiopponent situation that’s the most realistic defense. I regularly spend a half hour a week practicing knee ride switches and turns interspersed with punches and elbows on a heavy bag lyiung on the floor, too.
The more I train BJJ, the more I find similarities with WC. The forms have chokes, throws and takedowns, cutting armbars, arm drags, knee ride and more grappling techniques in them.
One needs to respect other arts rather than regarding them irrationally. The best MA instructors I know always look to build bridges between arts and their practitioners, not create divisions and mutual distrust based on ignorance.
Rene and azwingchun are correct.
www.combatcentres.com
Free hands charge in: Biu Jee or Phoenix Eye to his eyes. :eek: Repeat as needed.