1.The UFC was put together by Rorion Gracie
2.Royces 1st opponent was a so called champion boxer noone has even heard of
3.His 2nd opponent was Ken Shamrock,a shootwrestler which is known for fixed fights and now is in the WWF
4.When Rorion pulled out of the UFC,Royce pulled out
5.The Gracie instructional tapes are nothing but judo
6.Rickson Claims a 400-0 record,only 10 matches are documented
7.Rickson fights only japanese pro-wrestlers
8.Helio claims GJJ has been undefeated for 65 years when he only had 4 matches 2 of which he lost
really?
Wow, is that so? I didn’t know the Gracies organized the first UFCs - yeah, that would be a conflict of interest. Hadn’t heard this one yet…wonder why not?
“Who’s that trip-trapping on my bridge?”
Troll, troll, troll, troll, troll…
Thanks!
Sandman[Wing Chun]
Wing Chun Forum Moderator.
Student-www.authentickungfu.com
but arent these things true, at least some of them, i believe.
If by the word “scam” you mean that they:
1.)Put their style on the line against all commers and usually came out on top.
2.)Took a single aspect of combat (ground fighting)and elevated it to perhaps the highest level the world has ever seen.
3.)Single-handedly changed the landscape of the the martial arts worldwide. And
4.)Made all of us take a hard look at what we are doing and how we train.
Then, yes, I would have to agree.
Nice post.
Valraven
WHY DON’T YOU ISSUE A CHALLENGE TO THE GRACIES’AND SEE HOW YOU DO. 
I have no doubt some of what you say is true (in fact I know a few of those points are), but that doesn’t make bjj a scam by any means.
Is Gracie bjj the Ultimate MA? I certainly don’t think so. Does it contain a lot of effective techniques and methods? Yep.
And no matter what you believe, bjj is NOT the Biggest Scam in Martial Arts.
please quilfie world wide.
enjoy life
bamboo leaf
I believe most of those points are true, but so are Valraven’s…
Gracie BJJ is NOT “The Biggest Scam in Martial Arts”
Well here’s my take on this…
Royce pulled out of UFC but still fights in pride and competes in sport grapling. (although he hasn’t done that well lately)
Renzo Gracie has been competing in MMA consistantly for years. He wins most of the time but not always.
Renzo is a judo black belt as well as a BJJ black belt. He has also done some Muay Thai to improve his standup striking skills.
Gracie Jui-jitsu is very similar to modern judo becuase they have the same roots but there are some MAJOR differences as well. Anyone who has done both can explain them to you.
Ken Shamrock is a legit fighter… I dont believe for a second he threw that first UFC. He was just unprepared. Look at how much better he did in UFC 5!
The best under 200lb MMA fighter in the world right now is a japanese pro wrestler (SAK). Even though pro wrestling is also fixed in japan they are very serious about training for the real thing. They are known as some of the toughest guys around.
Bottom line.. There is a whole lot more to BJJ then Royce and UFC 1-5. Royce was never the best, even in his own family, nor did he claim to be.
BJJ people still win a lot of MMA events. They also loose a lot. We are all human…there is no ultimate super style that will defeat everyone all the time
BJJ helped put REALISM back into the martial arts!!!
You can troll all you want about BJJ being a scam, but the truth is whatever the Gracies did with the UFC or whatever…Gracie Jujitsu helped put alot of realism back into the martial arts. It made McDojo’s start having to take groundfighting seriously and start teaching all ranges of combat or their students would go somewhere else to learn groundfighting. It forced people with their heads in the clouds to stop practicing their flying, twin, monkey bites the buddhas ass techniques and start focusing on simple realistic things like how to defend against a takedown.
Gracie jujitsu also brought out the almost forgotten art of Catch-as-catch-can wrestling (American submission wrestling) out of the woodwork.
Gracie Jujitsu is definitly the most influencial martial art of the 90’s, and has done alot for martial artists everywhere in their quest to be taken seriously.
-jojitsu27
Jo’
You know all that is is crap.No responding no trolling.
Troll Killa For Life
There are a lot of negative claims regarding succesfull people. Hear them out, weigh the evidence and then write them off. I see no proof in either direction. I can appreciate what the Gracies have done for the martial arts (saved them from complacency.)but no one knows either way. The boxer doesn’t hold water because starting out, they probably coundn’t afford Mike Tyson to their then “little shindig” Either way boxers can’t wrestle or even kick so who cares.
8Step Sifu
Question for Waidan.
Aside from number 1 wich points are factual?You stated you know them to be true so please enlighten me with your premises.I’m not looking to argue so if you could please state your basis for believing the other 9 reasons Gracie Jiu-Jitsu is a scam.
What the Hell??
Who in God’s green Earth gave this P.O.S. thread 3 stars?! 
Any rating above (1=worst) was too high!
This thread…even from the title…is a non-contructive insult against some people. 
Someone gave this 3 stars?! You loser…this shouldn’t even rate 2 stars. What a waste of time. This isn’t helping anyone learn about martial arts! This is just bashing the Gracies. Why are you telling US?! Go tell the Gracies.
3 stars…geez…you amaze me.
What a waste of good stars. 
“There is only ONE karate”
One thing…
It does seem that BJJ/GJJ is as legit, or more so, as other MA. The only disappointing thing to me is the high cost of training at a GJJ center. I can train Judo/TJJ and Kung fu both for less than trainging one day/wk at GJJ (I train 4-5/wk).
Brett
Funny how all the GJJ goons squirm when they get a taste of their own medicine…
I am enjoying all the responses. They talk about trolling and even wasting stars, but Valraven is the only one to address the numbered points in the first post…
I have seen all the UFC’s and checked out the “greatest hits” tape recently. I had forgotten how embarrassing and repulsive it all was.
It seems that the main thing that GJJ has done is give belicose and frustrated highschool wrestlers a chance at being a “martial artist”, but then they feel they can on kung fu forums denigrating traditional arts… I think they deserve this…hahaha
Moq,
I said something to this effect a couple of months ago and got the entire JJ board on my ass. At least this time I will not be alone. 
And yes, the high school punk factor is in full gear on this board. This, however, is an obvious troll who just wants to incite a cyber riot. Fun none the less. Who knows, this might be a another “reverse troll”. Aimed at getting the KF guys to come calling. Yawn.
Its dangerous to think your immortal.
sif uabel@aol.com
Moq
you are a idiot.your analogy on wrestlers and bjj is extremely off base.Who are you talking about?
Oh great, here we go again…