fut sao wing chun?

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Wing Chun
21

Sam - Thanks much!

Rav - The Red Junk Opera Company was one of the Wandering Opera Troupes of Canton during the 1800s. They would travel between the towns of Siuhing (Zhaoqing), Faatsan (Foshan), Kwangchow (Canton, Guangzhou) performing for the villagers along the way (rich folk had their own companies 8).

On the Red Junks were White Crane boxers, Hung boxers, Hakka boxers, and others. Some of the opera roles were also martial. Wong Wah-Bo played to Mo-Sang (Martial Lead), Leung Yee Tai the Mo Deng (Female Martial Lead, played in drag because they were all male companies), Dai Fa Mim Kam played the Mo Jing (Martial Painted Face), etc. which all required knowledge of the more dynamic northern martial arts and weapons.

By the mid 1800s, the leader of the Red Junks was Lee Man-Mao, a white crane boxer. In support of the Taiping rebellion, under Chan Hoi, he led the Red Junk performers onto the streets of Foshan, in full costume, bearing Red Banners, and the Red Turban Rebellion began. They seized Foshan and made an attempt to seize Guangzhou as well. It failed, the rebellion failed, and the Qing retaliated by slaughtering the actors, burning down their docks, stages, and boats, and outlawing their performances. Those that survived joined other companies, left the province, made their living as street performers, or hid in the towns, like Foshan.

How Wing Chun Kuen arrived on the Red Junk (or if, in fact, it did and was not actually developed there) is a mystery to all. There are only legends, oral transmissions which mix in folk lore and pulp fiction. All we really know for sure is that after the destruction of the Red Junks, WCK is taught and appears for the first verifiable time off the Red Junks. It passed to Foshan apothecary Leung Jan, Foshan constable Fok Bo-Chuen, etc. and was also passed by Red Junk apprentices like Fung Siu-Ching in Foshan and Guangzhou, Cho Shun in Poon Yee (Panyu), etc.

From them come the modern lineages, like Yip Man, Sum Nung, Gulao, Cho, etc.

Rgds,

RR

22

Fut Sao

Hi Rene, and Sam
Rene, I know I promised you a copy of the tape I have of the history of Gu Yee Kuen (Fut Sao) that was recorded by a Dr. friend of Henry Leung, while Henry translated. This tape was made in Henry’s home before he moved to Queens I was present while it was being recorded.
Maybe the tape can explain the correct history of the Gu Yee Kuen system. I was was a student of Sifu Leung long before Santo or James. For about 2 years, after my regular job, I would work at Henry’s restaurant . His restaurant was called the ‘Yau Lei’ (Friendship Restaurant). When we closed the restaurant we would take the ‘L’ train to his apartment in Brooklyn where we would train until 2 or 3 AM. I remembered Santo from Duncan’s kwoon at 3 Great Jones St. So when he came to learn from Henry we had something in common. Also, Santo is Colombian so we spoke Spanish often. I really don’t remember if James or Santo was there first. Anyway, my point is that for everyday I trained with Henry Leung. When he moved to Putnam St in Ridgewood Queens he helped me get an apartment with my wife and children on the floor above him. I was with him EVERYDAY. I knew him when he was married to his first wife from Taiwan. And was still with him when he married a younger woman later. I was in the restaurant when he drew the Buddha hand with the "Fut Jyu’ (prayer beads) on a paper table mat in his restaurant. I still ahve some original logos that Henry made. He is a fantastic TCM doctor. I know, because I have asthma. Henry gave me treatments that always worked better than the Western meds I was using. (I was there when other TCM doctors would come by the restaurant and discuss medicine. They would sometimes remark about the ‘Hak Gwai’ (black devil) who was working in the kitchen. They didn’t know that I spoke Cantonese and Henry would laugh when I would come out of the kitchen to confront them). He even treated my kids. He was like a godfather to them. They would go down to his apartment to hang out often. I was studying acupuncture at the time. Henry helped me ace all of my tests. I had great respect for him. Henry’s restaurant was on Delancy street in Manhattan, a known prostitution area at the time. Henry is of small stature, but I witnessed him throw out a pimp who was harrassing one of the ladies of the night that frequented his restaurant. After I left, I was hired to manage the Soho Fitness Center. I was a student of William Cheung then. At the grand opening of the
fitness center we were having matial arts demo with a lot of law enforcemet people. Just before the event Henry, his wife, James, and another guy showed up. At that time an unfortuate incident happened between myself Henry Leung, and Sifu Cama. (Some years later I met Cama when we were judges for a Chi Sao event at a tourament and as far as I’m concerned the incident was forgotten). Anyway, words were exchanged because of something I said regarding Henry’s linage. I was approached by James. I walked over to Henry and said I would talk to him personally. We walked towards the dressing room. James and a friend of his followed behind me and Henry. About five of the officers, who were in karate Gi followed them. They were asked to leave. This all occurred because Henry told me one night, in his apartment, that his sifu, Gau Jee Fu Sao, took him into a locked room to learn a special techinque. But his sifu died before he finished his lesson. Henry then said that he couldn’t get out of the room. So his sifu through telepathy, taught him how to break the walls and get out. I left after he told me that.
PRedmond

23

Phil Redmond

Thanks much for sharing your views and perceptions honestly
and with grace

24

Honor

Yuanfen, I didn’t write this post to defame Henry Leung. It’s just that I know some things that most might not know about Henry Leung . All he had to do was be honest with me. It didn’t matter where he learned his kung fu. He never treated me different because I was not Chinese as the other sifus in NYC Chinatown treated me. I just saw too many flaws in the history he gave me.
I watched the transition as it progressed. Henry helped me in so many other ways. My college Chinese sucked until I met him. He helped me with my asthma. He treated my children like they were his grands. Maybe I’m just a little old fashioned. All he had to do was be real. Wing Chun has too much controversy to add any more. I hope he is doing well.
P Redmond
http://www.wingchunkwoon.com

25

Etiquette

My Sifu James Cama wishes to make a statement.

It is regretable that personal history has to be aired out in public. I have remained silent for almost two decades about these incidents. As is well documented I have always believed as my Sifu’s proven that hands tell and you must have the Kung Fu no matter what the art or lineage. The only thing I can say to Mr. Redmond (Bilal) is that proper etiqette is to remain silent and not lose face for your previous Sifu and style are also part of your personal history. Remember Philip when I asked you face to face if the special skills you were taught and never seen before in any other Wing Chun system were due to Henry Leung Sifu and Fut Sao. You replied yes. I asked you if you had ever seen any other Sifu perform the feats you have seen with your own eyes that Henry Leung Sifu has done. You said no you haven’t. As far as the history I gave an explanation in above posts through my student Sam as to why Fut Sao is unique and not part of the other Wing Chun lineage’s. I cannot speak for Henry Leung Sifu but will say that he told me that he purposefully withheld information because of oaths he took to his Sifu not to disclose the origins. You know he has the precious stone in which the names of his predesessors are carved. If you wish to believe in another lineage that’s fine but do not knock ours for there are many holes in the popular beliefs which are coming to light. As you said we met at the tournament and were gentlemen lets leave it at that and not air out bad blood.

James Cama

26

Dear all,

It was not my intention to start controversy or the facilitate the airing of dirty laundry in this thread. While the history of Wing Chun interests me (many thanks to RR), the main focal point of my question was that I was curious about the fighting skills of the system. So far, no one has raised any doubts as to the skills of Sifu Leung or Sifu Cama, so I shall continue to seek instruction in this lineage.

Many thanks to all who replied. You’re input was greatly appreciated.

27

Transmission

I believe that Henry Leung Sifu was speaking of a transmission which is documented in the venerable Hsu Yun’s own words :
The Master was ninety-two in 1931, and was esteemed as the leader of Ch’an School of Buddhism. He taught that the method of attaining the One lay in Pointing to the heart; seeing the nature and becoming a Buddha; a method which is not dependent on language, but which is mind-to-mind transmission.
In accordance to this Henry Leung Sifu was describing this transmission and the breaking down of the walls was a metaphor for the breaking through to the other side (Enlightenment).

28

I think that Phil and Sam have both made their points and I think that we should move on. Nothing wrong with explaining views on
lineage within reason.

29

Whippinghand - ???

“Economy of energy…” - save some of your own.

30

Sam - no offense taken.

I’ve met a couple of Henry Leung’s students recently in our school. Nice guys.

31

I have heard all sorts of things about fut sao wc. In one article in IKF there was even a story that one could break the inside of a brick w/out damaging the outside…or something to that effect

From the above posts I take it that Chi Kung is part of the curriculum and can be utilized in fut sao’s techniques.

can Rene or anybody who knows firsthand such as Phil or Sam tell me with total honesty if this is true. I’m not talking about technique over strength but feats made possible by something other than physical ability.

If this were true, it would be the only wing chun lineage with internal aspects

32

Originally posted by mun hung
“Economy of energy…” - save some of your own.

Sorry if it hits a sore spot, Pete.

33

whippinghand

Ha! Poor attempt. (yawning) Get a life. :rolleyes:

34

A great quote I once heard was that if all the old “Qigong” tricks were real, China would win every event in every Olympics.

Part is probably very high skill, part is probably student awe (to a primitive, a radio could be magic or even the voice of the divine), and part is probably urban legend (“heard that this one sifu could teleport…”)

There are magicians and yogi who can do some pretty wild things. Why not some who practice martial arts as well?

Never seen anything I was at a loss to understand in real life, but who knows?

Empty Cup- I’m not sure how people define “internal” any more, so can’t really comment on what may or may not be “internal WCK”. Every branch has people who call what they do “internal”. Sum Nung and Pan Nam both have added Qigong sets (Sun Hei Gwai Yuen and Ng Jee Mui Fa Hei Gung respectively).

Rgds,

RR