[QUOTE=Syn7;1034210]is competing in push hands not contrary to Taoist beliefs??? Taosim is non competetive in nature, so it always seemed weird to me to see these comps… even the very conservative ones… but these newschool more liberal extreme push hands and all that, does this not move away from the central beliefs surrounding the art in the first place??? why not just be a judoka, no shame in that…
sorry if i offend, im not trying to be a **** or start arguments. its just that my understanding of taoism tells me that this runs against the grain…[/QUOTE]
I think you have a misunderstanding of Tao. Although Taoism is a philosophy with many different branches from sober thinking to outright nuttiness, not all of them actually follow or have a comprehensive understanding of the principles of Tao.
Competitiveness is clearly illustrated within the symbol Yin-Yang, but more important than that, it is a natural process of nature that may be directly observed by anyone. Tao IS the natural process. It is not something imposed from above like a God imposing his will onto creation. If one wants to understand Tao all one need do is observe it directly.
Nowhere in nature is competitiveness absent. Every animal/organism competes for its survival and for the opportunity to reproduce. Competitiveness, then, is a natural process of Tao; one that should be embraced and understood within its proper context.
The principles I think you may be referring too are the ones that advise avoiding direct conflict when it is not expedient or of clear benefit to do so. In other words, dont stand in front of a rushing 300# man thinking you can stop him from running into a busy street. But you could certainly stand in front of your 2 year old child in order to stop him from running into a busy street. One will run you over, the other will not
The relationship between you and the other person in both instances is a competitive one. In each case the other person has an intention to perform an action and you have a contrary intention to stop them. These two intentions are a conflict, Yin and Yang. You may attempt to stop the running man by trying to convince him of the error of his actions, but this too is a competition, the only difference is discussion is competitiveness within the arena of reason rather than physical action.
The principle of avoiding foolish/unproductive competition is rooted within the principle of conservation of energy. One of the foundational principles of Taoism is to avoid wasting energy/resources. If you are going to get plowed down when attempting to stop the #300 man by stepping in front of him, you are wasting your energy in the attempt.
One of the purposes of Tai Chi is to train yourself to succeed in physical conflict by using the least amount of energy necessary in order to accomplish your goal of defending yourself and/or others. In order to obtain the proper experience, one must, of necessity, put oneself into circumstances that allow you to be challenged. Formal competitions are one method of accomplishing this. However inadequate these events are in actually simulating real life circumstances they are still intended to help practitioners develop their skills. And they are fun, and there is nothing wrong with fun. 
[QUOTE=bawang;1034216]i have personally spoken to the jade emperor last november and he told me its ok to compete. i also talked to the celestial masters and theyre cool wit it also. so i dont see a problem. i think ur overreacting, or maybe intimidated by their manliness[/QUOTE]
Who wouldn’t be intimidated by the stench of manliness emanating from you…or is it that smell of garlic?:eek:
