I think Laterthannever means dosage like putting 30gms of zhang nao in a jow is crazy
Like my teacher says “The difference between poison and medicine is dosage” but I think he was referring to the hairy palm technique
In China, typically each kung fu school will have different Dit Da Jow formulas to address the different types of injuries their respective styles cause based on its combat and strike principles. Focus can be on the extremities, internal chest cavity, head region, injuries to joints, muscles, etc. This is why the herbal ingredients will differ from formula to formula. Each formula is made with specific issues to address in mind. Other than the generic Dit Da Jow formula (discussed in the next paragraph), it is not customary to have an all-encompassing and STRONG formula to address the majority of issues, and certainly not one that contains very toxic herbs, most of which are used to address pain and/or infections.
At the same time, a basic formula is also made up to address the common injury and will use baseline yet powerful ingredients such as San Qi, Ru Xiang, Mo Yao. These formulas are normally very safe, especially when applied topically, and often form the base for a lot of over-the-counter Dit Da Jows that are available in the market. They are also frequently modified to address specific types of ailments, and this is where it gets tricky and potentially harmful if the person is not familiar with herbs. Not only can herbs be toxic on their own, but they can be toxic when combined with other herbs. Also keep in mind that even though the Jows are applied topically on skin (that is not open), nonetheless they are still absorbed through the skin via the pores and into the body. Hence, one needs to use toxic herbs like the ones discussed in this thread along with other toxic ones like Tian Nan Xing very carefully. And if the person is not familiar with Chinese herbs, then it is highly recommended that any custom formulation be critiqued by someone who knows Chinese herbs intimately before embarking on making the formula or doing a treatment.
I was sure there was a thread that addressed what I’m going to ask, but I can’t find it…sorry to make you repeat yourself…
I’m going to be placing an order with you in the near future, but I don’t know much at all about dit da…
I assume that for hand training (iron palm too, but more specifically eagle claw training) I should be using an Iron palm formula, but do you recommend “Black Hand: Advanced Iron Palm Liniment,” or “Premade Chan Ning Tong: Iron Palm Medicine”
Also, I’m not sure what to use for forearm and shin conditioning…which of your products do you recommend for this?
Hey there
Many people use soaks for finger training but you can use a strong dit da jow
The black hand can be used for hand and arm training as well as shin training
Well, obviously no major developments so far (I’ll get back to you in six months), but it seems to be working just great. Certainly better than the arnica I’ve been getting by with until now. :o My Shifu tried it out–he approved.
Thanks again, I’ll let you know when I have more ‘concrete’ evidence. (Nah, I’m just kidding, I don’t really expect I’ll get into breaking, I’m just looking to toughen up some…I’d like to get to where I can spar with a tree without having to be careful, that would suffice for me. )
Looking for a beginners Dit Da Jow for Iron Palm training, and other misc. questions.
From looking around and doing research on these subjects, I have been continuously reverted back to this site. So why not join?
What Im after is a Jow that is used for Iron palm. So it would be for conditioning, strengthening, opening channels, and promoting blood flow and energy.
What Im going to do is get a more advanced formula ( Most likely Ku Yu Cheong Jow , the full version ) and let it sit for a while. I know they pretty much reach their max potential within 6 mths, but why not let it sit a bit longer? While that Jow is being extracted/set up, Id like to get one that is pre-made for the time being.
I know about Plum Dragon and Coiling Dragon, and I have been in contact with them via e-mail. They have both been of much help, and being very patient with me. What I’d like to know is what would the other guys recommend for a beginner’s Jow that is already pre-made and ready to roll ( from an online vendor ). I’d like to use this for now ( the beginning stages ) and in case if ( also to replace for the time being ) I ever get any type of cut on my hands while Im using a Jow with any toxic herbs in it.
Lastly, if you have any more advanced Jow formulations that you would like to share with me, post em up.
Thanks!
edit: In the Ku Yu Cheong Jow, I see that there is the following:
Bai Hua She
Tu Bie Chong
Wu Ling Zhi
I was wondering how these should be prepared? Just coarsely grind them with a mortar and pestle? Cut them up a bit?
And I know for all of the other herbs, they should just be coarsely ground.
I think you have contacted two respected people in the field of jow and iron palm, so i’m not sure what else you’re seeking. I would presume that most here would recommend them anyway.
Like Brule said, we’re all going to recommend one or the other.
I have experience with Dale’s IP jow. His jow works the best of any i’ve used and he’s always more than happy to answer any questions you might have in relation to either Bagua or Traditional Chinese Medicine.
Even if his jow WASN’T the best I have used(although it definitely IS) the entire experience of dealing with a knowledgeable TCM doctor, Bagua instructor, and all-around nice guy is more than worth the small price of his herbs.
Theres nothing wrong with heating the alcohol before adding it to the herbs. This is not strictly speaking, “cooking the herbs” but it does help to jumpstart the aging process and should not damage any of the more volatile herbs which might be damaged from a more thorough cooking process.
[QUOTE=David Jamieson;1139386]Cooking anything will reduce and make stronger the efficacy but it also reduce content[/QUOTE]For what its worth, the original poster isnt referring to cooking, rather just heating the alcohol before adding it to the herbs. This will not cause any reduction to occur.
There is a supposed “grandmaster” claiming to have Chinese Herbal Medicine training who teaches people to boil their herbs in alcohol for 2 hours. This would destroy all the volatile oils which many herbs contain and render them useless.
This is something you do not want to do for any reason what so ever.
Heating alcohol up is very very dangerous.
You do not EVER bring 20% or higher alcohol content to a boil no matter who is telling you. If you are using a gas stove and heat high proof alcohol you are going to blow up the kitchen, start a serious fire, and maybe get seriously burned in the process.
Many people will boil water and after it comes to a boil place their alcohol containers into the water with any caps off to ensure the pressure will not cause the containers to explode. This hot solvent will then do its work.
When you grind up the herbs and help break down the cell walls in the herbs, adding this to hot booze makes for more surface area on the herbs able to release their active components to the solution of the heated solvent.
Cold soaking is considered foundational and creates decent liniments.
Heating your alcohol will create something a little stronger.
I cook my liniments over 1-2 day process.
Certain herbs are added, certain cooking times are used for the various herbs.
The outcome is something much more complex than mere cold soaking. I can create almost a different formula when cooking one recipe and cold soaking the same herbs.
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