[QUOTE=MasterKiller;770996]Show me.
In fact, how about a clip of you demonstrating?[/QUOTE]Which type of guard?? Half , full , butterfly…??? F#CK IT I WILL POST THEM ALL! I will get a partner, film it, and then post it . May take a day or two.I have been having trouble with uploading and down loading on my computer.
[QUOTE=Shaolin Wookie;770994]BTW, there was a dude there with one arm that was severed at the elbow, and he was awesome, because he had mastered using leverage. But if I broke his one good hand, he’d be ****ed.[/QUOTE]
Still Lmao @ You!!!
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;770997]And all the Chin Na in the world is useless without a system for training positional dominance, which CMA does not have because it was never the focus of Chinese systems in the first place.[/QUOTE] Guess you must still be a beginner or just a keyboard martial artist.!
[QUOTE=tattooedmonk;770998]Which type of guard?? Half , full , butterfly…??? F#CK IT I WILL POST THEM ALL! I will get a partner, film it, and then post it . May take a day or two.I have been having trouble with uploading and down loading on my computer.[/QUOTE]
OK, and please explain which form you trained these positions in, and demonstrate the form. Also, I’m sure you have the Chinese expressions for “full guard,” “butterfly guard,” and “half-guard” at your disposal, since you will be showing pure CMA techniques designed to escape these positions.
[QUOTE=tattooedmonk;771000]Guess you must still be a beginner or just a keyboard martial artist.![/QUOTE]
ANYTIME you want to find out, I will be a gracious host.
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;771002]ANYTIME you want to find out, I will be a gracious host.[/QUOTE] LMAO @ YOU ,STILL!!!
You’re the joke, bro. Too bad you haven’t realized it yet.
well, this is the funniest thread ive read through in a while. keep going, very interested to see those clips… lol
[QUOTE=tattooedmonk;770972]I do not believe that this is correct. It just does not fall into accordance with Chinese philosophies.
If kung fu is well rounded and is based on Taoist yinyang principle then there would be many combinations. yang yang or both standing( greater yang ), yin yang one grounded and one standing ( lesser yin), yang yin one standing and one grounded (lesser yang ), or yin yin both grounded (greater yin).
This is the greater and lesser aspects of yinyang principle.
The combinations of yin yang or yang yin would be determined by which of the fighters was the weaker or stronger one on the ground or standing up.[/QUOTE]
I believe Masterkiller is right on the money. It’s “culturally” not preferrable (ungentleman like behavior) to wrestle a down opponent. There is no binding “philosophies” to say that TCMA should not or thou shalt not ground fight using TCMA. However, there isn’t yet a TCMA style that have developed a proficient ground fighting (positional dominance) methodology. Most styles have something as Masterkiller have said pop up from the ground, ground kicks, or ground & pound. There are some rudimentary side control/knee on belly esque and primitive mount stuff but not enough to rival BJJ ground grappling specialist IMHO.
I also believe that it is a gross misuse of the Yinyang principle here. Yinyang and Wuxing theories, or worldview of Yijing (classic of change) for that matter, can definitely be applied in groundfighting. But that’s for people who are interested in more advanced academic pursuit once they have a solid working knowledge of ground fight (positional dominance with submission skill). It is not as superficial as outlined I would caution. It doesn’t really help to mystify both fighting and philosophical work even if it is possible to consolidated as one IMHO.
Just a thought
Mantis108
The principles of stand up fighting with taijiquan can easily be applied to ground fighting, epecially when you are on the bottom, whether on your back or not.
In taijiquan, the maximum number of things you do is absorption, redirection and attack. In many styles, like krav maga, western boxing, etc. you are taught to sidestep the attack and then, attack. Well, when you’re on your back, you can’t sidestep, but you can redirect an attack and then, attack, wether your attacker is on the ground with you or still upright when you’re on the ground.
I will use …
Ba Gua Zhang alone to prove that CMA has groundwork. I will use the philosophical , psychological and the physiological aspects of Taoism to prove what should already be known to the practitioners and masters of this art.
…By the way, there is nothing mystical about it.
I could also use ground dragon , monkey, and many other styles.
Yin /yang principle can be used to describe all the dual aspects of our existence.
Standup fighting / groundfighting. Real basic ,not too hard to figure out, and is exactly how it is used.
I am truelly amazed about the fact that this aspect of the art is soooooo lost or unheard of by all of you.
Guess your schools do not teach the 3 “p’s” of the arts. The philosophy of Taoism alone rules the Internal arts.
This is tooo funny.
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;770999]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWhByQuLSPI[/QUOTE]
I always thought that guy was amazing, seriously.
Didn’t know he was from Athens, though. I went to college at UGA in Athens.
Please…
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;770999]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWhByQuLSPI[/QUOTE]
Notice, however, you droll naysayers, how poorly that same submission wrestler fared in a full contact tournament against a stand-up Chinese martial artist:
Think about it…
…and look at the symbols that represent Taoism, Tai Ji , Xin Yi ,and Bagua. Those are the strategic patterns used in all Chinese “Kung Fu”. They are not two dimensional. They are MULTI -DIMENSIONAL. Explore the quantum mind and you will know the TRUTH.
A right angle is a right angle no matter which plane you are on …XYZ!!
Saying you can take stand-up principles and apply them on the ground (which is wrong, anyway) is not the same as having a ground fighting system.
[QUOTE=RonH;771016]The principles of stand up fighting with taijiquan can easily be applied to ground fighting, epecially when you are on the bottom, whether on your back or not.[/QUOTE]
How often do you do it? How much of your class time is spent exploring Tai Chi principles against wrestlers…against submission experts?
How often do you even fight full-contact stand-up in your Tai Chi class?
tatooedmonk
I think just about anyone who knows what they are talking about is lauging at you right now.
In the book Chinese Fast Wrestling, Liang Shou Yu shows a guard pass that would result in the guard passer being caught in a triangle.
It was a good effort, but he didn’t discuss the detail that you need to pin the opposite leg down when passing.
Hmmm…
[QUOTE=bodhitree;771032]tatooedmonk
I think just about anyone who knows what they are talking about is lauging at you right now.
In the book Chinese Fast Wrestling, Liang Shou Yu shows a guard pass that would result in the guard passer being caught in a triangle.
It was a good effort, but he didn’t discuss the detail that you need to pin the opposite leg down when passing.[/QUOTE] I doubt it.
Would or could result??
I would not make the same mistake.
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;771029]Saying you can take stand-up principles and apply them on the ground (which is wrong, anyway) is not the same as having a ground fighting system.[/QUOTE]Whatever… you have no clue and stop acting like you do. you are looking at it from a modern sport perspective not from a ancient combat and philosophical perspective . The ground fighting aspects are inherent in the systems of Kung Fu.
Get a clue.
Have you ever rolled with wrestlers, bjjers, judoka, samboists, etc., ? I really doubt it.