It’s obvious that BJJ fills in the holes of most Kung Fu styles. So should Kung Fu styles add BJJ to their arts, or leave them incomplete?
Like Bruce Lee said, “You must first fill the holes in your cup with clay before you can fill it with water and drink”. So do you add BJJ (clay) to kung fu(the cup)? 
Actually you got it backwards. There haven’t been any pure traditional BJJ fighters for decades. They all realized to keep winning they would have to crosstrain. Those guys need to learn some good ol’ kung fu.
Rouge, you can be a lttle trouble maker sometimes.:mad:
I think it’d be a good idea for anyone to cross train and make sure they can fight on the ground, and likewise, I think a ground fighter shoudl learn to fight standing up. The reason why a lot of BJJers win fights is cause a lot of people aren’t used to being on the ground and rely too much on their “anti-grappling” techniques that they feel there is no need to learn grappling.
fu ck bjj.
lets see anyone get close enough to my crotch to do a double leg.
rotting orbs style baby.
That question was sort of like can syncronized swimming save rugby.
Personally, I think Sincronized Swimming CAN infact save rugby. It develops the body in a whole new way that Rugby players never even thought about before . It will make them stronger, faster, and give them more endurace becasue it’s harder to move through water, than it is air. 
:eek:
Actually, Kung Fu does not need BJJ. We already have our own VERY Brutal ground fighting methods in our system. It’s so brutal infact, it’s banned in our own competitons.
If BJJ would do anything for us, it would give us a more toned down, less Brutal way of winning ground confrontations so we don’t have to crush opponents ribcages and send them out on stretchers to win a match.
COULD YOU NOT BE SO FU CKING BRUTAL FOR ONCE??
heh.
if i’m not in a ring, i’d rather stay on my feet.
that is all.
yeah, but you may not always stay on your feet…
you’re right. there are no absolutes in a real fight.
i’m not saying it’s not useful, but i’d rather train to stay on my feet more than anything else though.
[insert multiple attackers/people stampeding/detritus on the ground/midgets with magical +5 batons of hades argument here]
JUJITFU?..
Too brutal for most. :eek:
BJJ and the UFC are the best things to happen to kung fu in decades!!!
Thank you Bjj and the UFC/Pride championships!
For too long kung fu ppl have lived in this dream world of deadly techniques that they’ve never even tried.Sparring with gloves heavy padding and pretty much kick boxing.Everyone believing the hype about how kung fu is deadly stuff and you can’t practice the techniques because you’ll kill your partner.:rolleyes:
Well thank’s to Bjj ppl in the kung fu dream world are getting a rude wake up call.In order for any technique to work you have to practice it.You can’t do a form a number of times and expect the techniques to jump out when you need them.So because of the UFC/Pride ppl are waking up and starting to train harder.
So even though we have’nt fared well in the UFC/Pride we’re getting ppl to look at their training and more themselves.
jeff:)
Ah Jmd,
We knew all that already. We just don’t belive going to the ground is practical, in a real fight. When we do, It’s to quickly crush them and move on, not stay there and make love to them.
As for the not doing good in UFC, seriously, how many Kung Fu guys even bother with that venue? a small handfull?? The FEW that have have all been modernly trained. You can see it in their tactics (Or lack there of). Good Kung Fu is usually seen in Kuo Shou or San Shou. San Shou is mre modern, and you see a good number of modernlybtrained guys fighting in there, but many of them are still traditionally trained fighters that just conform to the modern rules.
UFC is no more relity than what we do, and neither are thier training mehtods. It’s all the same Shit.
okay, you guys need to make up your minds… san shou is kung fu… san shou isn’t kung fu…
Ah Jmd,
We knew all that already. We just don’t belive going to the ground is practical, in a real fight. When we do, It’s to quickly crush them and move on, not stay there and make love to them.
Ah Royal Dragon,
That is alot easier said then done.A lot of things are not practical in a fight ,but that does’nt stop them from happening.
As for the not doing good in UFC, seriously, how many Kung Fu guys even bother with that venue? a small handfull?? The FEW that have have all been modernly trained. You can see it in their tactics (Or lack there of). Good Kung Fu is usually seen in Kuo Shou or San Shou. San Shou is mre modern, and you see a good number of modernlybtrained guys fighting in there, but many of them are still traditionally trained fighters that just conform to the modern rules
Well i was using the UFC as an example.There are many other NHB tournaments that kung fu ppl do enter into.That is true not many “Traditional” kung fu ppl would enter those type of contest,but lets be for real how many ppl train the traditional way today?
Not many!
UFC is no more relity than what we do, and neither are thier training mehtods. It’s all the same ****.
I never said it was reality!
What i said was it made ppl in the kung fu dream world wake up.Would’nt you agree that’s a good thing?
Because kung fu and i mean all of kung fu has a bad rep now from the few half ass trained ppl who try to represent kung fu.
jeff:)
Originally posted by Royal Dragon
[B]Ah Jmd,
We knew all that already. We just don’t belive going to the ground is practical, in a real fight. When we do, It’s to quickly crush them and move on, not stay there and make love to them.[/b]
-
you may be taken to the ground, as opposed to you taking it there.
-
when you are there, what are you gonna do?
-
it doesn’t take much to snap a limb.
As for the not doing good in UFC, seriously, how many Kung Fu guys even bother with that venue? a small handfull?? The FEW that have have all been modernly trained. You can see it in their tactics (Or lack there of). Good Kung Fu is usually seen in Kuo Shou or San Shou.
yeah, it seems that that’s ALWAYS the case…
San Shou is mre modern, and you see a good number of modernlybtrained guys fighting in there, but many of them are still traditionally trained fighters that just conform to the modern rules.
many of the mma guys around are traditionally trained, or have been at some point in time - judo, karate, aikido, pure bjj, etc…
UFC is no more relity than what we do, and neither are thier training mehtods. It’s all the same Shit.
From what I’ve seen, big difference in the training methods. Which is understandable, since the goal is different, and they attract different types of practitioners.
Originally posted by Royal Dragon and SevenStar
We knew all that already. We just don’t belive going to the ground is practical, in a real fight. When we do, It’s to quickly crush them and move on, not stay there and make love to them.
[b]1. you may be taken to the ground, as opposed to you taking it there.
-
when you are there, what are you gonna do?
-
it doesn’t take much to snap a limb.[/b]
As for the not doing good in UFC, seriously, how many Kung Fu guys even bother with that venue? a small handfull?? The FEW that have have all been modernly trained. You can see it in their tactics (Or lack there of). Good Kung Fu is usually seen in Kuo Shou or San Shou.
yeah, it seems that that’s ALWAYS the case…
San Shou is mre modern, and you see a good number of modernlybtrained guys fighting in there, but many of them are still traditionally trained fighters that just conform to the modern rules.
many of the mma guys around are traditionally trained, or have been at some point in time - judo, karate, aikido, pure bjj, etc…
UFC is no more relity than what we do, and neither are thier training mehtods. It’s all the same ****.
From what I’ve seen, big difference in the training methods. Which is understandable, since the goal is different, and they attract different types of practitioners.
SevenStar,
All of those are good points bro!
I don’t know why others in kung fu can’t see that.They use the same excuses all the time.I’ve spent 18yrs in kung fu i’m not dumb or blind. Although i think many others in kung fu must be.
jeff:)
<sigh>
i recently visited this forum for the first time in months b/c i couldn’t remember why i stopped… now i know.. but there r times like these, far and few between, where i do have some time to utterly amuse myself w/ these kinds of debates.. so here goes…
i think that JMD made a valid point. to me i’ve learnt that kung fu training is a continuous viscious cylce of struggle and progress. meanin that no matter how much u train, or what level u’ve achieved, there is always more to learn and higher levels to achieve. and even if u think u’ve achieved those levels, there’s still new things to pioneer!
but the underlying concept that allows u to truly evaluate and enhance ur ability is TRUTH! u must be able to evaluate and express urself honestly, or else ur simply holdin urself back from really advancing. JMD basically is sayin that most peoples ego’s get in their own way and don’t allow them to train like they could to be @ the level that they might THINK they’re @.
royal dragon also made a good point in that honestly, to try to incorporate BJJ into our trainin would prolly not do much but degrade our actual trainin. i would equate it to wong fei hung takin up kickboxing lessons, or chang tung sheng(the recently passed famous shuai chiao master) taking up judo lessons. both of these masters trained properly the concepts and techniques of their arts and have proved their street effectiveness countless times. why would they try to soften what they’ve learned for sport purposes?
shuai chiao teaches u things like throwin someone on their head hard the moment they touch u. is this allowed in pride, UFC, or any other sanctioned event for that matter? no b/c in reality, that kinda thing causes SERIOUS damage and carries serious reprocussions, but would preserve ur own life.
so conclusively, like i said, if TRAINED PROPERLY, and evaluated honestly, CMA’s could bring themselves to these levels and would be able to preserve their life w/o havin to go elsewhere to cross-train(i’m not against it, i jus don’t feel its necessary and that was the questioned posted).
btw- BJJ may teach me how to subdue joe blow. but what about when his brothers james and jack jump in to help him? if u can show me ANY material where it documents how to handle mutliple opponents, then maybe we’ll talk… jus my thoughts(this should get fun 
)
Regarding San shou..
but many of them are still traditionally trained fighters that just conform to the modern rules.
When was the last time a “traditionally trained” fighter defeated a student of a known sanshou team/coach ?
Kung fu is trying to ride on the coat tails of san shou as proof that they have credibility.