Originally posted by mysteri
…btw- BJJ may teach me how to subdue joe blow. but what about when his brothers james and jack jump in to help him? if u can show me ANY material where it documents how to handle mutliple opponents, then maybe we’ll talk… jus my thoughts(this should get fun )
BJJ will teach you to and how to get the **** up when you are held on the ground and bother James starts beats the sh!t out of you.
Few people in the grappling and fewer in the MMA community dispute the FACT that no one style or range of combat is enough. You may want to stay standing but your striking abilities are worthless if you are just going to be takendown and not be able to get back up. The best strikers in MMA spend half their time on stuff they don’t WANT to use in a fight but rather what they NEED for a fight.
You can’t BS reality and I think that is what many arts try to do when they train ground fighting. If you want to learn it why does it matter if they best instructor in the world is 1) Russian, Japanese, Brazilian or a farmboy in Iowa 2) has absolutely no lineage.
You talk about honesty. Well honesty does not lie in one style, be it Kung Fu, Karate, BJJ, Muay Thai, Judo, Hapkido, etc etc.
Originally posted by truewrestler your striking abilities are worthless if you are just going to be takendown and not be able to get back up.
Why do ppl think you can’t strike from the ground?
If you can’t strike while you’re on the ground.Then you were never a striker to begin with!
That is something ppl are saying and it’s not true.I can strike effectively on the ground on my back in a mounted position.It might not have the power of a strike standing,but a knuckle strike to the sternum does’nt need that much power to have an effect.It’s also well in reach while being mounted.I don’t know why strikers feel if they get taken down and mounted they have to go for the eyes?
Why do ppl think you can’t strike from the ground?
If you can’t strike while you’re on the ground.Then you were never a striker to begin with!
That is something ppl are saying and it’s not true.I can strike effectively on the ground on my back in a mounted position.It might not have the power of a strike standing,but a knuckle strike to the sternum does’nt need that much power to have an effect.It’s also well in reach while being mounted.I don’t know why strikers feel if they get taken down and mounted they have to go for the eyes?
jeff:) [/B]
You are BSing reality and yourself…and you were talking about HONESTY?
When was the last time a “traditionally trained” fighter defeated a student of a known sanshou team/coach ?
My question is valid and it emphasises a point that every combat sport fighter makes in stating why we dominate traditional fighters.
Why do ppl think you can’t strike from the ground?
This is an example of the problem.
You just don’t understand because you don’t train in grappling..
I’ts not about striking from the ground. It’s a matter of striking from an inferior position.
A grappling problem requires a grappling solution..
You’ve not going to strike your way out of being mounted, side mounted, scarf hold, north/south etc..
and the name calling and insults do nothing to further your cause or help your credibility. On the contrary. they appear like childish barbs of frustration.
I think that sanshou does train traditionally (if we don’t distort the meaning of traditionally) which is to say, hard and live. That’s pretty much what matters right there.
How do you root your punches while on your back? How do you chamber from a mounted position? Where does the motion begin and end, and how does it gain power? These are the relevant questions to striking on the ground.
1:06 is a nice example. I can tell you that out of thousands of MMA fights I not heard of a single one that was won from under the mount with strikes and only a handful won from the bottom period with strikes.
It’s obvious that many many many people have subpar teachers.That is the reason people don’t understand their techniques.If you understand your techniques you can apply them from a “inferior position” with great effect.
I used to wrestle so i have some knowledge of grappling.Is it the level of a Bjj or judo master?
No of course not!
But i do know how to grapple pretty well.The question you ask i have no idea about the answer.Because there is no way for you or i to know every result to every San Shou fight held around the world. Because you might not know how to strike your way out of those positions does not mean it can’t be done!
That’s the problem ppl feel because they can throw a punch that makes them a striker.
It does’nt!!!
There’s alot more like bringing out the power in strikes hand and knuckle conditioning and more.A good striker is not just someone that can throw a good punch,but that’s all most that have’nt been trained right can do.You’re right the name calling was very childish!
But so is saying Kung fu is trying to ride on the coat tails of san shou as proof that they have credibility.Kung fu does’nt need San Shou to have credibility.It’s withstood the sands of time that alone gives it credibility.
Grappling is not new!
There’s a reason it was underground search and see why.You might be surprised!
Originally posted by truewrestler only a handful won from the bottom period with strikes.
So that proves it can be done don’t you think?
I’m not saying it’s something that everyone can pull off because not everyone trains the same.But for those that train for it and know how and where to strike it can be done.What you just said proves it can.You have to understand.I know very few in kung fu train the way they are supposed to that includes many sifu and so called masters.But there are some no matter how few that do train the proper way and technique.We are in that few when it comes to training.Black Tiger is known for it’s tough training and conditioning.This is not a guess i’ve done it so i know what i’m speakinhg about!
Whether you guys believe it or not really does’nt matter to me! I’m just telling you it can be done.
I’m in the mount position. My knees are tucked under your triceps, my base is wide and stable and my weight is upon your chest.
My arms are free you attempt to strike my sternum. (a horrible idea, but then agin you’re in a horrible position so this is def desperation at it’s best (and I’ll give you the nod here, sometimes you’ll try anything in a fight to get out of a bad spot.)
You punch up (with no true power) I parry, push your arm above your head and apply an ude garami that breaks your arm.
If you continue to struggle and buck..
I slide down to your hips, grapevine your legs, and then begin the systematic destruction of your soft tissue using my hands, elbows.
In your terrified and thouroughly maddened state, you feel as if you must survive this encounter or fear dying. You reach up to grab anything possible to damage me.
I secure your arm and break it (the other one or “again”?)
can you see how
Grappling problem calls for grappling solution?
You - bridge, upa and buck me off. (or if you’re even better knee/elbow escape to your guard. but that’s harder to do in a self defense situation..)
You land in my guard, but it’s a hell of a lot better place than where you were. (chances are if you don’t act fast from here I’m going to sweep you back over again and this time I’ll hook in so that you can’t bridge.
So what you’re saying is you have techniques that work 100% of the time?
Congratulations Bro!
You are the only person i know that has those odds.We can go back and forth all day with counters to each others keyboard grappling striking battle.I’m saying that i can and have striked from that position and it has worked.Nothing is 100% effective all the time,but i only mentioned 1 strike or method.There are others.
JMD, more than 20 years in martial arts (all Kung Fu?) and you are spouting this BS?
I give you an example of a bad strategy… striking from the bottom. I say that it worked a handful out of thousands of times and you say “see, I told you so”.
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