I was just wondering if anyone thinks that wing chun is compatible with tai chi? The reason I ask is because I don’t have a sifu to train wing chun with and my friend is too busy. I want to keep learning and I progress much more in the guidance of a sifu. There is a good tai chi sifu here and memorizing the movemetns of the forms is no big deal for me. Do you think it will help my wc? I know that my stance will be better and my sensitivity. I’m not looking to “combine” this style with that, I just want to keep learning. I don’t really have a choice.
Although I have not studied Tai-Chi I believe that the energy each art uses is quite different - WC using forward or neutral energy while Tai Chi uses various other types of non-neutral and somewhat lateral energy. If this is the case then I would tend to think that the two are not exactly what I would call compatible in theory, structure and application - not that that would stop many ‘mixers’ from combining the two anyway
cha kuen- wing chun and taichi involve quite differnt body mechanics. If you dont have a good wing chun sifu but have access toa good taichi sifu who knows fighting applicationa as well- seize the time.
BTW, memorizing forms is not enough. Each motion has to be understood deeply.
Joy is correct. IME WCK and Taijiquan use different “engines” to solve similar problems. If you mean compatible in terms of blending the two together, several people have done this over the years, with the results varying. Some do Wing Chun engine with Taijiquan shapes, or vice versa. Some just do WCK real slow.
If you mean can you do both at the same time, then it would depend on your individual ability to compartmentalize, and your desires in learning them. Some people, as Bo knows, can excel in multiple physical disciples, but some people, like Mike, aren’t as successful when they try to expand their spheres. If you’re just training for fun, you probably have no worries. If you’re trying to program your reflex system for fighting, you might have less chance if you give it mixed messages.
There are energies and subtler things that can be used form both to enhance the other. I wouldnt recommend mixing, in the most part for the reasons stated by others above.
As is well known here I practice taichi in my spare time and it has enhanced my wingchun quite a bit but its much more complicated then just mixing them.
To the original poster: I thought i seen that, Hawkens Cheung, does i think Wu TaiChi, along with wing chun…not sure if he connects them, but maybe you could email him from his webpage, and see if he/how he makes the two work!?.
I have no knowledge in these departments, but thought i should mention this.
peace
here is what i have seen: my WC brother and i have been pretty equal skill wise. We both progressed at the same pace. Then we both started doing Chen’s Tai chi also. He practices more than i do and i beleive he understands it better than me. After a while, when we do chi sau, i have notice he can make small changes quicker than i can and neutralize my energy better. His sensitivity is increasing faster than mine. He doesnt do Tai chi “moves” or anything like that in chi sau and he doesn’t “mix” the two.
Or do you feel its a “shortcut” to some understandings?
possibly… or more accurately, a catalyst to understanding
RR - atleastimnotyou answered it pretty well! For me personally practicing the taichi has allowed me to gain better control over my body and my energy and will continue to do so for a very long time. Its my belief at this time that taichi is more refined in the developement of this sort of thing. Its more physically demanding, or can be anyway for one thing which has helped me alot. It has helped me to focus my energy and empty my mind a little. SLT does this as well.
atleastiamnot you- there can be other logical alternative explanations.
r5a sez:For me personally practicing the taichi has allowed me to gain better control over my body and my energy and will continue to do so for a very long time. Its my belief at this time that taichi is more refined in the developement of this sort of thing
((Must be some missing links in learning wing chun- and the hypocrisy in criticizing others who do other things besides wc.))
Diego - I believe Cheung sifu learned from the Wu family.
ALMNY - Could the Chen sifu just be better at getting you to reach that understanding, or do you think the engineering of Taijiquan is better suited to “catalyzing” it?
Red - Taijiquan has the advantage of being in the hands of scholars who wrote on it for a longer period of time than WCK, meaning it has a greater “vocabulary” for explaining itself, and that that vocabulary has had time to be punched around a bit. I played Bagua when I was younger and I felt, because of the rather larger circles, it was easier to grasp the “feel” of some types of Ging, but I’m not sure WCK itself wouldn’t reveal that once you gained the ability to listen to the subtleties. (Bagua had way cooler looking forms tho, and I still really dig a Shanghai Chen set an old friend used to do 8P)
BTW - Your dummy form has been changed as well. Rather than taking pot shots, it might be more worthwhile to discuss the relative differences, their reasons, and the risk/reward ratio (everything has one).
Bewildered r5a painting by numbers sez:Could be yuanfen, you never know,of course hey, maybe my lack of understanding will lead me to make changes to the dummy form as well?
The dummy now- so soon-has the tan sao unstiffened enough to go around the jong arms? More taichi ball might be relaxing enough to do it.
Originally posted by red5angel Could be yuanfen, you never know,of course hey, maybe my lack of understanding will lead me to make changes to the dummy form as well? :rolleyes:
By all means, share your understanding of the dummy form after all your extensive experience. :rolleyes:
“Red - Taijiquan has the advantage of being in the hands of scholars who wrote on it for a longer period of time than WCK, meaning it has a greater “vocabulary” for explaining itself, and that that vocabulary has had time to be punched around a bit. I played Bagua when I was younger and I felt, because of the rather larger circles, it was easier to grasp the “feel” of some types of Ging, but I’m not sure WCK itself wouldn’t reveal that once you gained the ability to listen to the subtleties. (Bagua had way cooler looking forms tho, and I still really dig a Shanghai Chen set an old friend used to do 8P)”
thats a good way of explaining it, thanks!
As for potshots, well, seems all yuanfen is capable of now a days. Seems awefully indirect for one who has studied a direct art for so long…
ALMNY - Could the Chen sifu just be better at getting you to reach that understanding, or do you think the engineering of Taijiquan is better suited to “catalyzing” it?
hmm… i am not sure i understand. Could you rephrase it?
Tai Chi as a martial art discipline works very differently than wing chun kung fu. Its combative principles and techniques are opposite than wing chun. Wing chun is based on linear path and triangle structure, and tai chi is based on circular path and round structure. If you are not looking to mix apple and oranges, It can’t hurt to crosstrain in any art as long you don’t get bad habits. Sometimes while building good habits in one art means having bad habits in another art.
Mr Bao,
That is true. the physical movements of both arts are very different, but tai chi is about moving, changing and redirecting energy. And wing chun (atleast the way our lineage does it) is about those too (although in a more direct manner. i suppose). If you look at it from that POV. it is very good together… if you look at it from the POV of “i will use this technique here and this technique if that happens”… then it is bad
