NO offense, but i didn’t even think it was style. Just a philosophy made by an overrated actor (i like Bruce Lee but come on, Best martial artist?) in my opinion. Doesn’t every school teach something totally different anyway. I’m not saying anything about the effectiveness of Jeet Kune Do. But wont it be on other styles too. Anyhow thats just my rant for the day
Hardcore Jeet Kune Do Website
Hello!
The Hardcore Jeet Kune Do website will be strictly Wing Chun Gung Fu, Jun Fan Gung Fu and Jeet Kune Do! It will be THE website for those interested in Bruce Lee’s fighting methods, and will be EXTREMELY in-depth on all things related! It will have it’s own discussion forums, it’s own merchandise stores, it’s own training sections, historical information, Student/Instructor training information and much, much more! The entire website will deal only with Bruce Lee’s martial art as it existed in his lifetime, not what it has become as practiced by so many today!
I am the Executive Director/Senior Instructor of the Jun Fan Fighting Arts Association and Jun Fan/Jeet Kune Do International. This new website will house all information on these organizations, memberships and training programs. To see my current websites, please go to http://www.jffaa.8m.com, http://www.junfan.8m.com and http://www.jfjkdscientific.8m.com . The new website will incorporate everything from these websites, plus a WHOLE LOT MORE! If someone is at all interested in Bruce Lee’s fighting methods, www.HardcoreJKD.com will be the website for them! For the Bruce Lee/Jun Fan/Jeet Kune Do fanatic, it will be HOME! please take time to check it out when it is completed! I think you will like what you see!
"The Hardcore Jeet Kune Do website will be strictly Wing Chun Gung Fu, Jun Fan Gung Fu and Jeet Kune Do! "
I’m sure the Wing Chun crowd will be happy to once again be reunited with their mother art. :rolleyes:
The guy used to be an idol of mine, but nowI am so d@mn sick of Bruce Lee.
Maybe you didn’t read my post but I realize whats its about. It’s not like we other stylist dont like “Training Hardcore”. That was the point…and Wing Chun has nothing to do with Jeet Kune Do except that parts of its moves were ripped off if at all. Some people are mixing Boxing and say… Brazilian “wrestling” and calling it JKD. Not saying everyone mind you, but like everything today, even the hybrid styles get bstrdised.
Wing Chun/JKD Connection
Hello Again!
I realize that other methods of martial art enjoy hardcore training! It’s just that this sight will be totally dedicated to Bruce Lee’s methods!
Wing Chun Gung Fu is a very important part of Jeet Kune Do! In fact, it is the nucleus of the Jeet Kune Do system! Bruce Lee trained in Wing Chun for five years in Hong Kong before leaving for the United States. Bruce Lee’s Jun Fan Gung Fu that he taught in Seattle was a modified form of Wing Chun. When Bruce Lee was developing the Jeet Kune Do method, he sent a letter to one of his assistant instructors, saying this his new art would consist of techniques from Wing Chun, boxing and fencing! Now, many of the JKD “concepts” instructors have long abandoned the Wing Chun roots (if they ever knew them at all, that is) but to those of us who continue to train in Bruce Lee’s original methods, Wing Chun is VERY IMPORTANT! I have some very close friends who are high level Wing Chun instructors, and they appreciate the emphasis that I place on JKD’s Wing Chun roots!
Yes, Wing Chun Gung Fu will be a very important part of this new website! To leave it out would be ignoring the roots of the Jeet Kune Do system! That would be very disrespectful to practitioners of Wing Chun!
So humor me. What the h*ll makes JKD different from Wing Chun. It’s also funny that you mention disrespect to Wing Chun practitioners. Isn’t throwing away more then half their moves and calling it a classical mess disrespectful on Bruce Lee’s part. I dont think many Wing Chunners give a rats a-ss about about JKD. Maybe i’m wrong.
Lamar, from what I know about WC, which is very little, is five years enough to fully understand the complete system of WC? And if not then how can WC be considered the core of JKD if Lee wasn’t fully versed in it.
Thanks in advance Lamar.
Wing Chun Experience
Hello Again Guys!
It’s been a long day, and I’m about to crash, so this will be my last post for the evening!
No, I would not think that five years would be enough for someone to complete their wing chun training! But, Bruce Lee did learn enough Wing Chun to know that it was the way that he wanted to fight! It was his encounter with another gung fu man in Oakland that caused him to re-structure what he was doing! The end result was Jeet Kune Do! The reason that I say that Wing Chun is the nucleus of Jeet Kune Do is because we use the vertical fist punching structure, centerline theory, four corner defense, lin sil die dar, sticking hands, trapping hands and much, much more! We also practice the Sil Lim Tao form daily, and the mook jong is one of our most important training aids! Bruce Lee had great respect for the Wing Chun system, and even stated so publicly many times right up until the time he died! He was very proud of his Wing Chun background!
Now, please keep in mind that all Jeet Kune Do practitioners do not feel the way that I do about this. Especially those who are on the “JKD concepts” side of the fence! My approach to JKD is formed by my training experience with eighteen of Bruce Lee’s original First Generation students, and Full Instructor certification from five of them. I have trained in the martial arts for thirty-four years, with twenty-four of those years being nothing but Jun Fan Gung Fu and Jeet Kune Do (and some supplementary Wing Chun training of course)!
OK guys, I’m outta here! Stay well and train hard!
Glad to see you’re still even tempered Lamar. I think you and Big Sean are the most infuriating to disagree with since it’s hard to get a rise out of you two. 
OK now for the $64,000 question, if WC is so important to your JKD, why not fully study WC? Wouldn’t complete mastery of your systems core art make your system that much better?
LOL watchman.
WC/JKD Training
Hello Rogue!
Not necessarily! The elements that we need from Wing Chun are there! We train them hard and often! Remember though, while you are training one thing, something else is being neglected! 
We prefer to keep our training as well rounded as possible! Wing Chun elements still compose the bulk of our training. If I were not a JKD man, I would definitely be a Wing Chun man! No offense intended toward my Wing Chun brothers, of course!
And by the way, it’s best to remain even tempered on these forums! It’s not as if you can reach out and grab the person who has offended you anyway! If I could, man would I have some fun! LOL! My new saying about those who are trouble makers on forums is: “Let the children play, they’ll come across a turd in their sandbox sooner or later!” :eek:
Hey SifuLMDII!!!
What’s with all the !? QUIT YELLING FOR CHRIST SAKES!!! AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!
I’m sick of Bruce Lee to
No problem Watchman, it’s a question I had when I was in JKD. One thing our JKD friends should be clear about is that their art is not made up of WC, western boxing, fencing, savate and what ever else is currently on the list, but parts of those arts not the complete art. I’ve noticed that JKD seems to have a big umbrella for what makes up the art but is almost dismissive about those that would master those arts in full.
Lamar, I’ve had “problems” with the attitudes of many JKD folks, since you have always been civil on the JKD forum maybe you could answer some questions and clarify these two statements?
“Not necessarily! The elements that we need from Wing Chun are there! We train them hard and often!”
Which elements? Which parts of WC, or fencing or western boxing, are also discarded?
“Remember though, while you are training one thing, something else is being neglected! We prefer to keep our training as well rounded as possible!”
While I agree fully with your first sentence the second one can get you into hot water ;). It implies that by studying only WC, and not JKD, that the WC fighter, or any other fighter, would not be as well rounded. I’m guessing this goes for the TKD, Shorin-ryu, PM and all the rest? Now this is the sort of hubris that drove me away from JKD.
I also have noticed that many JKD people are either shaving their heads or wearing their hair very short, is this a reaction to many WC people having a preference for mullets? 
Please note that when I say WC I should also include any other arts that makes up JKD. Also when I say JKD I’m not aiming at Lamar but at those I’ve met in my travels. And yes I do have a chip on my shoulder when it comes to JKD :D.
One question could be: How can you chose to discard something as “useless” or can you chose something as “the core” of a system when you have only a fragmented knowledge of the system in the first place?
An other question would be: If…Bruce Lee had won his fight with that chinese sifu in the first place,could it be possible that he might have continued his studies of wing chun instead of losing all confidence in it?
What I Meant By Well Rounded
Hello Again Rogue!
What I meant when I said well rounded is this:
Footwork & Mobility
Stances
Defensive Movements
Evasive Tactics
Hand Techniques
Leg Techniques
Body Techniques
Combinations
Feints/Fakes
Entering Methods
Bruce Lee’s Five Ways of Attack
Sticking Hands
Trapping Hands
Holds
Throws
Takedowns
Chokes/Strangles
NOT any particular form of fighting. Just necessary fighting skills! This has absolutely nothing to do with any arts outside of Jun Fan/Jeet Kune Do. As for what Bruce Lee discarded, it is easier for me to tell you what he kept, as these are the things that I know for sure!
I have already mentioned in another post what we use from wing chun. From boxing we use certain body mechanics, footwork, evasive tactics, the cross, hook, uppercut and shovel hook. from fencing Bruce Lee took some footwork, power side forward, defensive skills and attack strategies. The Jeet Kune Do fighting stance has mixed elements from all three arts. The most important aspect of this mix, however, is the unique way that Bruce Lee combined everything so that it all fits together.
This is really all that I have to say about this, because, as you said earlier, I don’t really get “heated” over all of this because I am pretty “even tempered”! When I am talking to a wall, I can only talk for so long before I eventually get bored if you catch my drift here! After all, I started into this just to simply answer a question, not write a book! I have written two of those already! 
OJ, while I know where you got the “useless” thing from let’s remember that Lamar didn’t say it.
I’ve been wondering if those of us that still practice what are considered traditional arts are just practicing them so others can come and pick at them when they need something new. What should be happening is that we should strive to master our traditional arts, but test them against other systems, add to them if something is lacking and to always move them forward to keep them relevent.
PS OJ. I’m still steamed at your little TKD remark on the WC forum, pal! :mad: 
I need to type faster Lamar!
I’ve looked at your list and didn’t find anything that is on it that is missing from most traditional karate and TKD (if a 50 year old art can be traditional). Well outside of Bruce Lee’s Five Ways of Attack, which we probably have anyway but under different names.
Sorry if you think you’re talking to a wall but that’s what it’s also like asking many a JKD person a valid question. Thankfully you didn’t resort to quoting from the Tao of JKD, mention the Navy SEALS or streetfighters.
LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL!
Hi Rogue!
Good one, and believe me, I certainly know what you mean! I recently posted on another forum about just that subject! I’m sure that raised a few eyebrows!
I tend to be more direct and personal with my responses! I too get sick and tired of all of the “philosophers” out there who want to constantly quote this person and that person! I say just be yourself! Say what you feel! Know what I mean? 
By the way, if you’d like to read that post, here it is:
Hello Everyone!
I don’t mean to step on anyone’s toes here, and if I do, OH WELL! LOL! Due to a certain “liberating” process that I have gone through in the past few weeks, I am now free to say EXACTLY what I want to say about Jun Fan Gung Fu and Jeet Kune Do! You can take it or leave it, BUT IT IS THE TRUTH!
Jun Fan Gung Fu was the art that Bruce Lee taught in the Seattle, Washington kwoon, where he was assisted by Taky Kimura. Jun Fan Gung Fu consists primarily of Wing Chun Gung Fu (probably about 85%-90%) with a few elements from other gung fu systems (10%-15%). Bruce Lee spent five years in Hong Kong learning the Wing Chun system from some of it’s best fighters! He
chose Wing Chun because of it’s raw street effectiveness!
During the Oakland period, Bruce Lee had an encounter with another Chinese martial artist, Wong Jak Man, of the My Jong Law Horn Kuen system of gung fu. Although Bruce Lee won the fight, he was unusually tired and winded when it was over! He felt that it had taken him much too long to get the better of his challenger! This was due to a failure on his part to immediately adjust to the methods of his opponent! This caused him to take more of an interest in physical fitness, as well as closely re-examine his art of Jun Fan Gung Fu. He decided that he needed more versatility in his tools and his footwork needed to change to favor more mobility. During this time he composed a letter, saying that he was inventing a new system of fighting that would consist of Wing Chun gung fu, boxing and fencing. This new system was Jeet Kune Do, the “Way of The Intercepting Fist”.
During the L. A. Chinatown period, Jeet Kune Do continued to develop. YES, there was a definite curriculum, and YES, the students were required to learn certain things! The kwoon was still called the Jun Fan Gung Fu Institute, but in Dan Inosanto’s own words, what was being taught was Jeet Kune Do! Back then, there was no such thing as Jeet Kune Do “concepts”, nor did Bruce Lee himself ever use the term “concepts” to describe his method of fighting! All terminology used in Jeet Kune Do was Chinese in Bruce Lee’s lifetime, and the instructor was referred to as Sifu!
There is much talk today about Bruce Lee researching other methods of combat. Contrary to a popular way of thinking these days, he was not looking for things to add to his method. He was looking at other arts so that he could develop counters against their best techniques using his Jeet Kune Do! He was well known for using certain students with particular attributes to bring out his own attributes and abilities. He did not care much for teaching, but instead preferred to train himself to higher skill
levels!
Much of his writing was geared toward trying to free other martial artists from the bondage and set patterns of what they were “locked” into! The famous “Liberate Yourself From Classical Karate” article was re-written about a dozen or so times before he finally arrived at the version that appeared in the magazine. I have that original magazine! I walked into the newsstand the day it came out and bought it! So as you can see, I’ve had plenty of time to read, re-read and read it again! I know what it means,
and I know exactly where Bruce Lee was coming from with what he was saying! It has become painfully obvious to me that most people still don’t have a clue!
One thing that most peole fail to realize is that most of the things that have been published as Bruce Lee’s writings are actually just notes that he took from various other publications. This has recently been proven, and will be brought into the light by a book that is being written even as I type this! Many people are going to be shocked when they find out just how much of the material published as Bruce Lee’s writings were not actually his at all, but notes taken from other sources! The stuff that has been published as his writings was never intended for publication! Too many people take things out of context based on the importance they place on certain writings! Most of these people are going to feel like idiots when they find all of this out! Most of what was in the Tao of Jeet Kune Do would have never been published had Bruce Lee lived! IT WAS HIS NOTES! NOTHING MORE, NOTHING LESS!
That’s why I get so sick and tired of reading all of this philosophical stuff posted on the forums by so many people to try and back up their horribly mis-conceived notions as to what Jeet Kune Do is! Jeet Kune Do is a highly scientific method of self defense, based on highly effective, solid scientific principles that will remain constant from now until the end of time! There is a JKD way to stand (the bai jong position), there is specific JKD footwork and there are specific JKD techniques (punching, striking, kicking, defending, trapping). There is a specific progression to the training! The bottom line is, IF YOU ARE NOT DOING THESE THINGS, THEN YOU ARE NOT DOING JEET KUNE DO! It’s just that simple!
Now, go soak your feet and get the swelling out of those toes! That’s all I have to say for now! Any comments?
Are you nuts!:eek: That kind of talk will get you burned at the JKD stake. That ranks up there with my statement that “Inosanto is the martial artists Lee wished he was”. Considering that Lee is still dead and Dan is still mastering systems I was surprised to catch so much flack. LOL
I find it funny that many JKDers have created their own classical mess from that book.
Ok, how can i ask this and not seem like Im challenging?
You have done a very good job here of explaining where you are coming from, and exactly how you see things. Very good, and educational.
My question is, how do view MMA type stylists who call themselves JKD? At some fights here recently there were 3 guys who were identified as JKD stylists. Two of them were matched against superior opponents but fought well, the third fought a very even fight against a tough former belt holder, and lost a close decision. I was impressed with these guys, they had a unique style and were very game fighters.
And, I see on your profile that your in Burmingham, January 12 we are having some MMA fights in Biloxi Mississippi at the President Casino. If you can, you should come and watch, youll enjoy it!