Not a troll, curious:
What is the hardest this you have ever succesfully (no damage to fingers) bieled?
Eh?
EF,
Please rephrase… this question makes no sense. Repost, sir, repost…
biued?
Just a guess but i imagine he means finger jabbed…
EF, if you are referring to jabbing fingers then after some conditioning you should be able to jab as hard as you punch. This takes some patience to reach but isnt impossible by any means.
So what is the hardest object you have ever biued: punching bag, wood, brick, side of beef?
What can the Wing Chun player’s finger handle? How do you test it? Develop it?
Its all relative, like anything else in the martial arts. I use my sandbags, when I do punching I also do jabbing. I dont need to do anymore. If you wanted some sort of Dim Mak super death jab then I suppose you could go around jabbing rocks, cars, your freinds skull etc…
Thats how you develope it, start small and work your way up.
I used to hit beans when I was also doing iron palm. I used to claw them and spike them with fingers but I have never hit anything solid with my fongers, I prefer the palm or fist, I don’t trust the fingers. Break a finger and you’ll have a hell of a time fighting. Also, I don;t think the eyes are as easy to hit or penetrate as many people believe.
My wing chun friends are always talking about the biu ji, but I’m not sure any of them have ever struck anything but the air with it. Wanted to know if there are some players out thete striking solid object with it, have tested it.
I have never hit a person with it, so I am not sure if it “works” but much like a fist, I can assume it would hurt, especially if I were accurate!
I started by standing in front of the sand bag, and each day hitting just a little harder. My theory on the jab is that it is used for all the soft bits and so doesnt need a lot of conditioning, just a little. I dont plan on using it much either but better to be prepared.
Are you still having issues with WC EF?
Bui is to be used against soft targets,throat ,armpit,solar plexus,temple ,etc.Special conditioning is not necessary to strike these areas.It should be noted that the intended striking areas could all result in serious if not fatal consequences.
Most bui stikes flow from a control move such as lop sau.The reason is that the targets tend to be small and are difficult to hit unless the stiking area has been slowed or stabilized.
Yes i have used these stikes.
Hunt 1 is no.1
Strike hard with soft and soft with hard, EF.
No point using finger jabs to rock hard bone… if we did, fingers would be ruined and no-one would be typing on this forum.
No red, I’m not having any problems with Wing Chu, just curious. I like to see what others are doing out there, what they are capable of. I apreciate your comments and honesty.
I like that you said you hit the sand bag everyday and didn’t tell me you were beuing cinder blocks. I aprecaite that, and I would think your method is the proper method.
Best of luck to you and your training. I can see how that can be a penetrating strike if hitting the throat, not so sure about the eyes: small moveable target and stronger than some think. BUT, the right strike on the right day can put anyone down.
Thanks guys.
Ray
I’ve thrusted through a brick before to entertain the neighbor’s kids. I conditioned my fingers by doing push ups on them and striking the wall bag which we fill with pea gravel.
Evolution fist-
you are not in wing chun- why do you ask about finger work?
Most folks are not advanced enough in understanding the biu gee form. Merely hitting bags and surfaces is not enough to understand the role of the biu motions. Your question about how hard a surface can be hit etc wont give you an idea about good usage of the motions.
I understand the motion actualy, I have studied Wing Chun. I also know that as the beu is being raised to hit me from a top position, I can raise from below and actually beu myself if I wanted to, though again, I prefer the palm.
What I wanted to know is how devestating this blow can be. I hear a lot of talk about this strike, but I wonder how many have the ability to pierce bricks like the gentleman above. The eyes are a hard target to hit, being that the head is mobile, and, the skull is quite hard, especially the top half if one misses. A jammed finger is not a bonus in a fight.
I know a lot of wing chun guys, but I don’t know many, if any, who would thrust even into a man’s chest with his fingers. I know its the throat that is being aimed for, but the person will not just stand there. Can the fingers take a counter blow, a double handed shielding/counter-attack?
You sound comfortable with this method, in your opinion, what percentage of wing chun players, mediocre and above, share this skill?
yuanfen
The motions relate to sweeping the fingers across the eyes, rather than simply stabbing in?
Is this right?
This is something I heard - I’m yet to learn the third form.
black and blue- on finger work. As I mentioned before without learning the biu jee well and “shaping” the body for serious biu work best to stick with fists, palms etc. The delivery, the instrument and the stucture all have to be in harmony. Simple imitation of Bruce Lee finger jab wont work and you can get your fingers broken. In my judgement wing chun hand work is unexcelled and the fingers are part of the hand–you have to train the fingers to work together and there are quite a few finger formations. Finger work is not for jabbing at eyes at boxing distance, can be more readily blocked- it is for very very close quarters work…closer than boxing.
Sweeping across is too superficial. Sweeping in is often better.
Fingers are also useful for qinna work when the right motions are developed.
Interesting.
Hey EvolutionFist, I think I have to agree with Yuanfen, besides he has much much much more experience then I!!!
I think he has an important point though. There is a lot of Wing chun out there. not all of it is good, the sad thing may be that most of it is bad.
I think the problem is because WC is suffering from the same diseases that Karate and Taekwando have suffered as of late, too many people claiming to know it. some of these people have some extensive training, but most havent had more then a few years, or are off doingt thier own thing without really understanding what it is they are supposed to be doing. WC is a subtle art, there are nuances that take some time and some attention to be discovered and understood.
We had a seminar recently and had a good cross section of the WC schools in my area. The guy who came to give the seminar could have wiped anyone in the room all over it, no problem. The difference between him and th erest of us? He had pretty much dedicated his last 12 years to WC (With priot experience in karate and Taiji), he had studied it intensely and not only that he practiced it a lot. he had come to understand the things that even some of the sifu around here dont understand.
Biu Jee I see miysticized a lot because it is the third and final form of WC. Alot of people seem to miss that it has some great tools, but the most important form is the first. Its sort of like building a house, the first form is the foundation and all the rooms you need to have a house, without it, you do not have wingchun. the second and third forms are just expanding the house itself. they are important, but the first form is the most important.
Not only that but you have to understand the concepts inherent in the system, like any other art. If you dont, you wont have it.
At the seminar, my old sifu, very athletic, in good shape, old kickboxer, used ‘his’ wingchun against the guy teaching. He couldnt hold a candle to him, too tense, too reactive, movement too wide open, no root, bad footwork. It looked good, and against a beginner he would probably not have a problem winning. But he didnt get it.
Agreed.
I know in the past you have had issues with WC. For me there is a lot to WCs’ simplicity. alot of people use the anology, probably for other martial arts as well, but WC, to me, is like chess in a lot of ways. Its easy to teach someone the movements, forms, etc, even the principles. You could probably teach someone in a month everything about wc on the outside. But like chess, once you learn how to move the pieces, you have to learn the startegems, the combinations, the subtle way each and every piece becomes a part of the whole.
I believe it to be extremely effective, if used correctly. I hae seen a few martial arts performed, and some performed well, but none have ever convinced me like WC that they are as effective and as logical as WC. This isnt to say I do not think other styles are effective, just not for me.