HAS ANY ONE HEARD OF A TONY CHUY IN MANHATTAN? I AM THINKING OF POSSIBLY JOINING HIS SCHOOL, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO KNOWW IF ANYBODY HAS SEEN HIM AND IS HE GOOD? I REALLY WANT TO LEARN THE MANTIS SYSTEM THANKS IN ADVANCE TO ALL
I AM THE SEEKER OF LOST SOULS
Lucky you…
Tony Chuy is one of the best instructors I have ever met. If you are looking to learn mantis he is the man you should study under. He has a very well thought out and thorough training method. I’ve never seen anything like it. I highly recommend him.
~ETB
“Someone I once flattered in a book thinks he owes me nothing. Oh, the trash I have for friends.” ~Martial
MANY THANKS FOR YOUR REPLY,DO YOU KNOW IF HE TEACHES ONE TO FIGHT USING THE TECHNIQES IN THE FORMS OR IS IT ALL LIKE THE KICKBOXING THAT ONE SEES DONE IN ALMOST ALL THE SCHOOLS?
I AM THE SEEKER OF LOST SOULS
Traditional…
Don’t worry, no kick boxing bs here. He only teaches techniques from the forms. One learns trapping, takedowns and all. Advance levels do free sparring. I’m telling you. This is the place to go.
~ETB
“Someone I once flattered in a book thinks he owes me nothing. Oh, the trash I have for friends.” ~Martial
Tony Chuy
Magnatron:
Mr. Chuy does not teach fighting, I know personally 2 former students of Mr. Chuy who left him because of the simple fact that they didn’t learn any sparring. One stuedent trained with Mr. Chuy for 6 1/2 years the other for 3 years and during that time, they never sparred.
There are two other very good Sifu’s in New York that have a great reputation for SPARRING, they really do teach their students how to fight and I mean how to fight. They use all their traditional classical mantis techniques, not just drills, but actually sparring.
One of the Sifu’s I know very well cause I have had the honor to play hands with him and he is amazing with his mantis fighting, his name is Sifu Raul Ortiz, the other I have not had the pleasure or the honor to play hands with him, but I have seen him fight, he is also great. His name is Sifu Carl Albright.
These two Sifu’s have all their students fight at tournaments, but I have to say that I have never ever witness any of Mr. Chuy’s students fight in any tournament ever given, in NY, MD, TX, CA etc.
If you are interested in learning from these two gentlemen, I suggest before you join any school check them out and talk to them. Sifu Ortiz’s school is located in Bethpage, Long Island which is only about 45 minutes from the City, and Sifu Albright’s school is located in Brooklyn, which is also about 45 minutes from the City.
What’s great about these two Sifu’s is that they come from the same family lineage Chiu Chi Man, I do have Sifu Ortiz’s phone # (516)942-4025 he is my training brother under Master Lee Kam Wing, I don’t have Sifu Albright’s phone # but I’m sure you can get it from the phone co., or maybe one of his students might be able to post it. He trains under Master Chiu Leun my Sifu’s training brother.
Good luck in your search. By the way I’m not saying that Mr. Chuy doesn’t know mantis, I’m saying he doesn’t teach sparring.
Good Luck
MB
mistaken…
Just because a school does not participate in half-@ssed “sparring” at tournaments, do not be confused that they do not fight…a mistake that can get you into trouble. That goes for any school.
Just a thought,
-BTL
“Eat bitter & you will taste bitter.”
MantisBoxer,
Just because those two students did not learn sparring does not mean Sifu Tony Chuy does not teach it at all. I study with Sifu Chuy and have taken many sparring classes with him, not just the two-man drills but actual sparring.
The philosophy at our school is that the student must know and understand enough of the style before they can learn how to spar with it. We commonly do not allow students to spar until they have reached at least Intermediate level. However, the time it takes for a student to reach that level varies with each individual and it very well could be that the students you speak of were not deemed ready for mantis sparring classes with Sifu. In fact, I can probably even guess which students you are referring to and yes, after 6.5 years, unfortunately he was not ready for it.
Sifu also does not teach just anyone who comes to the school simply because they are willing to pay tuition. The students are screened for character and then must train with him for some length of time to gain his trust to learn the more advanced applications. However, starting at the beginner level and throughout our training, students are taught two-man drills to begin developing sensitivity, distancing, timing, and reflex, all of which are very important skills for fighting.
If you have any other questions about our school or our method of training, feel free to either write to the school’s address at info@northernmantis.com or to me.
Young Mantis
Good point Young Mantis.
Although not a mantis practitioner myself. I know and have trained with Mr. Chuy. I can say without any hesitation that he is the best teacher I have ever had. And let me be clear that when I say teacher I mean more than one who teachers the MA. Being a part of his school, not only do you learn Praying Mantis. But you also learn throughly about the history, lineage, culture of the system and people(as you should with any school)Not to mention the occasionaly chinese etiquette. Mr Chuy is more than a MA teacher, he represents the Asian culure,people and the Tong Long system at its finest. As for the fighting aspect…If you are contemplating joining the school in hopes of competeing in TOURNAMENTS. Save yourself the time. Mr. Chuy doesnt teach tournament fighting/ers. He teaches the Praying Mantis system in its entirety. I would hope that the difference between the two is understood.
As with anything do your research. And I hope that you chose the school that is best suited for you, magnatron. GOOD LUCK!!
Tang Lang
I too have heard good things about Tony Chuy. I would go over there and decide on your own if you like his class or not. Another person you may want to check out is Su Yu Chang. He teaches five styles of mantis (7 star, eight step, mei hua, six harmony, and closed door mantis). Along with mantis he also teaches Bajiquan, Piquazhang, Yin Fu baguazhang, and Taijiquan. Here is his website if you have time to check it out: http://www2.micro-net.com/~ycsu/
You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet.
mantis school
Magnatron, I agree with Baji-fist. Go there and check it out. Everything a have been told by my older Kung Fu brothers is positive. He teaches traditional Seven Star Mantis. You have to decide if the school is right for you. If you want to do sparring right away there are schools who dwell on that.
Good luck with your search.
Steve M.
New York
Chuy Sisuk
Trained under Bendan Lai & Chiu Chuk Kai
He teaches 7 Star and Taiji Mantis
Further elaboration
As someone who has participated in a number of free-sparring classes, I must disagree with those who claim that Mr. Chuy doesn’t teach sparring. He does, but only when you have reached a certain level. Some of the moves must be drilled into the student so that the first rush of adrenaline doesn’t blow the knowledge away and reduce the student to that of a common bar brawler. If you cannot fight with Mantis consistently, then what is the point of learning Mantis? Might as well hang out in rough bars and pick up fighting tips there, right?
To quote William Shakespeare, “there is method to his madness.” He starts off with drills as Young Mantis says. A lot of junior students may find this boring and repetitive but this is the beginning to learning to fight with Mantis. Like a boxer who first learns to jab, he must also learn to move along with learning to jab, all without tripping over his own feet or tangling up his arms while executing his moves. You may laugh but this doesn’t come naturally to some people. And some people who think they’re coordinated actually aren’t. The abovementioned drills get more and more intricate until you can do them in your sleep, almost.
As others have said, Mr. Chuy has a well formulated lesson plan and he doesn’t do things willy-nilly nor does he rush things. His knowledge of Mantis and weapons is extensive and not just on the physical side of things either. Compared to other schools, his school may be more formal but you learn Mantis and its applications, provided you have the patience and the humility. It took me a long time before the lightbulb lit up in my head but light up it did. And I still have a long way to go before I can truly say I even understand Mantis one-quarter way. A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. And another…and another…
A “Laughing Budda” or “Dai Tao Fut” is usually found cavorting in front of and leading the lion(s) in a Southern Lion Dance troupe.
Hey Baji-fist! I just went to Su Yu Chang’s website and took a look at the mantis clip. I couldn’t really see a lot of detail but I absolutely love the way he moves! What style of mantis is that? Is it just a combination of mantis styles?
OK…
Well, I was all prepared to make a response to Mantis Boxers reply but it is not necessary now. It is obvious from the overwhelming response that Mr. Chuy is a good teacher and that he does in fact teach real fighting methods. As stated above, competitions mean nothing. Learning to fight to compete is neglecting a huge chunk of techniques. It also limits one to the rules in the given tournament. As far as comparing Mr. Ortiz’s training methods and Mr. Chuy’s…well, I was a student of Mr. Ortiz but left because of the fact that sparring was taught too soon. I didn’t feel I had enough understanding of the style to effectively use it in a fighting situation. I started to study with Mr. Chuy because he drills the basics, forms and techniques before sparring is even considered. This, like Young Mantis has said is the only way to effectively use mantis in combat or sparring. Otherwise one will just look like a kick boxer.
~ETB
“Someone I once flattered in a book thinks he owes me nothing. Oh, the trash I have for friends.” ~Martial
Tony Chuy’s Northern Praying Mantis School / Sparring
I would like to thank and add on to the
posts provided by Young Mantis, Tiger_Fighter
and Laughing Buddha. Thanks guys.
I personally know Sifu Tony Chuy and can
state that he knows how to fight utilizing
Northern Praying Mantis. He has received
“fighting training” from both Mantis Masters
Brendan Lai and Chu Chuk Kai.
As to teaching Sparring in his school,
there are different methods of “sparring”.
What one thinks of as the type of
“Sparring or Fighting” that one can
take into those so called tournaments,
NO HE DOES NOT OFFER THIS TYPE OF TRAINING.
Most of these types of “fighting” tournaments
are not structured in a manner whereby all the
Northern Mantis techniques can be utilized
and to limit what techniques can or cannot be
utilized is a severe disadvantage to the mantis
person, unless the person’s skill level/training
was/is really high level.
There exist other MA schools that have
special curriculum / training for fighting
tournaments, and in some / many cases
what is taught is not stictly the MA
that is being taught in class but rather
a mix of various other arts, such as kickboxing,
boxing, take down moves and maybe some of the
particular style’s movements thrown in, etc…
However, what is offered as previously mentioned
are the two man drills and two person fist sets,
which can be played in different manners.
First is where you learn the motion(s) and
get use to doing this with a partner.
Then as you increase your knowledge and skill
level re: understanding the movement(s),
sensitivity; speed with focus, clarity and
proper power; ability with fah jing; etc…
one can increase the speed of doing these two
person forms.
Then as you get past this stage, when you do
you two person forms (this is with the
understanding that you have been practicing
with a specific partner) the two of you
can go to the next (higher) level of training,
which is to do the techniques / forms as though
you were really fighting / trying to hit
your opponent and your opponent has to
react / block - utilizing the established
techniques as related to the particular
form - which also requires a higher level
of skill.
If the “attacker” has higher skill level
than the “defender”, the defender will get hit
and visa-versa.
Obtaining this “higher skill level” may take
less than 6.5 yrs, it may take more than 6.5 yrs.
It all depends on one’s training (at school and
at home), attitude, understanding and abilities.
Sorry for the long winded post.
There you have it!
Magnatron, there you have it. The respected opinions of several members of the Mantis community saying that Sifu Chuy is a legitimate authentic instructor.
Ericsepishii,Young Mantis, Tiger_Fighter, and Laughing Buddha, thank you for replying as well. Your posts were quite informative as to what
Sifu Chuy offers and supports at his Kwoon.
Respectfully,
BTL
“Eat bitter & you will taste bitter.”
Sparring
First of all to the entire list on this post!
I was not reffering to tournament fighting, I was talking about using your mantis skills for street survival.
I mentioned tournaments cause usually that is the place where you can go and play your skills in a safe environment. I do agree that tournaments do make you a fighter, but you can still test your skills.
The problem with lost of kungfu practitioners in general is, the lack of testing their skills outside from their kwoon and it could be due to lots of different circumstances, one being “SCARED” “NOT TRUSTING THEIR OWN SKILLS” etc.
By no means did I mean to offened Mr. Chuy, or any of his students, that was not my intentions, but mainly to educate magnatron in doing some research of all mantis schools before he just runs into the first one he sees.
I do strongly believe that no style of martial arts should take 6 or more years before you can learn how to fight, that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.
Most people that join a martial arts school do it to learn self defense. If they have to wait 6 or more years to learn how to fight, they might as well buy a gun, don’t you think.
Now I don’t want to get into a disscussion about theory and concepts here about the style or how your teacher teaches. But the problem here is that a lot of schools just BS the people that come to learn about all this mystical BS.
There is no mysticism in mantis, either your Sifu teaches you how to use it or he doesn’t period. Again I never said that Mr. Chuy didn’t know how to fight, he might, I have never seen him fight and I don’t care.
But let’s not BS the people in this forum with thinking that all the other Sifu’s especially the ones that I mentioned only teach tournament fighting, because thats a MISTAKE THAT CAN GET YOU IN TROUBLE.
These Sifu’s just happen to like and test their own skills and have their students test their skills in a friendly environment, thats all, which is more then I can say for a lot of other Sifu’s.
Whether you like it or not, don’t knock it if you have not tried it. I’m the first to say, yes tournament fighting doesn’t make you a fighter, but what a great way to have fun!.
MB
MB
My thoughts on this:
“Obtaining this “higher skill level” may take less than 6.5 yrs, it may take more than 6.5 yrs. It all depends on one’s training (at school and at home), attitude, understanding and abilities.”
BT
“Eat bitter & you will taste bitter.”
Eight_Triagram_Boxer
no to make this a flame but I am also a fighter of the ortiz school I am one of the seniors and I also taught a majority of the classes and I know I never had anyone fight before it was time… Do you mind saying who you are.. I taught and trained at the south bronx school… Moat of our students were good fighters and we didnt only practice san shou we also did free sparring ( continuos sparring) full contact, We touched hands with out gloves with mantis techniques only, we were a fighting school and it was told of the back and I know for a fact those who wanted to fight was permmited to go at it in the begining to get the feel for it no one was ever forced to do so…
Now if you trained with sifu during that period or before at the unionport school please let me know…
Victor
Ps if you know me then you know I can get down with my mantis ( no kick boxing here ) also with my thai boxing
If you are one of my seniors Then let me know also and for those out there Ortiz sifu only has 14 seniors students Gil eddie eddie v earl Mr B
diana chaz danny myself ryan the last 3 escape me right now.. But if you are from the portchester time or further please excuse me … nut I am assuming you trained at unionport or elton school
Magnatron
I’ve been studying the Praying Mantis system under sifu Chuy for over five years now. Before I joined my school I’ve visited many different schools and spoke to a lot of teachers about their styles and how long they’ve been teaching and how they conduct their classes and whether or not they, themselves, teach the beginner level and not just the advanced level only.
To me, Kung Fu is more than just fighting or tournament fighting all together. I’ve always believed that when practicing kung fu one should keep in mind that martial arts, altogether, was developed for self defense as well as maintaining and improving one’s health.
Throughout my life I’ve always looked for genuine teachers rather than ones whose lineages are questionable. I think that my sifu’s skills and knowledge can represent the praying mantis system.
Sifu Chuy is the first to be authorized to teach the praying mantis system under Grandmaster Brendan Lai whom was one of twenty plus students authorized to teach under the late Grandmaster Wong Hong Fahn. Additionally, my sifu has studied the Tai Chi mantis style, in Hong Kong, under the late Grandmaster Chiu Chuk Kai for many years and was given the permission to teach before he died.
In our school we do sparring only when a student reaches a certain level and has met certain requirements such as forms, two man forms and two man drills, sahn sao and reflex & sensitivity training.
Sifu Chuy does not teach tournament fighting, point fighting nor kickboxing but instead emphasizes applying mantis techniques, strategies and the theories passed down from our ancestors.
If you’re looking to learn how to fight right away, our school is definitely NOT the place to come to. However If you are looking for traditional mantis fighting that was passed down by our ancestors of the style I would recommend you to come by and check out the school or go to: www.northernmatis.com for more information.
Hope this clears up any questions you may have.
Mantisk
[This message was edited by mantisk on 12-06-00 at 03:31 PM.]
[This message was edited by mantisk on 12-06-00 at 03:32 PM.]