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7 star Please PM personal arguments that don’t concern the topic. If you’re cool then you’ll do that, instead of jacking the thread. You know I enjoy your constructive criticism but please don’t turn this thread into what the other threads turn into. If you are a moderator than you would respect what I just asked.
thanks,
mark
Re: Re: mma
Originally posted by SevenStar
If there were a full contact mantis circuit, you would see similar things happening.
stay tuned, there is a mantis specific san da ruleset that is apparently used in Poland and China. There is conversation going on about instituting it here. Hopefully it will be a main topic of next years Mantis meeting at the Great Lakes Tourney in Cleveland.
Just have Tito Ortiz or any other prizefight fight a real master, the kind who doesn’t care about showing off, and Tito will get his lunch eaten.
c’mon man, I know you’re smarter than that…no way to know unless a ‘real master’ steps up…I don’t like Tito that much but there is no doubt that he trains his ass off and is a very good fighter. a ‘real master’ might beat him. Tito might beat a ‘real master’.
[rant]
The problem is that there aren’t any TCMA people fighting full contact (besides San Shou and the very few Lei Tai events) There are no rules in any of the mma events that would prohibit a mantis fighter from competing in them…“What? Oh, we can’t poke the eyes or bend the fingers???” Well, guess what, neither can they.
[/rant]
****, i’m even starting to sound like a broken record to myself.
and, Seven, see who you can talk to about getting use cool font that actually kicks in at [rant]
that would be cool.
I have always viewed choosing one’s martial art style on the same par as choosing your dream car or dream girl. Everyone is different, but looking for similar things. I have chosen mine. (MA Style that is… and a 1963 Corvette… and -nevermind-)
I have studied no less that four styles of karate, two styles of kung-fu, high school wrestler, college boxer and as an active duty Marine I have been forced to participate in the Marine Corps Martial Arts Program.
What brought me to Praying Mantis was the effiency and lethalicy of the techniques and the completeness of the system. For me it is a round peg in a round hole. As my training progresses I hope to be competeing in various venues and tournaments in the future. I have no doubt that gloves and rules will aid another systems against me, just I have no doubt that, on the street, Praying Mantis will serve me very well.
Final thought. I do not imitate a bug. The bug was simply the insparation. I do what my Shifu tells me to, I pay attention to my body and I listen to what my kung-fu brothers have to say.
Thanks,
Jeff
Bung bo and tkbrewer,
excellent posts! I find it refreshing to hear from people that are serious in their art and in it for the right reasons… thier own.
my hat goes off to you both.
Re: Re: Re: mma
Originally posted by Oso
stay tuned, there is a mantis specific san da ruleset that is apparently used in Poland and China. There is conversation going on about instituting it here. Hopefully it will be a main topic of next years Mantis meeting at the Great Lakes Tourney in Cleveland.
that sounds good. I look forward to seeing it.
[rant]
The problem is that there aren’t any TCMA people fighting full contact (besides San Shou and the very few Lei Tai events) There are no rules in any of the mma events that would prohibit a mantis fighter from competing in them…“What? Oh, we can’t poke the eyes or bend the fingers???” Well, guess what, neither can they.
[/rant]
bingo.
[b]and, Seven, see who you can talk to about getting use cool font that actually kicks in at [rant]
that would be cool.
[/B]
that’s actually a pretty cool idea! I’ll try to get it instituted.
I am new in this “forum” and I find it quite interesting to share my views with other Tanglang practitioners. Thanks Shirkers for opening an interesting topic…
Why Tanglang? I guess it is because Tanglang covers all the aspects of useful combat skills you need in order to get you out of a tricky situation.
The techniques are logical and are meant to crush the opponent in a devastating way. The rhythm is intensive and surprising and can help you when you have to fight someone for real on the streets.
I have been practising Tanglang few years on a dayly basis and the feeling I get from it is just great. More than art I would call it a science of combat where the body work is well used in order to get the best strengh for all kind of situations that you might encounter.
After that I find that Tanglang has an interesting culural heritage that you do not find in modern combat. Besides the fighting skills I believe that studying its history is also a very important part of the art. How the techniques made their evolution through its history makes you understand well its nature and how these people contributed to make Tanglang evolve on the right path.
Why I also chose tanglang and a traditional practice was also because of the weapons. This is the very martial part of the art.
How much modern fighters such as grapplers or MMA seems to be effective I think what they lack of is mastering a weapon. Their skills are more for a regulated tournament while traditional fighting arts were designed to be adapted to a realistic warfare.
How much they make publicity of their stuff it ain t martial it is just a sport combat. Submissions are for competitions but weapons kill you for real.Back in time mastering the 18 weapons were an important part of your martial instruction. And this what I focus on. This why I try to concentrate on Tanglang.
It takes a whole life to understand it and I am very happy to take that challenge in order to be satisfied. I am not interested at all in tournament since I find them artificial so Tanglang fits my lifestyle when I have to face difficult situations.
Since I knew about Tanglang I wanted to try it and now that I do practice it there is no way for me to stop.
By the way when you read about Tanglang you can conclude that it is a sort of MMA since Wang Lang was said to have “mixed” different techniques from various masters of his time.
I hope I have answered your questions “Shirkers”.
Thanks for reading this…
Oso, what I said about a “real master” was a little out there. It sounded like I meant some hermit-monk who is 109 and pulls boulders with his nut$ while walking on hot coals. LOL. I was thinking about MMAers that think TCMA is BS, and I think Tito is arrogant. I lumped the two together in my head.
Originally posted by slobo
After that I find that Tanglang has an interesting culural heritage that you do not find in modern combat. Besides the fighting skills I believe that studying its history is also a very important part of the art. How the techniques made their evolution through its history makes you understand well its nature and how these people contributed to make Tanglang evolve on the right path.
not really… in thai and judo, we learn plenty of history. about both the style and the techniques.
Why I also chose tanglang and a traditional practice was also because of the weapons. This is the very martial part of the art.
How much modern fighters such as grapplers or MMA seems to be effective I think what they lack of is mastering a weapon. Their skills are more for a regulated tournament while traditional fighting arts were designed to be adapted to a realistic warfare.
it’s not really realistic… what are the chances of you getting caught with a kwan dao or your opponent having one? there are some weapons that will translate to umbrellas and pipes and such, such as broadsword and staff, but there are alot of weapons that are impractical. even a meteor hammer or chainwhip - how many chains do you see laying on the ground and accessible? do you carry one with you at all times? Those weapons were realistic back in the day, but not so much these days…
How much they make publicity of their stuff it ain t martial it is just a sport combat. Submissions are for competitions but weapons kill you for real.
do you think submissions can’t kill? put a choke on someone and don’t let go… watch what happens. submissions also break bones.
Back in time mastering the 18 weapons were an important part of your martial instruction. And this what I focus on. This why I try to concentrate on Tanglang.
Are the things that were important back then just as important as they are today? Or has that changed?
It takes a whole life to understand it and I am very happy to take that challenge in order to be satisfied. I am not interested at all in tournament since I find them artificial so Tanglang fits my lifestyle when I have to face difficult situations.
what makes your training less artificial than a sport fighter’s?
Since I knew about Tanglang I wanted to try it and now that I do practice it there is no way for me to stop.
good answer.
By the way when you read about Tanglang you can conclude that it is a sort of MMA since Wang Lang was said to have “mixed” different techniques from various masters of his time.
no, you can’t… the term MMA applies to training a grappling style and a striking style. wang lang may have been able to fall into that category if he practiced ground grappling, but he condensed what he knew into one style, consequently, his students aren’t mixed students.
Seven Star,
… in thai and judo, we learn plenty of history. about both the style and the techniques…
No doubt.
it’s not really realistic
Well it is. Weapons like the sword weren t invented just to make you look fancy. So what you learn from it and its applications are clearly realistic. Now what you are saying is something else. You are telling me that there are few chance that you will use them. But this wasn t my point. I was just laying the difference between what is martial and what it isn t. Modern combat styles aren t because they don t cover this issue. At least few do it. But maybe I am wrong.
BTW I often carry my broad sword since I train everyday. Of course I am not saying that I am always going to take somebody s head off every time I get into a fight
do you think submissions can’t kill? put a choke on someone and don’t let go… watch what happens. submissions also break bones.
Look if you wan t to kill you don t do submissions…There are surely better ways to kill.But this is off topic. Anyway what I am concerned with is my practice of Tanglang how I can use the best of it.
what makes your training less artificial than a sport fighter’s?
It is not the training that I am talking about, it is what you do with it. Gloves and tournaments are artificial. Street fighting or defending yourself isn t artificial. There is no round, no referee, no doctor and surely no ring. It is only you and your opponent, it is a matter of life and death and not about who got the medal. Tanglang wasn t made for the ring I guess. As I see it, Tanglang suits well for various situations in your everyday life and this is what makes it tasty to me. Rings are excepted situations ambushes aren t and practising Tanglang gave me the right answers when I had to take the right stand.
Thanks for reading this.
that’s actually a pretty cool idea! I’ll try to get it instituted.
sweeeeeet…it would have to be all fiery and ****ed off looking.
i guess it would have to be TrueType font
MATTEROFFACT is kind of cool
Neolith might work…
anyway, it would be funny and cool.
I was thinking about MMAers that think TCMA is BS, and I think Tito is arrogant.
I agree, Tito is very arrogant. But you know, he’s won a bunch of fights…he can basically back up his arrogance.
Kinda funny talking that way about a guy that would whip my ass any day of the week.
The question to think about is WHY?
Why do mma’ers think that TCMA is BS?
Answer: No pudding.
that’s the TV tito. tito also donates to several youth charities.
Originally posted by slobo
Well it is. Weapons like the sword weren t invented just to make you look fancy. So what you learn from it and its applications are clearly realistic. Now what you are saying is something else. You are telling me that there are few chance that you will use them. But this wasn t my point. I was just laying the difference between what is martial and what it isn t. Modern combat styles aren t because they don t cover this issue. At least few do it. But maybe I am wrong.
weapons are real, no doubt about that. What I was saying is how realistic is learning to use a kwan dao, for example. They are heavy, so you gain things like forearm strength, but that is not an efficient way to merely gain forearm strength. Realistic weapons training? IMO - stick, knife and gun.
BTW I often carry my broad sword since I train everyday. Of course I am not saying that I am always going to take somebody s head off every time I get into a fight
yeah, I used to carry mine too. It’s funny watching the reactions of people to a big black dude walking around with a broadsword.
Look if you wan t to kill you don t do submissions…There are surely better ways to kill.But this is off topic. Anyway what I am concerned with is my practice of Tanglang how I can use the best of it.
right. you use a gun. empty handed, what you would do wouldn’t be too much more efficient than what I would do…
It is not the training that I am talking about, it is what you do with it. Gloves and tournaments are artificial. Street fighting or defending yourself isn t artificial.
that’s not what I was getting at. you aren’t training in the street, correct? you are in your cushiony kwoon, just as I am in my cushiony ring. rounds and rules don’t matter either way - Throwing you on your head hurts. Leg kicks hurt. a hook to the jaw can KO you in the street or the ring. I think too many people get caught up in the “you are training a ring sport thing” and look over such things. But, that’s something to address in a different thread.
Seven, understood. I’ve heard that before. I’ll rephrase: I don’t like his ‘stage’ presence. I realize that there is a % of the UFC thing that is akin to WWF and they need the flamboyant fighters to help sell it…just don’t like all the attitude.
Back on topic
K guys,…As per “I got hammered”, turn this thread around or I will lock it.
One moment BEI…
See seven star!
Thats a moderator’s job!
To keep the topic martial art realted
To keep everyones posts on the subject at hand.
To keep the forum alive with martial arts disscussion
To keep a professional attidtude and respect the members.
This is why Bei has done so well at keeping this board and all it’ threads soley on the subject of praying mantis and does so in a courteous and respectful manor and we apluad him for it.
OK back to the topic.
I was a BB in gojyu ryu and was told of this master from taiwan comming to NY and giving a seminar on praying mantis. I never heard of this style before and wasnt really into chinese arts at the time but was insisted to go.
I showed up in my Gi like a idiot and was picked out of the crowd to be made an example of . I was asked to throw a punch. I was then touched twice and thrown on the ground. I got up and asked if he would do that again… This time I really tried to hit him (mind you I was fighting full contact on the ISKA circut) he again touched me twice, differntly this time but with the same results I was on the ground.
I got up bowed and asked if i could be his student.
It was then he explianed shui chiao’s and its effortless throws. Then he did an iron palm break and showed us some taiji fighting applications.
I was hooked and havent stop training since.
I was amazed to find all that in one style he later expalined that it is not just a style of kung fu but an entire system.
This is something that many people don’t understand.
In order to have a complete system you must have the fighting the (hard side) and the internal (soft side), which includes medicine.
Most good systems have these aspects. While more than many do not.
This is what is confusing in the US only the fighting is taught or deemed important. Most of the other part is missing.
These 2 sides make up a whole. The yin yang symbol must be complete. To many people leave out parts of thier sytem which makes it incomplete not that its thier fault but possible they wern’t taught, or they think its unimportant and just fighting is all they like.
This is what has happened to taiji. Thats why so many people think its for health and you must were silk PJ’s and it has no fighting applications at all.This shows the ignorance of many people in this country.
I mean why else is it called grand ultimate?.
Why train in Mantis Boxing ? After reading this thread which again seems to be turning into a school yard debate lets get back to the question . If you have never been to a Mantis school or seen first hand the art of mantis Boxing ( or felt the hand of mantis boxing ) then leave this thread because you have no knowledge of the style you are slatting . If you have never experienced it how can you ditch it ? Why train in grappling arts ? Because in your experience it gives you what you want . The same applies to us who train in Mantis style .
There is a vast gap between SPORT MARTIAL ARTS and the traditional martial arts . People should not confuse the two . We train to pass on the heritage of 400 years worth of learning . This is what is important to us . Unfortunatly there are no tournaments for Mantis mainly because it is not a tournament style , it is for real life , for all your life .
well said strike.
e dragon, I agree that a complete system such as mantis should be taught as a complete art not just the combative side. If you train properly then you need the medicinal side to help heal the conditioning. As well as internal, applying mechanics to produce power which is internal. Also the internal aspect of iron arm and body.
May I ask who the person was that turned you on to mantis?
Yes shirker, it was Shuyn Kwan Long (James shyun)more can be found about him at www.8step.com
Originally posted by EarthDragon
[B]One moment BEI…
See seven star!
Thats a moderator’s job!
To keep the topic martial art realted
To keep everyones posts on the subject at hand.
To keep the forum alive with martial arts disscussion
To keep a professional attidtude and respect the members.
This is why Bei has done so well at keeping this board and all it’ threads soley on the subject of praying mantis and does so in a courteous and respectful manor and we apluad him for it.
The southern forum stays on topic, and I am the mod of it as well.
the main forum is the catch all - alot of boards have a general chat forum where anything can be discussed. Maybe you haven’t noticed, but KFM doesn’t have that. Consequently, it’s been accepted that the main forum is the general forum. If you don’t like it, don’t go there…
Originally posted by EarthDragon
[B]
These 2 sides make up a whole. The yin yang symbol must be complete. To many people leave out parts of thier sytem which makes it incomplete not that its thier fault but possible they wern’t taught, or they think its unimportant and just fighting is all they like.
This is what has happened to taiji. Thats why so many people think its for health and you must were silk PJ’s and it has no fighting applications at all.This shows the ignorance of many people in this country.
I mean why else is it called grand ultimate?. [/B]
Is that due to the ignorance of people here, or how it was taught to them? Somewhere along the line, someone had to have only been interested in the health benefits - either that or someone wasn’t shown the martial side. Either way, it then caught on like wildfire. Taiji is taught for health in many countries, not just this one…