Hi Carl,
Thanks for your insites. A couple thoughts on my part. I thought the words provide a vibration that affects the various organs. I would think that vibration would be whats important. Vibration would come from the tone or frequency/pitch of the words rather than the exact words. Though percussion and ressonance would play an impotant role…which would be the actual words. I wonder if they have to be Cantonese words in specific. Just out of fun, would the set exist had the south spoke maderian or some other language?
Another thing…You said that you teach the iron wire before the 5 animals and that others did this as well. I might be confused, but the people I have spoken with seem to say that the 5 animal form is a bridge between Fu Hok and Iron Wire. It was created to bridge the two forms. If that is true, then it would be odd to learn it after iron wire. I suspect you don’t beleive this, right? What would the 5 animal 5 element form teach that is not found in either fu hok or iron wire?
If you don’t mind me asking, which lineages/teachers teach the iron wire early? I have never heard this, so it is interesting for me.
Thank you for sharring your experience.
Tom
Weed
No doubt that the sounds would be different as would the form. The Shaolin Temple had sets that did use sounds in mandarin. Also for internal training. It is not that the Mandarin speaker can not make the sounds, it is that the Characters as written would be spoken differently. No doubt different characters could be used to get the same sounds.
Five animal precedes the wire set. It is a legacy from the Shaolin temple. Pak Yuk Feng’s 170 movements based on the five animals: tiger, leopard, snake, dragon and crane. The wire set is created by Dit Kiu Saam one of the ten tigers of Canton. The wire set is based on the dragon energy of Hung Gar.
The wire set was never hard to get. The ten pattern was always the one no one would teach. It was a right of passage for instructors to identify as completeing the system. Additionally, the movements are the more advanced techniques in that it contains new techniques not in Fu Hok and Gung Ji Fook Fu (the other three animals). There are also those that teach the sup yin as ten animals: tiger, leopard, snake, crane, dragon, lion, elephant, monkey, tiger cub and horse. I have learned both versions. there is also a difference in the sup yin in that one version uses the ending of fu hok to complete the set and another does not. The wire presents no special bridge to learning the sup yin and visa versa.
I would like to quote Master Lai Ng Sam " Iron wire boxing is considered the foundational pillar of our system and is often one of the first forms I teach my students." He goes on to say " Many Hung Ga teachers claim Iron Wire boxing must only be taught to the most advanced students as it is too dangerous for the begining student. I do agree internal health or martial exercises must be practiced under the guidance of a qualified instructor, but I do not believe one must be a martial artist to practice Iron Wire Boxing."
from an article in Qi magazine.
I would like to add information from the book on the wire set from Lam Sai wing (written by Ju Yu Jai) There are two passages, which make clear that the wire set is taught to beginners.
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“Dit Kiu Sam stayed in the temple and taught his sick friend Lee Chong the wire form. School teacher Lee had suffered from a life long disease.”
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Ju Yu Jai his own biography: “Teacher Ju did teach Traditional Chinese medicine. One of his favorite students in the class, had a bad condition. His concentration was poor, but Ju Yu jai liked him and decided to teach him the wire form to improve his energy and strengthening his focus.”
These statements show that the wire set has been and CAN be used as a separate set outside of learning Hung Gar to improve the health. In these cases, the wire form is viewed as a separate entity from the rest of the style and taught as such.
I personally do not disconnect the Wire set from the rest of the system but would have no objection to teaching it as the first or second form.