UF: yes, muscles work by becoming tense, so your right, you cannot hold up your arms, or move them, or even breath or have a heart rate without some degree of functional muscle tension. You win.
There should even be a natural forward pressure and an undeniable forward tension when you have a proper and solid structure. Forward pressure is not tension, forward pressure is not you pressing forward with your arms or legs.
During the first section of the SLT, the different structures will be charged differently. I fail to see how you can tense your forearm muscles and remain soft and pliable, and maintain proper arm structure. During a form I can understand the application of tension in the forearms (not all the time as that would breed bad habits) but against another person, wether in sparring or in chi sau, you cant be serious, thats like handing your opponent two handles to do what he wants with you.
C’mon, you have sparred people, been hit, knocked down, etc - what usually happens when a newbie starts getting hit etc? His arms, along with the rest of him tense up, and thats like chirstmas morning for any WCK player worth his salt. Bamboo in the wind man.
What would the advantages of having a tensed forearm be if you feel force coming
Hmmm, I can’t see the advantage of that. I was taught to remain relaxed to help sense your opponents intended actions. By this I mean, relaxed, as opposed to being stiff and rigid, which will hender your speed and power. I do not mean relaxed like a limp noodle with no kind of composure.
the underpart of tan sau can be tensed, which helps aid in the wedging effect that a good tan sau will generate - this helps propel a strike after that tan sau. much like bouncing off a diving board. just like the tensing on the impact of a strike.
but the forearms definately should not be tense all the time
Originally posted by yenhoi
[B]UF: yes, muscles work by becoming tense, so your right, you cannot hold up your arms, or move them, or even breath or have a heart rate without some degree of functional muscle tension. You win.
There should even be a natural forward pressure and an undeniable forward tension when you have a proper and solid structure. Forward pressure is not tension, forward pressure is not you pressing forward with your arms or legs.
During the first section of the SLT, the different structures will be charged differently. I fail to see how you can tense your forearm muscles and remain soft and pliable, and maintain proper arm structure. During a form I can understand the application of tension in the forearms (not all the time as that would breed bad habits) but against another person, wether in sparring or in chi sau, you cant be serious, thats like handing your opponent two handles to do what he wants with you.
[/B]
The forms can be trained with tension in the forearm to build the muscle there. In Chi -sau you are correct there must be a slight forward pressure. This is what I am referring to when I say slight pressure or tension (perhaps tension is a misleading term. The point is, the arm is not limp, it is flexible and light, but there is some slight resistance and pressure applied there otherwise you are just holding out your arms as they say.
A complete novice can quickly learn to hold pout his arms so they are soft and relaxed feeling, but he will not have learned how to respond to incoming force or launch outward like ‘bamboo’. This is what chi-sau is all about and what takes time amd practice to learn.
I figured as much. Personally I would suggest an entirely seperate full body dynamic tension set as opposed to using the SLT for such needs.
Do you guys stop tensing the muscles in the forearms while doing your form(s?) at some point? Do you tense the muscles in the forearms while doing your other forms?
That article says “Don’t fight the force…give into it…go with it…use it”.
The forms can be trained with tension in the forearm to build the muscle there.
Why do you want that kind and quality of muscle? For what purpose specifically?
A complete novice can quickly learn to hold pout his arms so they are soft and relaxed feeling, but he will not have learned how to respond to incoming force or launch outward like ‘bamboo’.
So, with this forearm tension, you hope to develop your arm so that it can’t be deflected when it launches forward?
Originally posted by UltimateFighter
[B] The forms can be trained with tension in the forearm to build the muscle there. In Chi -sau you are correct there must be a slight forward pressure. This is what I am referring to when I say slight pressure or tension (perhaps tension is a misleading term. The point is, the arm is not limp, it is flexible and light, but there is some slight resistance and pressure applied there otherwise you are just holding out your arms as they say.
A complete novice can quickly learn to hold pout his arms so they are soft and relaxed feeling, but he will not have learned how to respond to incoming force or launch outward like ‘bamboo’. This is what chi-sau is all about and what takes time amd practice to learn.
Originally posted by TjD imho training siu lim tau with dynamic tension is only reinforcing bad habits. but mabye its good for karate-wing-chun
Yes on both counts—it can be good for karate-wing-chun. If beginners train with dynamic tension in the Sil Nim Tao, they will initially increase their power over the first six months of their training, but unless they unlearn it, they will never progress to correct energy coming from the horse and hand being as one, Sun Sao Hop Yat.
Yes on both counts—it can be good for karate-wing-chun. If beginners train with dynamic tension in the Sil Nim Tao, they will initially increase their power over the first six months of their training, but unless they unlearn it, they will never progress to correct energy coming from the horse and hand being as one, Sun Sao Hop Yat.
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Yet again you’ve missed the point. Training the forearm muscle is different from the fook sau in chi sau practice!!! The ‘tension’ in the forearm is to train the muscle but in chi sau it should be relaxed with only slight forward pressure. Soft and flexible like bamboo.
How many times must I stress this before it sinks in? But anyhow, you train it how you like, the only person whos wing chun is stunted is your own.
How many times must I stress this before it sinks in? But anyhow, you train it how you like, the only person whos wing chun is stunted is your own. [/B]
you took my joke far too seriously, if anyones being an internet warrior it is you. i have made no comments on your wing chun, however you seem to thing everyone elses is stunted :eek: that’s a pretty bold statement. many people on here have more years of wing chun that you and i multiplied, i think you could learn a bit from them.
posting on a forum is like wing chun, subtle. you cannot sway people to your point of view by yelling and telling them they suck. you have to be more discreet about it. hell, even the many posters with 10, or 20+ years of wing chun under their belt cant sway many peoples opinions, even with theory and example to back them up, how is saying “your wing chun sucks” going to accomplish anything, if people like that have a hard time?
In response to censored’s question about the forearm muscle development:
According to Leung Ting it is to develop “an additional punching muscle in the arm”. Most people mainly use only a single muscle in the arm when they punch which is the tricep. But the forearm can also be developed to add additional power to the punch , or “inch power”.
Also, the forearm and wrist regions are the most important areas of the arm for a wing chun fighter. These areas must be developed as they are the areas in contact. Just as it is necessary to strengthen the leg muscles in SNT stance for a stable root it is necessary to strengthen the forearm and wrist.
UFC- there are pretty good folks who do not develop muscles with dynamic tension for wing chun punches. What I am gathering is that there are folks who think that they need to do so.
I need my triceps when I am pushing a car but I need them minimally for wing chun punches.
Joy chaudhuri
Joy
Originally posted by yuanfen UFC- there are pretty good folks who do not develop muscles with dynamic tension for wing chun punches. What I am gathering is that there are folks who think that they need to do so.
I need my triceps when I am pushing a car but I need them minimally for wing chun punches.
Joy
That is unfortunately very wrong. How do you figure you don’t need triceps when doing chainpunches when this is the main muscle that is used when delivering the punch? This is simple physiology. Maybe you use Ki to power your punches but most people use the triceps as this is the muscle involved in muscle extension.
