Unleass you can knock or kick your opponent down and hurt your opponent badly, your opponent may still come back at you and the fight is not over yet. If you take your opponent down, you can finish him on the ground with arm bar, leg bar, choke, … you can also finish him with “follow on striking”. Many effective finish moves are:
kick your opponent’s head when he is down (IMO, this is the most effective finish move. A friend of mine his son was killed by this).
smash the back of your opponent’s head to the ground (skull cracking).
drop your opponent’s head directly to the ground (air plane crashing).
drop your knee on your opponent’s chest (ribs breaking).
drop your knee into your opponent’s groin (nuts smashing).
drop your elbow on your opponent’s throat (wind pipe smashing).
drop your elbow on your opponent’s heart (heart breaking).
…
“Combat” or “sport”, those finish strategy just don’t obtain enough attention (or training time) as arm bar, leg bar, and choke. How to “execute” those finish strategy is one thing. How to “set up” those finish strategy is another. Those finish strategy will require you to throw your opponent in certain way that your leg, hand, knee, elbow, can reach to your opponent’s desired body part. This will require “planning” which is not be as simple as it may look. For example, if you throw your opponent too far, your kick won’t be able to reach to his head.
I would recommend you stay off the head. It can end with your getting a great deal of unwanted attention.
Taking someone down should be avoided unless you do it while remaining standing, and unless you intend to break an arm or wrist for the guy, I would not mess with the arm bar and such. You place yourself in un necessary danger like that. The only way I would throw someone like that would be a simple takedown by kicking the back of the knee when possible. There are a lot of throws or sweeps that can be used that will not place you in danger, but I would avoid bodily contact.
I would recommend you stay off the head. It can end with your getting a great deal of unwanted attention.
Taking someone down should be avoided unless you do it while remaining standing, and unless you intend to break an arm or wrist for the guy, I would not mess with the arm bar and such. You place yourself in un necessary danger like that. The only way I would throw someone like that would be a simple takedown by kicking the back of the knee when possible. There are a lot of throws or sweeps that can be used that will not place you in danger, but I would avoid bodily contact.
In all self defense I teach, you should immoblize your opponent you by taking them down. In this situation I placed my knee to his head (all your body weight should lean on his head) and applied an arm bar to his elbow (not visible).
I am not saying that every situation should go to the ground, but if you can not get your opponent to flee or for your self to flee, then you must immoblize him. Immoblizing him can difuse the situation temporarily and or end it right then and there.
but I see where you’re going with this. I guess you have to think about ending the fight. I’d say in one on one, the BJJers and Judo guys have the best legal option. Classic RNC taken all the way to the pass out.
If it’s a situation that requires an ending action… TCMA should look to extreme chin na. Break a limb - heck - break the guy’s fingers and that should be enough.
I suppose the most classic set up and finish in SongShan Shaolin would be the technique ‘Hai Di Lou Yue’ (Fish the moon out of the sea). It typically involves feinting to the eyes, strike the groin, then because after being hit in the groin most people bow their head and drop their guard at least slightly, you grab their hair/head and push it down and thump them on the back of the head. (Jingang Dao Dui, Guardian pounds a morter).
100 variations of this combo appear. strike to eyes, strike groin, strike back of head as they bend over. Its simple and fast. Sometimes a kick to the groin, more often though a strike with the fingers is enough and easier to get in, harder to see coming.
The important thing here is the overall strategy of the fight. In a lot of Shaolin technique sets, the entire strategy is to capture the head. Every move is a way to set up the opportunity to capture the head. Once you have it, their are many ways to wrench it, strike it or lock it.
However…
We do have 3 WuDe Rules in Shaolin, the second rule is ‘Bu neng da dao ren’. Don’t hit someone who has fallen down. This is partly Wude and morally correct. However it is also to do with safety. If you are alone kicking someone who is down, it is quite possible for you to become entangled and they take you down with them, at which point you have lost the advantage you had and left yourself in a very dangerous position.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1169939]Unleass you can knock or kick your opponent down and hurt your opponent badly, your opponent may still come back at you and the fight is not over yet. If you take your opponent down, you can finish him on the ground with arm bar, leg bar, choke, … you can also finish him with “follow on striking”.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=MightyB;1169964]Sometimes you scare me :eek:[/QUOTE]
In what way?
Every throw will have a “follow on strike” associate with it. That’s how a Chinese wrestler trains his throw. It’s also part of the ranking test requirement. This is the major difference between “sport” and “combat”.
Example 1 - kick your opponent’s head when he is down:
There is no answer to this question. There are so many combinations of technique and tactics one can use to “finish” an opponent. The possibilities are endless. And there is no such thing as “the best way”, it’s all opinionated. For me, the best way to finish an opponent is not to get attacked by him/her in the first place. Shi Su Xi used to teach his students that one should be so good at their martial arts they never half to use it.
I think the question is whether it is a good thing to train finishing techniques. Yes, it is. In MMA, those bars become breaks, the submissions become strangulations. It simply comes down to the mindset of the individual in training. The problem with teaching people how to “go there” has more to do with the law. If you took the time to finish off your opponent, you had time to get away. xxx years, no parole. So what if you are a good guy with no priors. Wait, you are a white belt? That sounds like a MASTER to me.
[QUOTE=Shaolin;1169978]There is no answer to this question. There are so many combinations of technique and tactics one can use to “finish” an opponent. The possibilities are endless. And there is no such thing as “the best way”, it’s all opinionated. For me, the best way to finish an opponent is not to get attacked by him/her in the first place. Shi Su Xi used to teach his students that one should be so good at their martial arts they never half to use it.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Shaolin;1169978]Shi Su Xi used to teach his students that one should be so good at their martial arts they never half to use it.[/QUOTE]
We buy fire insurance but we hope our houses will never be burn down. Why do you train your “iron palm”? You hope your hand will have “killing power”. You may train your “iron palm” all your life and you may never have to use it. Why do we want to spend time in front of a heavy bag? We hope that our punch will be strong enough to knock our opponent down (finish move).
It’s better to develop few dependable finish moves than to be able to do everything that we may not be all good at. In TCMA, it’s called “door guarding skill”. A BJJ guy may be good in arm bar but may not be good in leg bar or choke. That’s OK. We only need 1 finish move at anytime.
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1169986]We buy fire insurance but we hope our houses will never be burn down. Why do you train your “iron palm”? You hope your hand will have “killing power”. You may train your “iron palm” all your life and you may never have to use it. Why do we want to spend time in front of a heavy bag? We hope that our punch will be strong enough to knock our opponent down (finish move).
It’s better to develop few dependable finish moves than to be able to do everything that we may not be all good at. In TCMA, it’s called “door guarding skill”. A BJJ guy may be good in arm bar but may not be good in leg bar or choke. That’s OK. We only need 1 finish move at anytime.[/QUOTE]
We don’t have a choice for most insurances, it is legal extortion and mandated by most laws so you have no choice. You will usually never get back what you paid in.
