Define KF, as realistic modern martial art

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Kung Fu Forum
1

Ray wrote in closed thread post #127:
The claim is that Kung Fu as a practical, realistic modern martial art is dead. The evidence of this, NO ONE uses it in the UFC… the highest level of martial arts competition in the Western World.

The BOLD sentence being the problem at hand…which is defining purpose.

UFC is very far from realistic confrontations. I don’t need to go into why sport is different than street or what an average person encounters in everyday life. If you don’t know, then you’re sadly misinformed.

True, TOP MMA/UFC atheletes are awesome because the live, breath, eat and train to be bad arse in their venue. Because that is their PURPOSE to WIN in competition.

They do not represent the MASS population, which has a different purpose.

But If you can say that TMA of any kind (including CMA):

  • Has won in competition (which it has)
  • Has been used successfully in real world street fights (which it has)
  • Has been focused more on self defense and better health ( ditto)

…Then you cannot say that Kung fu is dead or doesn’t have purpose.

As a teacher, It’s true I currently focus more on self defense and to make my life better (also my student’s lives)

But not to be mistaken for a hippie, I’m always ready at the drop of a hat to throw down with anyone who steps in my face. That’s just my personality but also because as a NON Chinese Sifu…I often have to just to get respect, so be it.

But don’t roll or lump everyone together into one Useless hippie dog pile. There are plenty of people like me who are willing to fight…mabe not for competition anymore…but nonetheless still wiliing.

It’s just that my goals in life are different.

why do I feel like ROSS is watching?
haha, “O”

2

Brother,

I am in the same boat as you.

Have worked as a bouncer and used my skills to defend not only myself but others.

I really have no idea how to respond to people who think fighting in a ring in bike tights with rules is somehow a better representation of fighting skills than a street fight where there are no rules.

I just keep teaching my students how to deal with reality and how to not get killed.

3

The claim is that Kung Fu as a practical, realistic modern martial art is dead. The evidence of this, NO ONE uses it in the UFC… the highest level of martial arts competition in the Western World.

Every time someone hits, kicks, throws, and locks someone - they’re using TCMA!

Meditate on that for awhile.

4

MMA=Mixed martial arts. It comes from a wide mixture of traditional arts. I think a lot of people have forgotten that. I get tired of the stupid rants some people go over and over. It’s tiring actually. We’ve all seen and heard it a million times. It’s old and worn out. Honestly I don’t care anymore whether a traditionalist can fight or not. All I care about is what I do and how I do it. If people want to blow there own horn ohh well, blow away.

5

The fact of the matter is; for every jack off that says cma is worthless, there is a cma practitioner that could beat his ass. There are far to many men involved in training ANY martial style for this to not be the case. Only ignorant people with self inflicted delusions cant see how simple of a truth that is. Those people are not actually capable of holding even a semi intelligent conversation on the subject. As Confucius says: If i bring up one corner of the conversation, and you cannot even bring one of the other three corners into the discussion, you simply are not worth talking to. Thats where i am now witj jokers like that. Infantile minds are a waste of my time.

6

when it comes to the world of traditional gung fu, no one cares about what Ray Pina thinks, at all.

7

[QUOTE=Subitai;1155956]
why do I feel like ROSS is watching?
[/QUOTE]

Dare I say I miss the grouchy old man? :stuck_out_tongue:

8

[QUOTE=Pork Chop;1155971]Dare I say I miss the grouchy old man? :p[/QUOTE]

i always thot it sucked he took off. He may scare the townsfolk, but he was often that shining beacon of fug u

9

Clearly each of us is responsible for taking a video cam with us everywhere, getting into fights, then taping them and submitting them to certain individuals who will then judge us and then admonish us about how crappy we are and how what we have done isn’t anything like what Brock Lesnar would do in a back lane at night…

I think some people are just shocked that many of us “get it”, but don’t give it buy in for the context that is most often given.

well, tough titty.

10

Well at 57 years old I certainly won’t be proving the value of CMA in the UFC or any MMA event.

So that’s 2 threads locked now. Are we going for more? :smiley:

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Well at 57 years old I certainly won’t be proving the value of CMA in the UFC or any MMA event.

I highly doubt ray pina will be going to the UFC or any other fighting venue of this calibre in the near future as well.

12

[QUOTE=Dragonzbane76;1155964]MMA=Mixed martial arts. It comes from a wide mixture of traditional arts. I think a lot of people have forgotten that. I get tired of the stupid rants some people go over and over. It’s tiring actually. We’ve all seen and heard it a million times. It’s old and worn out. Honestly I don’t care anymore whether a traditionalist can fight or not. All I care about is what I do and how I do it. If people want to blow there own horn ohh well, blow away.[/QUOTE]

Agreed 100%.

13

Define KF, as realistic modern martial art :

Evidence #1
My 10 year old student was being bullied by another girl. The girl grabbed her and she (my student), used Chinese Shuai Chiao I taught her and tossed the girl on her a$s. The school principle student told me this himself.

Evidence #2
My 11 year old student defended a smaller 10 year boy from several bullies at school. He. When the bullies attacked the 10 year old, he stepped and kicked and punced and made the bully boys back off.

Evidence #3
Once a guy was trying to beat down his wife… I stepped in front of her, blocking his attempt to get at her. When he swang at me, I caught his right hook with my left eagles claw and then applied a right claw to his throat. This ended the situation right there.

This could go on and on, I have many more such stoires that provide proff that TCMA can work as a realistic modern Martial Art.

ginosifu

14

labeling or relabeling

we have been pretty much fighting the same way with open hands since stones ages

some one comes along and re names or re calls the same things over and over

we still fight the same way but with a different name or label.

skills or techniques work only in a certain context

what ever conditions/rules will dictate the optimal techniques in that scenario

stand up vs ground

grappling vs striking

KO vs throw/take down

on and on.

every technique used in MMA or Boxing ring

guess what there are also chinese terms for them or similar technique if not exactly the same in styles of kung fu.

again

call whatever you want

we fight the same way under the same conditions or rules

so kick box away kung fu way or mma way or boxing way

etc etc

15

CLF is MMA, actually.

TCMA is, by definition, MMA, because over the years, they were all influenced by others.

Only a dude who lived on a mountain fighting nobody else has a pure art. Otherwise, it’s only natural we take what works from other styles.

16

UFC fighter Alex Caseras is a JDK and BJJ fighter..

Alex Caceres

June 20, 1988 (age 23)
Other names Bruce Leroy
Nationality American
Height 5 ft 10 in (1.78 m)
Weight 135 lb (61 kg; 9.6 st)
Division Bantamweight
Featherweight
Lightweight
Reach 73 in (190 cm)
Style Jeet Kune Do, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
Stance Southpaw

17

[QUOTE=ginosifu;1156017]Define KF, as realistic modern martial art :

Evidence #1
My 10 year old student was being bullied by another girl. The girl grabbed her and she (my student), used Chinese Shuai Chiao I taught her and tossed the girl on her a$s. The school principle student told me this himself.

Evidence #2
My 11 year old student defended a smaller 10 year boy from several bullies at school. He. When the bullies attacked the 10 year old, he stepped and kicked and punced and made the bully boys back off.

Evidence #3
Once a guy was trying to beat down his wife… I stepped in front of her, blocking his attempt to get at her. When he swang at me, I caught his right hook with my left eagles claw and then applied a right claw to his throat. This ended the situation right there.

This could go on and on, I have many more such stoires that provide proff that TCMA can work as a realistic modern Martial Art.

ginosifu[/QUOTE]

ah, but if you can’t provide videos of said events then they’re not really evidence… :wink:

the only thing i’ll say about TCMA as a realistic modern martial art is that the practice of ancients weapons like swords and spears, while fun, are not readily applicable in today’s world of firearms. knives and clubs defense and use would still be valid however.

18

the only thing i’ll say about TCMA as a realistic modern is that the practice of ancients weapons like swords and spears, while fun, are not readily applicable in today’s world of firearms

not everyone carries a gun. Most don’t want to kill someone with a gun unless they are desperate. you are more likely to fight someone with no gun that you are with one. having a good handle and understanding of short weapons like a club, sword, ax, or what ever can still be applied with makeshift weapons.

19

[QUOTE=hskwarrior;1156082]not everyone carries a gun. Most don’t want to kill someone with a gun unless they are desperate. you are more likely to fight someone with no gun that you are with one. having a good handle and understanding of short weapons like a club, sword, ax, or what ever can still be applied with makeshift weapons.[/QUOTE]

i agreed. but to be a realistic modern ma, i feel that firearm defense should still be address, however low a probability such an encounter would be.

20

i agreed. but to be a realistic modern ma, i feel that firearm defense should still be address, however low a probability such an encounter would be.

true. we gotta learn like they did in the movie Equilibrium

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPD6TbYVbNc