[QUOTE=Phil Redmond;1083199]The VT/WC charging in chain punches can be taken advantage of by CLF.[/QUOTE]
Any “straight jab” can be countered by “hook punch” and that’s just the general “circular against straight line” principle which may not have anything to do with styles. This is also the Kempo guy’s favor move. They like to drop their leading arm down, any incoming straight punch, they like to use “ridge hand (similiar to hook punch)” to couner.
[QUOTE=Phil Redmond;1083219]So true James. What happens though is when people see clips of our guys fighting there have the "where is the WC? "mindset. They are expecting to see picture perfect, choreographed, kung fu movie, WC techs against a resisting opponent. People who’ve competed know better. Those who haven’t don’t.[/QUOTE]
This is because allot of people are thinking in a “style” way, that the training is meant to change everything they do or how they move. It does, but not in the sense that one has to be mechanical about it. Bruce Lee said it best, “One must be unnaturally natural or naturally unnatural,to be totally natural is unscientific and unefficient, to be too scientific is to move like a mechancial man, one has to find the happy medium in the middle..” (Pierre Burton interview 72’).
Phillip,
The dilemma I have is not being fixed or stuck in a box. If I follow WSL advice to the book, no striking unless within one step distance, I feel stuck in a box. Yes he discovered this tactic due to his fighting experience, I think each of us has to do the same thing. It is not that it is “bad” advice, it is just that there is a time and place for everything. If for e.g. I am just outside that “one step” range, does that mean I cannot strike?? For me if I have an opening I will strike, I may break some VT rules by doing so, but if the opportunity is there, I will take it (all fighting is a gamble, whether I strike with a jab or VT punch, there’s no guarantees). Now that doesn’t mean that I have to learn another method of striking. I’ve only ever practiced one MA, Wing Chun (1st TWC, now since 06’ WSLVT), but I have been a fan of boxing and can throw a decent jab, it’s not that hard to do. When I throw it now, I throw it while coming in slightly, so that the VT structure is essentially kicking in behind it as the distance is narrowed. If it works, great, if not there’s a backup plan already in place.
Hope you understand, not trying to say your wrong/I’m right, it’s not that simple, just a different way of looking at it. For the most part we’re on the same page:)
James
[QUOTE=hskwarrior;1083200]What you’re talking about here is owning your gung fu. It was given to us by our teachers, yet instead of owning it people tend to try n mirror their teacher becoming a carbon copy which wouldn’t allow you to express your own individuality. While training under my sifu he used to encourage us to find our own method of usage that suited us best. Not only would we know his way, we’d have our own as well.[/QUOTE]
This is true. No one can give you good kung fu, or VT, one must learn it themselves, thru the training curriculum, then use it themselves thru sparring and actual experience. A teacher/sifu/coach can only guide you, maybe help you complete the process faster by keeping you on track. One only learns by making mistakes, learning from them and going forward.
James
[QUOTE=Phil Redmond;1083220]Not that you’d really care but I must say that schools like yours make me proud to be a TCMA. We are looked down upon by many other MAs. Keep up the good work.
Also, you have a great name. Even though you spell it wrong. 
Phillip[/QUOTE]
Thank you, I do care and I am very flattered. It has always been my intention to promote the use of practical experience and critical reasoning to discern the efficiency of any combat method. So rather than wasting my time on researching what method is “better”, I prefer to objectively discover if what I’m doing serves its intended purpose.
It is my perspective that martial arts are combat methods, not some sort of pseudo-religion where blind faith overwhelms logic. So if practitioners of other methods make uneducated claims about combat methodologies that they know very little about, they are simply limiting themselves and would be better served by spending their time making what they practice work for them.
I’m pretty certain that humans have been fighting each other (for whatever reasons) long before any established combat methodology was developed, so I feel the TMA vs. MMA argument is a misinformed one, as I feel martial artists should train in an intelligent and progressive manner regardless of what method(s) they choose to study (be it BJJ, MT, VT, CLF, etc.).
With that said, even though I feel martial arts should be practiced progressively and intelligently, the martial arts (as per its origins) are not purely an intellectual exercises as the language of combat is ultimately spoken with the hands (and feet).
Thank you for your comment and I look forward to having more discussions like this in the future.
Regards,
Philip
BTW - it seems that there is an extra “L” in your name
Also a means of allowing us to express ourselves through physical movement.
I feel martial arts lets us look at ourselves honestly.
That’s the category of “more” than raw fighting potential.
[QUOTE=sihing;1083236]Hope you understand, not trying to say your wrong/I’m right, it’s not that simple, just a different way of looking at it. For the most part we’re on the same page:)James[/QUOTE]
I absolutely understand. Syntactic differences aside, I believe that we’re pretty much saying the same thing.
regards,
Philip
[QUOTE=Violent Designs;1083268]Also a means of allowing us to express ourselves through physical movement.
I feel martial arts lets us look at ourselves honestly.
That’s the category of “more” than raw fighting potential.[/QUOTE]
Agreed, as I believe “raw fighting potential” is something innate and differs from person to person. However, a well developed fighting methodology (when practiced intelligently) can/will improve a person’s “fighting ability” regardless of the level of their innate fighting potential (though of course, that innate potential still does play a significant factor).
And you’re correct, honesty is the key to self-improvement (among other virtues). As skill (of any sort) is not inherited but earned. And a good measuring stick for self-improvement is to see if the person you are today can (through diligent and intelligent training) defeat the person you were the day before.
regards,
Philip
[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1083221]Any “straight jab” can be countered by “hook punch” and that’s just the general “circular against straight line” principle which may not have anything to do with styles. This is also the Kempo guy’s favor move. They like to drop their leading arm down, any incoming straight punch, they like to use “ridge hand (similiar to hook punch)” to couner.[/QUOTE]
WC Sifu Allen Lee taught a sow choy vs a straight punch as well.
“A circle beats a straight line, and a straight line beats a circle” -this counts for hands as well as footwork, such as when you are cutting off his ring.
-Rik (some people misspell it using a c…)
[QUOTE=straightblast5;1083267]
BTW - it seems that there is an extra “L” in your name ;)[/QUOTE]
Good come back. 
[QUOTE=straightblast5;1083267]Thank you, I do care and I am very flattered.
It has always been my intention to promote the use of practical experience and critical reasoning to discern the efficiency of any combat method. So rather than wasting my time on researching what method is “better”, I prefer to objectively discover if what I’m doing serves its intended purpose. . . . . .I Thank you for your comment and I look forward to having more discussions like this in the future.[/QUOTE]
You’re welcome. I have a student in Chicago that has no place to train daily. I’ll recommend your school to him. I feel training in a good martial arts school is more important than the style or lineage.
[QUOTE=straightblast5;1083267]
BTW - it seems that there is an extra “L” in your name ;)[/QUOTE]
Good come back.
CLF (red) v WC (white) in one of the old Hong Kong tournaments.
CLF (red) v WC (white) in one of the old Hong Kong tournaments.
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTIwNzIwOTY=.html
The guy in red is Buk Sing Choy Lee Fut.
[QUOTE=extrajoseph;1083509]CLF (red) v WC (white) in one of the old Hong Kong tournaments.
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTIwNzIwOTY=.html[/QUOTE]
The supposedly wc guy bounces a lot and “reaches” for his punches!!
joy chaudhuri
[QUOTE=extrajoseph;1083509]CLF (red) v WC (white) in one of the old Hong Kong tournaments.
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTIwNzIwOTY=.html[/QUOTE]
Looks strongly to be Tarm Fei Pang lineage possibly.
[QUOTE=Violent Designs;1083619]Looks strongly to be Tarm Fei Pang lineage possibly.[/QUOTE]
The fighter in the red is Tsang Hin Kuen, son of Tsang Chiu Yu. Tsang Chiu Yu trained under Lun Chee.
[QUOTE=lone_walker;1083766]The fighter in the red is Tsang Hin Kuen, son of Tsang Chiu Yu. Tsang Chiu Yu trained under Lun Chee.[/QUOTE]
That would have been my other guess. 