Recently I have started cross training in JKD.
All of a sudden I am dealing with live opponents who know how to stick and move.
Even dealing with someone like myself who has a month or two of practice and guidance at boxing is a whole different kettle of fish to your average WC only training partner.
Bottom line is my WC tells me to go forward against a jab dealing with it with my hands as soon as I meet it.
Problem is
Anyone with basic knowledge of throwing a jab, snaps it out and back. I’m afraid it’s a physical impossibility for me to be able to react and follow that jab back in. I am just not even close to being quick enough and honestly cannot imagine I ever will be.
Most jabs are combined with a backward step (by the jab thrower) as soon as the jab has been thrown. This makes bridging even harder.
So to all you experienced guys who have or do try and apply WC against a boxer, what was your experience of this ? How did you solve it ?
i’m going to break this down on my site in the next few weeks
but i can only give you a road map covering different timings and angles , footwork and controlling distance
here is your first problem you started sparring before you used progressive isolation
[ so you have to deal with sensory overload ]
meaning you need to dial in your senses to a stationary jab , then a jab combined with foot work , then add in your footwork and work on interception timing , learn to cover the line and zone alittle chasing the hand will get you dropped buy the rear hand
this leads to the next progression same process as before add in the rear shot off the jab or by itself isolate it and turn up the heat in small increments
after you feel comfortable then spar lightly just working on timing and distance , don’t put any power in yet,
your foot work needs to adapt and control you balance
the more power you put in to soon you won’t be able to maintain you neutral balance and a boxer will eat you alive while you are making adjustments
you will have to develop your attributes speed timing balance power adaptability
technique or theory won’t hold water if you can’t apply them
but i’m very happy for you , your skills will evolve greatly from this
it when honesty sinks in and you can really work on the things that matter and make a diffrence
when you cover an area useing the left jab as a refernce point
you can use two concepts depending on your skill level
lets call them a point or a line
a point means your skill is a a higher level and can intercept the jab on a small point of contact , kind of how a boxer does with a slight parry
now we might use a pak just for the sake of example
to pull this of your speed and timing and distance ‘’ footork’’ have to be well developed . you have worked it so many times you see it coming a mile away .
a line is much safer you use a linear shape [ insert what ever shape you prefer here bui ,tan ,gan ,quan , counter punh to a fook concept wahtever] and cover the area the jab is coming from smoother the distance ,
this way you eat the position and cause him to have to adjust
still need foot work and eye sensitivity to read his shot though
now with a point concept you can fire back instantly
with the line you are securing a position ‘’ real estate ‘’
on dealing with the front and rear hand you can apply both concept or double up on the same
trick is you need to shut down the power side before it loads
Yup! That is you allright! I always notice that you talk from experience perspective. That’s one of the reasons that I like to watch your shadow in this forum. There are other shadows at work however. I enjoy their visits here just the same! Ha! Ha!
Originally posted by PaulH How do you cope with sensory overload?
By being able to act instead of react to different situations.Depending on memory or fixed patterns is always too slow,a beat after.
Developing a good line awareness is the real function of Chi Sau.Use that skill later in various sparring drills and free styles exchanges.Realise that various Wing Chun motions can nullify many kinds of attacks depending on the circumstances of the attacks.
Develop good footwork through moving Chi Sau and various sparring drills. Learn to stick to your opponent “down below” and jam his own footwork.Always move to striking distance before striking.Wait to have a clear line and don’t chase hands.Instead,occupy the opponent’s lines for defensive purposes and for making him having to adjust to you instead of the contrary.
Ernie
I can read about some good Wing Chun principles through your JKD verbiage!..
break the motion down into whole and part method
add in the timing begining middle and end
remove the ego and competitive factor and just let it sink in
through focused repitition
study the body mechanics , find the components needed for
this action to be effective , posture , position , distance
then learn to remove these components
break the posture
dominate the position
control the distance
all these area’s can be trained in isolation or in comination at
varing degress of intensity
this way you relate to common denominaters and don’t get
caught up in how angry or aggressive or emotional the
situation or opponent is
Old Jong, I can tell you with certainty that what Ernie mentioned is also what I have heard from Gary before. It’s beyond JKD and WC. It’s natural in all human beings.
Ernie, I guess I have to pay you to coach me some times on these. Ha! Ha!
[[[Ernie
I can read about some good Wing Chun principles through your JKD verbiage!.. ]]]
the terms and idea’s are striaght out of gary’s mouth ,
the concepts of drilling are from my own experience with many coaches of different approaches
what i learned is it’s a universal thing how the body learns
you must develop experiences
by createing isolated experiences you can become skill specific
it just depends on what ever tooling or concept you wish to train
the thread that binds gives way to universal truths
i would excpect wing chun to have the seeds of these truths
but the training methods will vary on how to make these seeds grow
if you want to label it this or that go for it .
the drill i describe is a boxers jab isolation drill , it teaches them how to deal with the jab , there tool there the best at it
i just take the drill and isert the wing chun tool and concept
this short cuts the drill but gives the wing chun person experience in that enviroment
how he later apply it in free form is a matter of there ability to adapt .
He He!
I was just teasing you with that JKD allusion!..
Seriously, I can relate to what you say. These things can be said with many kinds of words.It’s the ideas and principles that really count.
I like when you say: break the posture
dominate the position
control the distance …It’s very central to what I teach and “try” to do myself.
BTW, you ask where I been?..It’s just that I feel the need to train more so,I use more of my free times on that than posting here.But,I read what is going on from times to times.
i know your just having fun , train hard my friend , by the way your student i was speaking to is very well informed and had a great outlook on training and application , good work mr. jong
paul,
[[Oh No! I’m too Wingchunized for it! I like cozy neat little box to sleep in! Ha! Ha!]]]
the box is your own creation , not wing chun
just poke your head out and see
i know your just having fun , train hard my friend , by the way your student i was speaking to is very well informed and had a great outlook on training and application , good work mr. jong
[/B]
Thanks Ernie!
Yes, Alexandre is very serious in his practice.His skill is very high for a 1 1/2 year practitioner. That has to go with his dedication and love of the art.
It is a great feeling to see students growing up in something because of your teaching.Who would’nt feel proud in some ways.It’s a big responsability too. I bet you feel the same.
