What are all the energies/powers in baguazhang?
there are many jin/powers
most important one would be spiraling/unspiraling or coiling and uncoiling: luo xuan jin.
4 major types:
-
ning twisting
-
guo wrapping
-
fan flipping/reverse
-
zuan drilling (forward, upward, downward, backward—
eg.
a. use rotation of the forearm as an example
if you rotate outward (wai xuan) it is a peng jin
if you rotate inward (nei xuan) it is guo jin
again we have to learn and consider moves/powers in pair
b. twisting powers happen all over your body from wrist, forearm, elbow, waist, knee and steps–
untwisting would be the opposing moves/steps
4 major types may happen all at the same time
such as in “closing door and covering elbow”(opposing move would be “pushing window looking at the moon”)
“hidden/concealed flower under the leaf”
etc etc
[QUOTE=SPJ;1008949]there are many jin/powers
most important one would be spiraling/unspiraling or coiling and uncoiling: luo xuan jin.
4 major types:
-
ning twisting
-
guo wrapping
-
fan flipping/reverse
-
zuan drilling (forward, upward, downward, backward—
eg.
a. use rotation of the forearm as an example
if you rotate outward (wai xuan) it is a peng jin
if you rotate inward (nei xuan) it is guo jin
again we have to learn and consider moves/powers in pair
b. twisting powers happen all over your body from wrist, forearm, elbow, waist, knee and steps–
untwisting would be the opposing moves/steps
----[/QUOTE]
SPJ, thanks for the great explanation! do you pactice Yin or Cheng linage of Bagua, and are the energies/jin different for each linage of bagua?
I practice mainly cheng style, however, I was exposed to yin style as well.
in the overal structure/posture
we always maintain circular/round extending power or yuan cheng jin.
some may call it peng jin as well.
there are more strikes in yin as it is influenced by lou han boxing from shaolin
it is considered as hard ba gua.
on the other hand, cheng style is influenced by shuai jiao
it is considered as soft ba gua.
in yin stepping just fast and steady
in cheng stepping due to shuai jiao, the bai bu and kou bu are very much stressed in each posture. due to ready to throw
other people in the forum may chime in any time
[QUOTE=SPJ;1009001]I practice mainly cheng style, however, I was exposed to yin style as well.
in the overal structure/posture
we always maintain circular/round extending power or yuan cheng jin.
some may call it peng jin as well.
there are more strikes in yin as it is influenced by lou han boxing from shaolin
it is considered as hard ba gua.
on the other hand, cheng style is influenced by shuai jiao
it is considered as soft ba gua.
in yin stepping just fast and steady
in cheng stepping due to shuai jiao, the bai bu and kou bu are very much stressed in each posture. due to ready to throw
other people in the forum may chime in any time
—[/QUOTE]
Once again thanks for the great explanation!
I’ve heard that Yin fu was the only one of Dong Hai Chuan’s student to recieve his full transmition of Bagua, based on your experience, do you believe this to be true?
Yin stayed the longest time with Dong.
however, Dong taught each disciple differently since they had different CMA background and different physical features–
–
-
ba gua, we “spin” (rotate) along the spine and our posture is like a reel, the center line is the spine. we also spin/rotate our arms along the line of the arm—
-
tai chi, we create a ball with both arms/hands and the body, and dan tian being the center of the ball
there are some commonalities, however, there are also different emphases.
[QUOTE=SPJ;1009199]1. ba gua, we “spin” (rotate) along the spine and our posture is like a reel, the center line is the spine. we also spin/rotate our arms along the line of the arm—
- tai chi, we create a ball with both arms/hands and the body, and dan tian being the center of the ball—[/QUOTE]
So when bending at the waist in bagua, the spine is still the center, or reference point of rotation?
Is the peng jin/yuan cheng jin the same as the peng jing in tai chi (ward off)?
Zhuan Zhang Yao Qiu Kou Jue
Essential Secrets of Yin Style’s Circle Turning
Zhuan yao ding jing han zhe xiong, hou zhou zhan xiong qian shou ping. Song jian zhui zhou ta zhu wan, zhou shou bu li xing si gong.
Turn the waist, stretch up the neck, concave the chest. The back elbow sticks tight to the chest [solar plexus], the front hand is held level. Relax the shoulders, the elbows fall [as if being pulled down by a weight], the wrist drops. The elbow and hand must not lose the shape of a curved bow.
Dazhi ting li er zhi ling, zhongzhi zhi li zhang xin kong. Sizhi wuzhi hebing zhu, yu ji he zhu xiao tian zing.
The index finger is held strong and straight, the middle finger points to and leads the direction of the hand and is held strong and upright. The center of the palm is held hollow. The ring and little fingers are held together as one. The edges joined gathering the small heavenly star.
Chuan zhang shou xing si wa long, da zhuai he li ru laogong. Si zhi yong li hebing zhu, xiao bi an qi xiang qian ting.
In the penetrating palm the hand has a shape similar to a spade trowel. The thumb is tightly held in, covering lao gong point. The four fingers squeeze together as one and are held straight with force. The forearm presses down and stabs straight forward.
Dun cun xi kua zu tang shui, zu zhi zhua di jiao xin kong. San jian chui cheng yi xian, san lian yi ti bianhua sheng. Zhuan zhang yao qiu tou shen zheng, Si zhi mo shao guan li xing.
Squat down, bend the knee, hip, and ankle like when crossing a river. The ten toes must grasp the ground while raising up the center of the feet. The three tips [(tip of the nose, tip of the fingers, tips of the toes)] must be aligned in a vertical line, the three must be linked as one when changing in order to develop skill. When turning (circle-walking) seek to keep the head and body upright to be correct. To be correct strength must extend out to the tips of the four limbs.
Essential Secrets of Circle Turning Turn the waist, stretch up the neck, concave the chest. The back elbow sticks tight to the chest [solar plexus], the front hand is held level. Relax the shoulders, the elbows fall [as if being pulled down by a weight], the wrist drops. The elbow and hand must not lose the shape of a curved bow.
The index finger is held strong and straight, the middle finger points to and leads the direction of the hand and is held strong and upright. The center of the palm is held hollow. The ring and little fingers are held together as one.
In the penetrating palm the hand has a shape similar to a spade trowel. The thumb is tightly held in, covering lao gong point. The four fingers squeeze together as one and are held straight with force. The forearm presses down and stabs straight forward.
Squat down, bend the knee, hip, and ankle like when crossing a river. The ten toes must grasp the ground while raising up the center of the feet. The three tips [(tip of the nose, tip of the fingers, tips of the toes)] must be aligned in a vertical line, the three must be linked as one when changing in order to develop skill. When turning (circle-walking) seek to keep the head and body upright to be correct. To be correct strength must extend out to the tips of the four limbs.
Yin Shi Baguazhang Ge
Yin Style Baguazhang Songs
Bagua zhuan zhang huan shi yan fa kou jue
The secrets of Bagua’s turning, changing, methods of observing, and use of intent.
Liang yan yuan zheng liu lu guan, si mian bafang kan zhou quan. Shuang yan sui shou ru shan dian, zhan qian gu hou zuo you kan.
Both eyes need to be open to the six pathways in front of you, attentively observe in all directions. Both eyes need to follow the hands like following a glimpse of lightning, gaze at the front hand, be mindful of the back hand, guard against the left and the right.
Tou ding duan zheng san mian guan, xuan zhuan duo shan xuan feng ban. Guan ding duifang huan fa bian, sui ji ying bian fa huan xian.
The head is held upright to observe the 3 sides, spin and turn, dodge like a whirlwind. Watch for and determine the opponents changes in order to transform them.
Dangchang dongshou yan shen xian, cheng xu gongji mo chiyan. Yiju yi dong shuang yan kan, quan zai shuang jing shen yi tuan.
Follow the source, adapt to their change and transform it before it arrives. At that time show intent with the eyes before the hands touch and take advantage of their momentary lapse, attack without delay. In one move you will have used one to transform both of theirs as they stand by passively with their eyes fixated on your one hand.
Duifang bianhuan kan kua jian, jian kua qi dong shou jiao tian. Dongshou shu zhao bu shu yan, shou yan shenfa yan dang xian.
Observe the opponents hips and shoulders to see their changes. The shoulders and hips move simultaneously with the movement of the limbs. Use the touching [crossing] of the hands to feel their intentions not their eyes. Hand, eye, body movement the eyes move first.
Yan sui xin bianhuan sui yan, xu shi jin tui yan xian guan.
The eyes follow the heart, the changes follow the eyes. To know whether to advance or retreat first observe with the eyes.
[QUOTE=BGZ BadBoy;1009939]
Zhuan Zhang Yao Qiu Kou Jue
Essential Secrets of Yin Style’s Circle Turning
Zhuan yao ding jing han zhe xiong, hou zhou zhan xiong qian shou ping. Song jian zhui zhou ta zhu wan, zhou shou bu li xing si gong.
Turn the waist, stretch up the neck, concave the chest. The back elbow sticks tight to the chest [solar plexus], the front hand is held level. Relax the shoulders, the elbows fall [as if being pulled down by a weight], the wrist drops. The elbow and hand must not lose the shape of a curved bow.
Dazhi ting li er zhi ling, zhongzhi zhi li zhang xin kong. Sizhi wuzhi hebing zhu, yu ji he zhu xiao tian zing.
The index finger is held strong and straight, the middle finger points to and leads the direction of the hand and is held strong and upright. The center of the palm is held hollow. The ring and little fingers are held together as one. The edges joined gathering the small heavenly star.
Chuan zhang shou xing si wa long, da zhuai he li ru laogong. Si zhi yong li hebing zhu, xiao bi an qi xiang qian ting.
In the penetrating palm the hand has a shape similar to a spade trowel. The thumb is tightly held in, covering lao gong point. The four fingers squeeze together as one and are held straight with force. The forearm presses down and stabs straight forward.
Dun cun xi kua zu tang shui, zu zhi zhua di jiao xin kong. San jian chui cheng yi xian, san lian yi ti bianhua sheng. Zhuan zhang yao qiu tou shen zheng, Si zhi mo shao guan li xing.
Squat down, bend the knee, hip, and ankle like when crossing a river. The ten toes must grasp the ground while raising up the center of the feet. The three tips [(tip of the nose, tip of the fingers, tips of the toes)] must be aligned in a vertical line, the three must be linked as one when changing in order to develop skill. When turning (circle-walking) seek to keep the head and body upright to be correct. To be correct strength must extend out to the tips of the four limbs.
Essential Secrets of Circle Turning Turn the waist, stretch up the neck, concave the chest. The back elbow sticks tight to the chest [solar plexus], the front hand is held level. Relax the shoulders, the elbows fall [as if being pulled down by a weight], the wrist drops. The elbow and hand must not lose the shape of a curved bow.
The index finger is held strong and straight, the middle finger points to and leads the direction of the hand and is held strong and upright. The center of the palm is held hollow. The ring and little fingers are held together as one.
In the penetrating palm the hand has a shape similar to a spade trowel. The thumb is tightly held in, covering lao gong point. The four fingers squeeze together as one and are held straight with force. The forearm presses down and stabs straight forward.
Squat down, bend the knee, hip, and ankle like when crossing a river. The ten toes must grasp the ground while raising up the center of the feet. The three tips [(tip of the nose, tip of the fingers, tips of the toes)] must be aligned in a vertical line, the three must be linked as one when changing in order to develop skill. When turning (circle-walking) seek to keep the head and body upright to be correct. To be correct strength must extend out to the tips of the four limbs.
Yin Shi Baguazhang Ge
Yin Style Baguazhang Songs
Bagua zhuan zhang huan shi yan fa kou jue
The secrets of Bagua’s turning, changing, methods of observing, and use of intent.
Liang yan yuan zheng liu lu guan, si mian bafang kan zhou quan. Shuang yan sui shou ru shan dian, zhan qian gu hou zuo you kan.
Both eyes need to be open to the six pathways in front of you, attentively observe in all directions. Both eyes need to follow the hands like following a glimpse of lightning, gaze at the front hand, be mindful of the back hand, guard against the left and the right.
Tou ding duan zheng san mian guan, xuan zhuan duo shan xuan feng ban. Guan ding duifang huan fa bian, sui ji ying bian fa huan xian.
The head is held upright to observe the 3 sides, spin and turn, dodge like a whirlwind. Watch for and determine the opponents changes in order to transform them.
Dangchang dongshou yan shen xian, cheng xu gongji mo chiyan. Yiju yi dong shuang yan kan, quan zai shuang jing shen yi tuan.
Follow the source, adapt to their change and transform it before it arrives. At that time show intent with the eyes before the hands touch and take advantage of their momentary lapse, attack without delay. In one move you will have used one to transform both of theirs as they stand by passively with their eyes fixated on your one hand.
Duifang bianhuan kan kua jian, jian kua qi dong shou jiao tian. Dongshou shu zhao bu shu yan, shou yan shenfa yan dang xian.
Observe the opponents hips and shoulders to see their changes. The shoulders and hips move simultaneously with the movement of the limbs. Use the touching [crossing] of the hands to feel their intentions not their eyes. Hand, eye, body movement the eyes move first.
Yan sui xin bianhuan sui yan, xu shi jin tui yan xian guan.
The eyes follow the heart, the changes follow the eyes. To know whether to advance or retreat first observe with the eyes.[/QUOTE]
thanks for the info, very interesting, where did you get this?
To be honest with you I don’t even recall (I’ve had it for some time). However, my Si-Fu Mr. Richard Wu verified the information as being essentially correct when I showed it to him (he suspected that it came from one of Cao Zhongsheng’s students).