I was a bit harsh but I mostly stand by what I said. Would be interested to get Vyvial’s input on this one, as he usually makes sense.
Shooter looks tired. On both of the shoots he goes straight down. He gets his lead leg in nice and deep and doesn’t step in/round with the rear leg.
There are many different ways of shooting, I know, but the rear leg should be driving through the sprawler’s centre of balance. In all the variants of sprawling I’ve been shown the shoot goes down, horizontal, up: this seems to be down, then down again.
In both of these cases, he goes straight down on one knee, effectively ending the forward motion and the shoot. In the first shoot this is maybe understandable because the other guy sprawls. The sprawl doesn’t look that effective to me, but of course if it’s working the shooter should be dropping somehow… but the second shoot the sprawler has a guillotine half on so why the shooter drops immediately to his knee I don’t know (if he’s really really unflexible maybe that would explain it but in fact it looks to me like he starts dropping before the sprawler grabs his head).
Posture: again shooter’s head is down all the time. This maybe explains why he then goes down so easily.
The sprawl looks shallow and it looks like he’s dropping his hips through empty air rather than using them to stick his torso to the shooter and drive his bodyweight down effectively through the shooter’s upper body).
The shooter had the chance to change to double leg a couple of times. Also when he was half stopped, he seemed to half push it and half give up.
I’ve no idea why anyone would choose to do an armbar loosely across the chest like that. Maybe that’s my grappling inexperience…? If one of you more educated grapplers could tell me please do… otherwise it’s kind of as useful and realistic as practicing against an attack with soft fruit!
Otherwise:
Of course them training on a hard floor may have a lot to do with what I perceive to be half-heartedness. They look like they’ve trained together before a lot in this manner, so maybe they have got used to stopping when they assume the other one has something because they know they can pull it off. This is fair enough, and a common problem with training with the same people all the time. I appreciate some people shoot with their heads down. To me giving up your head in this way is asking for trouble, but again, I’ve been taught to shoot with my head up and I still make the mistake a lot when I’m tired.
Looking at my first criticism I was a bit harsh, and I do think they’re doing a reasonable job in the shooting bit of getting some realistic grappling training and not straying from their wing chun. I still think the standing locks bit is extremely unrealistic though.
EDIT: just read your post properly Knifefighter, and I still don’t know what your ****ing problem is.
The fact that everyone said they sucked at the takedowns and defense thereof.
They didn’t.
Neither was world class, but they showed what is a very common grappling exchange. The shooter made a few common mistakes that you will often face when going against someone who is an intermediate level grappler. The defender did a good job of cross facing and did not need to do much of a sprawl in this situation… this was a good counter when the shooter makes that common mistake. Often times, it is advisable not to sprawl deeply in this situation in order to finish the attacker with arm entanglements or to take the back.
What sucked were their submission attempts.
What sucked even worse was the dumb-a$$ striking attempts after the counters.
What everyone is failing to see is that both fighters are out of shape. They are gasping for air as they are moving in slow motion. First of all since when did win chun practitioners grapple. It takes good cardio to win a fight not weed.
What’s with the faraway look while defending If you’re going to post up demo clips, at least make them look like you have some intent. hardly good martial awareness.
Yea that’s what I’m talking about, at least wear some uniforms or some athletic wear or something ****e it’s like they should of started a thread on ebaum’s world or something and some guys are actualy analizing this garbage. Please!:mad:
How long were they training before this vid clip? And do you know are smoking weed or are you just being pointlessly libelous?
Yep, that’s right. Cos we all know that what you’re wearing makes a difference to your fighting skills :rolleyes: If they were wearing heels and tight skirts I could understand you’d have a problem but please!
Knifefighter: I thought the shoot had a lot of flaws. Therefore in my initial summary I said it sucked. You thought it had a lot of flaws but it wasn’t bad. Fair enough. I take your point about the defence.
Taff: cheers, very funny! I knew Sparrow loved wing chun but I didn’t know he had his own site!
I have actually met the person in the video when I lived in Austin, he wasn’t bad.
What I don’t like is that people focus on the tool or technique-how to stop a shoot, a striker, etc. It’s one thing to stand there and go “ok, now u grapple me…” but in reality there are a huge range of options. Few mma folks will attack without at least a feint jab or other strike. Just the fact that an aggressor could be within a few feet and have so many options (strikes, kicks, takedowns,etc) causes issues.
Of course all the other things in an attack could make a difference-surprise, state of mind, fear etc.
My experience is the same… I rarely see shots from the outside (as opposed to shots from a clinch) taken by themselves (i.e. not part of a combination), -except as a counterattack.
I guess this reminded me of the other thing that I did not like about wt when I did it…namely, standing there waiting for the other yahoo to do something. I guess I have moved on from wc/wt but I spent so much time in it I sometimes still get the urge to chain punch, lol.
If you’re going to post up demo clips, at least make them look like you have some intent. hardly good martial awareness.
