okay, thanks. 
another chicken and egg kind of question:
the form known as ‘southern mantis’: when did it emerge? was it before or after the development of a style of mantis in the north?
I’ll take a shot at this,…
I’m guessing you mean style?? I am not familiar with a form know as “southern mantis”. If you are talking about a form, I have never heard of it. If you are talking about the style, northern & southern are not even remotely in the same ball-park.
Southern mantis has different power generation methods more akin to wing chun.
As to witch of these came first, I cannot say with any accuracy as for my research, I cannot truely tell when Northern Mantis actually was created.
Reputedly, Nan Tanglang was created around four hundred years ago. It is completely unrelated to Northern Mantis.
It seems to me that the southern mantis may share ways to develop energy as well as the way they apply thier techniques as the fukien white crane, white eyebrow and southern dragon style.
I am not saying it is the same, but it does share kind of a “Hakka” flavor.
Mr. 108,
Set me straight on this one.
It is definitely a member of the Hakka family.
Should have posted this before, but the site www.tonglong.co.uk has some really good information on southern mantis, including the history of Chow Gar.
EDIT: Also, for those who really like to read, here is a link to an excellent Southern Mantis history article written by Fernando Blanco, who runs mantiscave. Enjoy. 
Lu Bu
Thaks for that great info!
I think the southern mantis represents the movements of the actual insect than the northern mantis. I am not saying that is better or worse.
The okinawans also trace their lineage back to the southern “Hakka” family.
After training in the okinawan arts then in the southern Hakka based systems (just a little) I can see the connection.
Southern Mantis (Cho Gar / Chu Gar / Chow Gar) are indeed all from the Hakka families of southern arts in general. There is absolutely no similarity between northern and southern! Just about everything outside of Nian (sticking) is different. I am not sure what they call it in Chow Gar, but they do focus a lot on stickng types of energy.
And it is also true they are very similar in power generation (not looks mind you) with Bak Mei, Wing CHun, and White Crane. The Mantis guys do a lot of (TOTALLY THEIR TERMINOLOGY) swallowing and spitting energy too. The swallowing is an absorption of your opponents incoming attack / energy. Spitting is where you absorb your opponents energy and redirect it back at them.
As for one looking more like an insect than another…okay, whatever. I do not try to emulate the insect, rather I try to become his fighting instinct and demeanor. I am too **** big to be an insect.
Cheers
Jake
Like I said I dont like mantis because it is supposed to be based off of an insect. I like it because it is effective, could be toad style for all I care
I mention the outer appearance only because it seems that the southern seems to have gone through many less changes than the northern since their development. That is if either really were developed by watching an insect.
Is the southern mantis history and fighting theories easier to trace than the northern?
I am still not sold on the wang lang story. I am sure it had something to do with the insect somewhere along the line. I am just not sure it was good ole wang lang.
If it has gone so far off of the original, maybe it is time to change the name to something other than northern praying mantis kung fu.
Maybe “Northern Chinese Kung Fu Eclectic Style”
Perhaps the reason why southern mantis appears to have undergone less changes throughout its evolution is because it, like other Hakka styles, was closed to outsiders, even until recent times..southern styles like White Crane and Pak Mei have taken longer than styles such as Shaolin, Wing Chun, and Northern Mantis to be taught openly (even among different Chinese ethnicities). Hakkas are known to be very clannish as a result of their nomadic history and so it is likely that (even today) there is some reluctance to teach these styles openly unless you are of Hakka ancestry.
Good point. 
Glad someone is paying attention ****it!! If I am not mistaken you can give us more insight into this yes?
Jake
I can give insight as far as Hakka history/culture goes as it relates to my family ancestry and to my studies in college… as to how it relates to Hakka styles of martial arts - there is SO MUCH I have yet to learn and unfortunately I’m nowhere near to becoming a knowledgeable resource on this topic of interest. 