[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267934]Some may feel that WC is a quick fast easy to learn system. If you do your research you will see that after 1850 the body of the art was stripped out so that it only focused on the application of the art. This was to get short term fighters out there. This has some how become our standard.[/QUOTE]
For shame!! 
Let’s re-add all the superstitious bullsh!t so students focus on something other than application and it takes years to become any sort of useful fighter, if ever!
[QUOTE=LFJ;1267939]For shame!!
Let’s re-add all the superstitious bullsh!t so students focus on something other than application and it takes years to become any sort of useful fighter, if ever![/QUOTE]
Anyone can have their opinion based on their experience . You can have yours.
For me, the following is a waste of time and developing bad habit . I rather go learn western boxing where all effort and training is applicable in fighting .
Originally Posted by LFJ
The training stance and shapes aren’t used in fighting application. That would be a terrible misinterpretation.
.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267934] the body of the art was stripped out so that it only focused on the application of the art. [/QUOTE]
Hmmmm…and here I thought the ‘body’ of the art WAS & IS focused towards application. I thought this was always the focus.
[QUOTE=HybridWarrior;1267941]Hmmmm…and here I thought the ‘body’ of the art WAS & IS focused towards application. I thought this was always the focus.[/QUOTE]
Body or the art and application of the art are two wings of the bird.
One rely on the others
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267940]For me, the following is a waste of time and developing bad habit . I rather go learn western boxing where all effort and training is applicable in fighting .
Originally Posted by LFJ
The training stance and shapes aren’t used in fighting application. That would be a terrible misinterpretation.
.[/QUOTE]
That’s because you have no idea how the system works. Embarrassing after decades of “research”.
Again,
I am not trying to sell you anything or join my club or convert you.
I just share
This data point of 1848 red boat Wck exist and verified. It is a cultural heritage of Wck .
That’s all.
The rest is your freedom to take it or leave it or ignore it…etc. Up to you.
[QUOTE=LFJ;1267944]That’s because you have no idea how the system works. Embarrassing after decades of “research”.[/QUOTE]
Could you please share what is THE IDEA of –
The training stance and shapes aren’t used in fighting application. — As you have present?
For me, I rather go study western boxing or kyokushin instead of training stance or shapes aren’t use in fighting application. Because i have limited time and energy.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267945]
This data point of 1848 red boat Wck exist and verified. It is a cultural heritage of Wck .
.[/QUOTE]
Does not exist anywhere beyond your mind and it is not verified , I showed that clearly , and whole story does not have anything with cultural heritage of anything
[QUOTE=zuti car;1267947]Does not exist anywhere beyond your mind and it is not verified , I showed that clearly , and whole story does not have anything with cultural heritage of anything[/QUOTE]
The following is post in this forum by a wcners I have not meet but testing the Emei 12 zhuang Technology I have shared.
Just to pass a general note on the standing practice (as you have shown me Hendrik) and how it has impacted my wing chun; mainly fluidity and an ability to really ground myself. People I have chi saued with have particularly noted the change in my grounding to the extent that I got a phone call from one of them that weighs 96kg, asking me why he couldn’t move me when I weighed just 64 KG (at the time) when we rolled quite vigorously.
[QUOTE=Minghequan;1267911]Its all making sense now, its all coming together … Hendrik’s incessant posting, then the Sergio vids, KPM’s defence of an illogical Hendrik and now Robert Chu and Jim jumping on a bandwagon … yeah they are going to make an announcement fairly soon I’m betting![/QUOTE]
You will be a top grandmaster of Fortune Telling of our Era. Please consider to switch your job
Two sides to the same coin…
It always seems like there is a big ‘for and against’ anything new (or old!) that comes along in the Wing Chun mainstream, but I have found all the banter quite boring at times!! From ALL parties too!!!
Why can’t people simply congratulate someone on their article, event and findings as I am sure Jim has only shared this stuff as he is enthusiastic as ever to connect the dots that make sense to him. And this is what we all should be looking at doing isn’t it?? Making sense of what we have rather than relying on what everyone else says?!
I have a lot of time for people who really put in the hard work and effort to uncover connections to our past Wing Chun influences, but I too am a sceptic because I have seen it all before, story after story, claim after claim. And where are all these people now?? What are they doing for Wing Chun now???
So do your own research, ask your Sifu the right questions (if you still have one!) and follow your hearts. What feels right for some will not be the same for everyone else, as I for one do not need any Emei/Crane Arts to make my Forms come alive, but I respect and understand maybe some of the reasons that others feel differently.
Then again, I wave Flags and train for a performance objective, so I am deluded according to some!
[QUOTE=theo;1267912]GM Fu here is referring to the similarities between the 1848 version of SLT, and not the general SNT that is more common today.
Things have changed since then obviously as evolution occurred. What this proves is that at the time of 1848 Red Boats, the practice of SLT was done with the Emei technology
My reading of this is:
“the 1848 version of SLT”
Actually to me it’s the THE that kind of overreaches there.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267949]The following is post in this forum by a wcners I have not meet but testing the Emei 12 zhuang Technology I have shared.
Just to pass a general note on the standing practice (as you have shown me Hendrik) and how it has impacted my wing chun; mainly fluidity and an ability to really ground myself. People I have chi saued with have particularly noted the change in my grounding to the extent that I got a phone call from one of them that weighs 96kg, asking me why he couldn’t move me when I weighed just 64 KG (at the time) when we rolled quite vigorously.[/QUOTE]
Same thing you can achieve with tai chi , ba gua, hsing i , feeding crane …ect. That emei stuff is just borrowed material from real internal kung fu styles , older ones . There isn’t any emei technology , actually , there is today , but there wasn’t any in 19th Century
[QUOTE=zuti car;1267959]Same thing you can achieve with tai chi , ba gua, hsing i , feeding crane …ect. That emei stuff is just borrowed material from real internal kung fu styles , older ones . There isn’t any emei technology , actually , there is today , but there wasn’t any in 19th Century[/QUOTE]
Sorry,
The gate keeper of Emei 12 zhuang , verify and signed his name.
[QUOTE=Wayfaring;1267958]“the 1848 version of SLT”
Actually to me it’s the THE that kind of overreaches there.[/QUOTE]
You certainly are free to have you view.
1848 version SLT ---- is back up by traceable multiple sources.
from:
Yik kam’s existing,
Ancient Chinese martial art DNA,
Chinese opera signature ,
Anti Qing signature ,
CLF signature …etc
of that era.
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267963]Sorry,
The gate keeper of Emei 12 zhuang , verify and signed his name.[/QUOTE]
Sorry , not even one single evidence
i think on one hand, you’ve got the people making up theories and speculating while on the other, there are actual documents and multiple sources including the Emei lineage holder himself confirming the connection.
The 1848 writing of SLT kuit has been verified by the Emei GM to have Emei, almost word for word in several of the kuits. He sees Emei signatures in that version of the SLT as well.
Are people saying here that they know what is and isn’t Emei and the Emei lineage holder doesn’t know what he’s talking about? :rolleyes:
[QUOTE=Wayfaring;1267958]“the 1848 version of SLT”
Actually to me it’s the THE that kind of overreaches there.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267964]You certainly are free to have you view.
1848 version SLT ---- is back up by traceable multiple sources.
from:
Yik kam’s existing,
Ancient Chinese martial art DNA,
Chinese opera signature ,
Anti Qing signature ,
CLF signature …etc
of that era.[/QUOTE]
My view is that your family’s YKS lineage and facts or evidence regarding it cannot be extended to represent ALL of the WCK present in that time period. But I have no issues with you tracing the history of your own family WCK back through your ancestry.
[QUOTE=theo;1267912]GM Fu here is referring to the similarities between the 1848 version of SLT, and not the general SNT that is more common today.
Things have changed since then obviously as evolution occurred. What this proves is that at the time of 1848 Red Boats, the practice of SLT was done with the Emei technology
My reading of this is:
[QUOTE=Hendrik;1267934]A,
With Gm Fu find a big part of the 1848 Yik Kam SLT part 1 kuit can be tracked to emei 12 zhuang , and the set indeed has many of the Emei 12 zhuang unique signatures.
We do know now , a big part of this 1848 red boat Wck data point from Yik kam SLT and its Kuit is indeed Emei 12 zhuang based. The gate keeper of Emei 12 zhuang willing to sign his name on it.[/QUOTE]
Ok, so now it’s perfectly clear, and what Wayfaring is saying is correct. What the above says about what might have been ‘proven’ is that sometime in the past Emei and YIK KAM’s personal wing chun may have crossed paths and some stuff may have been mixed/shared one way or the other (or both). Nothing more than that and only to do with Yik Kam’s wing chun.
Just to pass a general note on the standing practice (as you have shown me Hendrik) and how it has impacted my wing chun; mainly fluidity and an ability to really ground myself. People I have chi saued with have particularly noted the change in my grounding to the extent that I got a phone call from one of them that weighs 96kg, asking me why he couldn’t move me when I weighed just 64 KG (at the time) when we rolled quite vigorously.
[/QUOTE]
PLENTY of WC people can do that, your old favourite TST is brilliant at it it yet you say he “is doing it wrong”
Please explain numbnuts?