Seriously.
The numbness and pain Xue (cavity) are widely used and coupled with Qin Na.
The fatal/death Xue needs to be undone by certain manuver or anti/solution Xues. Other wise, death is immiment.
The practictioner has to study human anatomy, physiology, and TCM and herbs. That would take several years. The practice hm several years more.
It is in the realm of both CMA and TCM.
CSN:
I certainly believe in selective targeting … I love to strike the inside bicep and even use the phoenix to the upper lip and the two points below the nips.
But death strikes … have you done it? At least on a monkey? or pig?
I haven’t snapped anyone’s neck, but know I can get a great head lock on and use leverage to do so. I know a really good shooto to the throat can maybe = lights out, shots to certain places.
But how does one KNOW that striking here and there – to not visibly fatal areas-- = death an hour later?
I don’t mean this in a pain-in-the-a$$ way, truly curious.
Back in the day if you got your lif nodes crushed and infected you would surely die from it. Things like that were called dim mak which had delayed death effects. Medicine has advanced since then and things like that don’t really happen, we have anti-biodics.
However, there are other forms of dim mak which I know of, but by no means am proficient in. Things like: sealing the breath, breaking the bone, dislocating the bone, striking the heart, and sealing the blood. Obviously, if you crush someone’s throat or snape their neck they will more than likely die. The delayed death, I am a bit skeptic on, but will not deny the fact that it might be real. Just because I have not seen or experienced it, does not mean it doesn’t exist.
Originally posted by SPJ
[B]Seriously.
. . .
It is in the realm of both CMA and TCM.
CSN:
[/B]
AND good old fasioned modern medicine.
My Sifu one told me about a deadly “ice palm” delayed death strike. This guy would smack a guy on the abdomen with this special palm strike and if you wern’t taken to a doctor in time you would start to get chills and cold sweats cold sweats in 2 or 3 days and would die within a week.
At the time I was working part time with this chiropractor buddy of mine who was also into MA. So I showed him the approximate location of the strike and described the symtoms. He consulted his various medical books and found a diagnosis with more syllables than a Russian name but in a nutshell it was some sort of weird inflamation that was pretty rare but could be triigered by a mild physical trauma to the panceas I think. So you smack a guy in the gut hard enough and with the right type of strike that a shock goes into him and injures his pancreas. Not ruptures or anything it just needs to cause “minor trauma”. IF untreated, there can be some limited internal bleeding and a number of other things that cause fever, cold sweats and according to the medical text in his office, if untreated, death within 5-7 days.
That was just one example. I’m sure there’s plenty more if you knew the death strike and had an MD available to help you research.
Omar,
Even if that is true, which I am not debating its not. It will not be a constant. Every human body is different. Delayed death strikes are kind of a waste of training IMHO. If you need to use a death strike type move, I think one thats instant would be better.
I wasn’t trying to advocate dimmak training. I was pointing out that there is no need to get all TCM and superstitious about it. You don’t need to see a special Chinese gong fu doctor for treatment. People have died several days later from old fasioned boxing or kickboxing realted causes. I used to have a book on MA related injuries and there were a few in there too. I remember one relating to a ruptured spleen. A good side kick in the right spot has the potential. A tough figher will sometimes even be able to continure and maybe even win his match. But then he gets home and he’s ****ing blood. GET TO A DOCTOR.
This example was from some MD Krotty guy who wrote a book and never even mentioned Dim Mak, pressure points or anything else. It just mentioned a few very dangerous injuries you could get that you might shake off or think you just needed a hot bath and a good nights rest to recover from. Even minor internal bleeding can be fatal if not treated. But it could also take several days.
Yes. Every body is a little different. That’s not relevent to the point I was trying to make.
If I WAS to make an argument for studying dim mak it would go something like this:
Dim Mak to me is just a matter of tageting. The chest is a better target than the torso. The left side of the chest is better than “the chest”. The base of the pectoral muscle is better still and a fist with a protruding knuckle to the base of the pectoral muscle is even better. Better than that would be actually aiming for the point about 2/3 of the way out to the side which has some Chinese name I don’t know.
Why is is better?
Aside from the effects of the pressure point strike:
If you miss by a bit, you still hit the chest.
If you miss by a bit more, you still hit the left side of the torso.
Miss by a bit more and at least you still hit the chest.
etc.
Just aim for “the torso” and you will most likely just hit the arms of the person blocking.
A good boxer doesn’t just aim for “the face”. He want’s to hit “the button”, that is to say, the pressure point that will give him an instant KO.
Originally posted by SPJ
[B]The practictioner has to study human anatomy, physiology, and TCM and herbs. That would take several years. The practice hm several years more.
It is in the realm of both CMA and TCM.
[/B]
It only took BL 8 months IIRC to become a dim mak expert.
She learns like the matrix and dances in the sky with the founder of kuk sool won, and does the “modified breast stroke” with gm sin.
You should know this by now.
She belives its okay to hit children in the neck and body after the age of three. With her Jedi Mind Tricks she has put the whole forum in pandamonium. She can break bricks with her iron will. When she coughs an angel gets its wings. When she farts the gods blush. She can say the alphabet backwards while drinking a glass of water. Her qi is so strong that it holds back the apocalyps. Jesus is her brother. She tap dances on water. She can make spider silk out of her saliva.
SHE’S BLOOMING LOTUS! HEAR HER SQUEEL!
Both 7 and Toby did a good research on the topic.
Dim Mak is widely used in almost of all schools of Wushu. It is held in secrecy.
For a beginner, you may use “Tiger claw” to pinch or hit the points.
The tiger claw is the most popular hand form in a lot of Wushu.
Need I say more.
I am already disclosing too much.
So beware of the tiger claw.
Good posts from OF and GF. But hush and hush!
Burden of truth. He who has the knowledge also bears the responsibilty of knowing.
I don’t know. It’s all a little much for me.
Don’t get me wrong, like I said I believe in and use selective trageting. But its the tone of the last post with the hush-hush and great responsibility.
Believe me, I know locations that do great damage, the Big Ocean, ect., but its not that kind of thing. It still all comes down to, can you get to me with authority?
To get as specific as you’re talking, you have to be A LOT better than the other guy. It’s hard enough to land a clean solid hook or cross on a trained fighter.
Maybe you are at that level though. It’s hard to tell over the computer. I’ve met Chinese medicine students who dabble in martial arts who swear up and down they know dim mok because they know the creative and desctructive aspects of the five elements … I can bend them over the table and give them a swift kick in the a$$.
Agreed.
Qin Na and attacking selective point in the body require a lot of “settings”.
All the vital areas will be protected by a good fighter.
We may discuss the numbness/pain points all we want.
The discussion of fatal points will be too much responsibility.
Some common points:
Union Valley (Her Gu) between the thumb and the index finger.
Nei Guan, Wai Guan and Lei Qiue on the medial side of wrists.
Qu Qi (Circular pond) on the outer side of the elbow.
A point behind the distal 25% ear lobe.
Pinch them see what happen to yourself.
I am not saying that I know everything. Far from it, I just study a lot, practice a lot and know a lot.
And of course, there are a lot that I do not know, either.
I have heard of “Ice Palm” (Han Bing Zhang).
If your Qi gong or Nei Li are very very strong, you may produce or direct/focus intensive heat or coldness in your palm or your finger.
This Qi or energy cold or hot inflicts on acupoints or internal organ of the opponent, serious damage or even death may ensue.
That is what I heard.
I am biting my tounge. I have to shut up myself.
You may mobilize your Qi, that is tough enough.
How you may reduce or increase your focal body temperature beats me.
How one may transfer Qi or heat or coldness to other person is beyond me.
One other thing. I know there is a practice to punch or hit or point to damage the internal organ without bruising skin. This is more plausible.
Did witness all of these, nope. I have heard of them.
Just for the fun of it.
The truth is out there. Do not pin me on them.
Thank you for your contributions, SPJ. I respect your knowledge.