Thanks yu shan for the compliment but it’s really not that impressive considering how long I’ve been in Kung Fu. I won’t get into the whole long story on this post but by now I should have been a sifu with my own school. I took a path that made it difficult to recieve instruction on a daily basis and so there have been long gaps in my training when I recieved no instruction at all.
If I’ve done anything that’s impressive, it’s that I’ve maintained the forms that I do have (except the one’s that I mentioned being badly in need of review). I’m the kinda guy who really does love to do the forms and some of them I’ve done a thousand+ times; under the hot sun, on a freezing Winter night, in the rain, on an icey drivway, in the woods, you name it. At times I will practice the forms in a small room around furniture so that it forces me to alter the angles and leangths of the footwork, hopefully without compromising the quality and power of the moves. At full speed it can make for some interesting wipeouts.
Another thing that I like to do is to pick apart the single elaments of the forms and turn them into combat/self defense drills. That’s why I say that even if you have just a few “lower” sets like say 16hands, little open gate, and the exercises you still have a ton of applications that can be applied to a variety of situations if you look at the sets with an open mind.
Eventually, I do want to learn some of the higher sets from the wha lum style and plan on learning about 4 sets per year for the next few years (although some will be from other styles).
I don’t blame the Wah Lum leadership for being tight with their material; It’s part of the reason it’s such a strong and enduring style.
Still remarkable Donkwoon the material you know. It is tuff to train on your own, I have been there. I think we all need to be pushed, whether by a teacher or a kf brother.
Yea, I have done my forms in some pretty crazy places. Most were parking lots, it always seems to spill over to the parking lot. Sometimes in my travels, I`ll mention to whoever is with… this is a good parking lot for training. The most difficult to me… the beach. The deep sand is challenging. But the reward of the sun, salt water and girls make it most delightful. Oh well that was in the ole days.
Donkwoon, I thought we were going to talk about these forms?
<<Also, in the origins of Gung Li Chuen.
Gung Li Chuen is a style, but in the west it is treated as a single form. I am not sure if anyone teaches this style in the west. But that single form has the most similarites to Wah Lum.>
SPJ just posted a clipof some 2 man gung li chuen forms on the main board.
The partenr versions they do don’t like Gung li or Wah Lum as we know it, but when those guys do the solo Gung Li(not shown) it is the gung li chune type of forms we are familiar with. But they do slightly more difficult versions which require some acrobatic skills and high coordination.
Now that you mention it, a question comes to mind that I keep forgeting to ask my sifu. In Little Mantis, after you go into the low 7-star stance and do the upward spear hand poke, the spear hand is brought back to the waist and turned palm up. (this happens right before the double kick) How would you explain this in terms of application?
Donkwoon
The upward spear hand attacks the Hui Yin cavity then retreats to cover the groin. The same move is found in Say Lok after the end of the first run.
I’ve seen others play this move at the waist but I was taught to cover the groin. I’ll try to get a clip up.
That’s interesting, I never thought of that. I would imagine that you would have to use both hands though.
While I’m thinking about it, there is another move that I’ve always wondered about. In both stright form and 2nd form there is that stright arm wind mill move. From long range the obvious interpertation would be an overwhelming clubing action but is there an aceptable close in application such as a throw or defense against a full nelson attempt? Just wondering.
Thanks Hua Lin for the response. I had a feeling that move was used for something like that but I’ve just never seen it in action.
Last year I bought a video; Tai Mantis Kung Fu, Hidden Techniques part 1 by Scott Cohen. It’s mostly pretty basic/itermediate but I did get a few new ideas from it. I take my time and go over each teqnique several times so that I burn them into my reflex memory. Maybe part 2 after the holidays.
Now that you mention it, a question comes to mind that I keep forgeting to ask my sifu. In Little Mantis, after you go into the low 7-star stance and do the upward spear hand poke, the spear hand is brought back to the waist and turned palm up. (this happens right before the double kick) How would you explain this in terms of application?
I’ve seen a different application of the technique as you describe it. The spear hand is done on the inside of your leg, and is intended as a ‘hidden’ technique, i.e. one which achieves its results by ‘surprise’, rather than by overpowering strength. If it is detected by your opponent, his most likely defense will be a ‘golden chicken-style’ leg parry, followed up by a snapping front kick. When the spear hand is brought back to the waist palm up, it would be to trap (i.e. ‘catch’) the kicking foot, a reasonable interpretation since the very next technique is a pair of low kicks aimed at whichever of your opponent’s leg is still on the floor.
I have seen others post with that same application of trapping the kick or blocking it with the palm at the waist.
I do not understand how that would be effective. If someone is throwing a kick full speed at you and you trap it to your mid section you will just be helping them with thier kick. If you bring your hand back to the waist for a block they will still hit your blocking hand full force and the energy will still go into your body. It may have a little of the sting taken out of it. But if that would work it would kill the theory of the hammer and nail. We know that is not the case.
The most likey application would be after the spear hand the person throws a straight thrusting type of kick. Since your right hand is already extended you would do a redirective knife edge block to the leg. Since you start the block away from your body 2 inches of deflection at the point at which the block makes contact with the leg will give you enough deflection at the end of the technique (8 inches?) to clear the body for an effective block.
I would still take the technigue over to my left hip to insure enough deflection.
Here’s a thought you might not have considered. It also illustrates my view on fighting. Mantis is an aggresive style. For instance, a lot of moves against a punch can also be used as a first strike against a hands up position. Why wait for an attack?
Now, I play the Little Mantis sequence same as described by Chop Socki but consider this: After the Golden Chicken leg block the Spear Hand catches the leg (contact and cling) and pulls it in keeping opponent on one leg while attacking the standing leg with a Dung Tui. So there’s no need to wait for a kick. Disrupt his ability re-ground himself and stabilize then attack the weak link.
See, why is everything explained as a response? Sorry, just a pet peeve of mine.
