In Master Chan’s flute and stick book he calls the stick form basic stick. But I remember that we called it RIGHT HAND STICK and that basic stick was another form that came later in the curriculum.
So what is the name of the stick form in the book?
I believe you are correct. Basic stick has leg and stick sweeps in conjunction if I remember correctly. I learned right hand stick, plum flower stick (seminar) and basic stick. In the 1984 student manual it is written as: Stick - Rt. Hand Basic for level 10. In level 9 it then has Basic Stick listed.
Yes, that’s right – Basic Stick is a different form.
The form in the book is Right Hand Stick, but in there it’s called basic stick. Don’t know why. Author’s privilege? Or perhaps just calling it a basic stick form, since it’s the first stick form in the curriculum.
But the form called “Basic Stick” comes later.
Or maybe I just confused everybody. 
Sam
Basic Stick and Right Hand Stick are indeed two different forms. Now before we start picking apart the books and videos I would just like to say that Wah Lum is evolving under the direction of Master Chan. As many of the ex-students know the curriculum has changed over the years. Master Chan is continually refining the material he has gathered from his Wah Lum Sihings and brothers. Wah Lum today is much better defined than it was years ago. Unfortunately for Wah Lum many of LKS students went off on their own after his essentially fragmenting the style. Master Chan has spent his life regrouping this information back into a cohesive style.
Now, if you look back at the books he has published you will see some minor descrepencies from what is taught today. The first handbook put together by Tom Turcotte helped to organize the training by getting it down on paper.
I agree with SaMantis that it is meant to be listed as a basic stick form and not actually named Basic Stick. I’ll have to look at the book again, it’s been a lot of years since I read it.
Maybe it’s called basic stick because right hand stick is a basic stick form?
Right!
No wait, left … no, right …
Wah Lum Stick
Isn’t there also a 16 style stick form? Right hand stick is taught first, so does 16 style come before of after basic stick?
Kempo,
could you be thinking of 16 hands? I’ve never heard of a 16 style stick. Anybody else who’s current in the system?
It’s also called 16 movement stick.I’m not sure if you learned it Wolivery.I know it.It is learned after right hand stick.
16 Style (Movement) Stick is a seminar form that was added to the curriculum a few years back. Well after woliveri’s time. I’m not sure about it’s origin. It has some slick moves in it. I like it. At one time I was turning it into a 2-Man set for shows but I didn’t have a partner.
Hua Lin Laoshi wrote:
I’m not sure about it’s origin.
You mean you think it’s not a true Wah Lum form? Derived from another system?
woliveri
I just mean that it’s not an advanced form and was not in the curriculum until recently. Whenever Master Chan goes to China he spends time with family and kung fu brothers (mostly the same people I think) and gathers more info, forms etc. I’ve heard that some of the older ones still have material they want to show him before they pass on. That could explain how and why we recently aquired the form. As I mentioned in another post I think Master Chan is still solidifying Wah Lum. He also has a lot of written text in the form of poems that require knowledge of the techniques to recreate the forms. He may be pulling new forms from these old texts. I haven’t asked.
i have always felt that the forms, not all, were parts of longer forms. 16 styles stick is aperfect example, i have no way of knowing but it seems like master chan gives different pieces to the puzzle so that students have to share- commit to a brotherhood- in order to eventually get the whole thing. i know for sure that the master stick form that i was learning, was not taught previous- or not to the masses anyway. the fan forms in particular seem to fit together. i thought of this after seeing one of the original chia tour tapes where this kid performed a double broadsword form that went on for about 10 minutes.
Seminars are always part of a form. 16 Style Stick was a seminar so it could be part of a larger form.
Wasn’t there another stick form that was broke up into sections (6 I think)?
Originally posted by Hua Lin Laoshi
Seminars are always part of a form.
This explains a lot to me. The Butterfly seminar last year was the first one I have attended, and I swore up and down to my wife that it was incomplete.
Thanks!
plum flower stick was taught in one session. i think the partial thing is an evolution, either so that slackers can keep up, to lesson video retention, make more money, or all of the above. that is something i disagree with alot- whats the point of a curriculum when you can learn so called advanced material at the same time you learn 8 chain punch? it throws the learning progression out the window. plus, seminar forms are eventually added to the curriculum- imagine if that were the case with college- no one would graduate.
I don’t mean to say that EVERY seminar is incomplete. Just that most of them are. I didn’t learn Plum Flower Stick at a seminar. BTW, are you sure that’s the whole form?
I’m with you about the seminars and adding new material. It’s rare that you find an advanced seminar. That doesn’t bring in as large a crowd. I guess that’s why I learned the rest of a couple seminars at a later date at the school. What I have noticed is that between the rate at which I’m learning and the rate that new material is added and my age I probably won’t learn the whole Wah Lum System in my lifetime. 
I’ve been at it almost 12 years and I’m not even half way!
Hua Lin Laoshi
I probably won’t learn the whole Wah Lum System in my lifetime
Correction, you will never learn the whole system if you grew to be 150 years old.
Seminars
Flem:
I agreee what some of your reasons why some schools/persons offer seminars. I see a seminar’s true purpose is to promote your style to others whom may not, for various reasons, otherwise have an opportunity to learn from that particular style/ school. It provides a good opportunity to pick up and understand principles of that style. Understanding even the most basic principles of numerous styles can further develop you as a fighter.
Seminars should not teach “entire” forms. I do not think anyone’s MA skill will improve with devouring a form in a weekend or week for that matter. You can teach a path of a form, its applications, theories and principles and still run out of time in a three day weekend seminar.
Holding seminars for your own students/school is always a questionable practice. Since you all speak of WL, I see that seminars held by Master Chan gave WL branch schools the opportunity to learn directly from him. It keeps many WL"s motivated. If offered for this purpose, I feel it is a good tool. I know my students become more motivated when given the opportunity to learn directly from my teacher, etc.
If a 8 Chain puncher wants to try, it might be a good eye opener for his MA path ahead?!