[QUOTE=-N-;1178965]Her chi is blocked in her left shoulder, right hip, and right side of neck.
I will help her with stiffness.[/QUOTE]
I have something that will clear her blockage.
[QUOTE=Robinhood;1178968]I have something that will clear her blockage.[/QUOTE]
Why does she have shoes on? Just saying.
[QUOTE=SimonM;1178924]Because Rwilson is actually 12 and his parents keep signing him up with mcdojos to save money. 
[/QUOTE]
I do not reveal the names of my former teachers out of respect. That is the only respect I owe them. One of them makes thousands of dollars teaching seminars. His students are wealthy larpers who have not done real martial arts before. They are deadly legends in their own minds. I left not because of the teacher. I left because he was teaching tcma and “self defense” talking about the supposed old masters’ skills. Meanwhile the class consisted of forms, chi gong, and arm hanging demos. The other reason I left was because his assistant teachers were so arrogant in the way they taught but they were all products of the regular class. Here is an example. The teacher was away one class and this guy had us do a technique. The first part of the technique involved us parrying a slow strike while making sure we were using our structure(I hate that word). He had us do this for a half hour. The next part was to push the guys arm horizontally against him causing him to break his structure. This was another 15-20 minutes.
You guys say that these teachers are in the minority and that I am a troll. But if I revealed his name most of you would know him and probably defend him. You would defed him because he is somewhat famous, his lineage is top notch(some guys do not even have a lineage), he is a nice guy, and because you are all biased. This guy is a great guy to have as a friend. But if I showed you video of his class you would see mostly forms and chi gong with some arm hanging technique drilling. What ****es me off is that he talks about how his tcma class teaches you self defense. Wtf are you smoking? He does not believe in sparring. He does not know how to breakfall or roll but talks about the hidden throws in forms.
The tcma media is biased.
[QUOTE=Robinhood;1178934]To original post…
No teacher can teach bad student.
Student needs to know how to learn, dumb students don’t learn.
Sounds like you need to check the mirror instead of pointing the finger.[/QUOTE]
And this folks is the exact attitude of a bad teacher. Bad teachers do not know what they are doing and give vague answers to keep from being found out. Many good students get ruined by bad teschers
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179187]I do not reveal the names of my former teachers out of respect. That is the only respect I owe them. One of them makes thousands of dollars teaching seminars. His students are wealthy larpers who have not done real martial arts before. They are deadly legends in their own minds. I left not because of the teacher. I left because he was teaching tcma and “self defense” talking about the supposed old masters’ skills. Meanwhile the class consisted of forms, chi gong, and arm hanging demos. The other reason I left was because his assistant teachers were so arrogant in the way they taught but they were all products of the regular class. Here is an example. The teacher was away one class and this guy had us do a technique. The first part of the technique involved us parrying a slow strike while making sure we were using our structure(I hate that word). He had us do this for a half hour. The next part was to push the guys arm horizontally against him causing him to break his structure. This was another 15-20 minutes.
You guys say that these teachers are in the minority and that I am a troll. But if I revealed his name most of you would know him and probably defend him. You would defed him because he is somewhat famous, his lineage is top notch(some guys do not even have a lineage), he is a nice guy, and because you are all biased. This guy is a great guy to have as a friend. But if I showed you video of his class you would see mostly forms and chi gong with some arm hanging technique drilling. What ****es me off is that he talks about how his tcma class teaches you self defense. Wtf are you smoking? He does not believe in sparring. He does not know how to breakfall or roll but talks about the hidden throws in forms.
The tcma media is biased.[/QUOTE]
I’ve had teachers like that, too. I took a demo lesson at a Krav Maga school and never came back for another one. I made a thread about it 6 years ago or whenever it was, too.
First we did punching drills with a partner. I got excited because I thought “awesome, right off the bat we’re doing drills against resisting opponents!”
WRONG.
We had to throw these stupid hooking punches and the other guy was to reach out and block them with this “wax on/wax off” type of hook block.
I wasn’t reaching out enough, so the teacher came over and corrected my form 
Anyone who has ever fought against a resisting opponent knows that reaching out to block punches is a good way to get punched. Most people do it once or twice before they learn.
He also corrected my fighting stance, encouraging me to extend my arms further away from my face. Now I was coming from an MMA school where we did exclusively crazy monkey boxing, so I was used to having my hands right next to, if not on, my forehead. Anything feels “too far” by comparison. But he had me get my lead hand pretty far away. Not being the kind of person to come in and disrespect another style, I obliged (while hoping my muscle memory would forgive me). He wanted my lead hand a good 20-24" away from my face. What is this, Karate Kid?
The next thing we did was punch while the overweight teacher counted reps.
The next thing we did was a knee attack drill into a pad that our partner held. FOR FORTY FIVE MINUTES.
There was no discussion of how to get into that position.
There was no discussion of what to do if the opponent resists.
It was just put your arm around your partner’s neck and knee the pad.
Why does that need to be trained for 45 minutes? Even untrained people can throw a powerful knee strike.
The teacher had a massive “too deadly to train with my students” vibe.
After class, I asked him if they did any grappling in the class. His reply was, and I quote:
“No, we don’t grapple. I prefer to rip a guy’s arm off and beat him with it. Eh-heh-heh-heh.”
He was attempting to control the frame by getting me to laugh and, therefore, agree with his premise rather than continue the conversation which he was uncomfortable having. This is a common technique used by McDojo instructors.
So I just said “oh.”
And then I turned to leave and made this face:
Terrible.
The people in that class had a very strong false sense of confidence. They really thought they were learning skills that would serve them in a fight.
And that is what so many schools are like.
Krav Maga is known for being all tough and “no nonsense” (granted, every art makes this claim).
I’m not saying every KM school sucks, just the one I went to.
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179188]Bad teachers… give vague answers to keep from being found out. [/QUOTE]
Agree 110%!!!
This goes for any scammy person in a “guru” type position, not just martial arts teachers.
But it might be worse in martial arts because so many people want to fall for that crap, like fortune cookie wisdom type stuff. You know, the teacher speaks in riddles and after the student trains really hard, he finally understands it as he attains mastery!
Guess what, real life doesn’t work like that. In real life you need specific, quantifiable answers to things. Not vague baloney that doesn’t answer the question.
It’s like I mentioned in my previous post. Bad teachers will do this kind of thing, and often interject a joke, to try and control the fame/conversation and get the student to go along with him/accept his frame.
I can write more about this if anyone is interested but it’s my bedtime now.
[QUOTE=IronFist;1179194]I’ve had teachers like that, too. I took a demo lesson at a Krav Maga school and never came back for another one. I made a thread about it 6 years ago or whenever it was, too.
First we did punching drills with a partner. I got excited because I thought “awesome, right off the bat we’re doing drills against resisting opponents!”
WRONG.
We had to throw these stupid hooking punches and the other guy was to reach out and block them with this “wax on/wax off” type of hook block.
I wasn’t reaching out enough, so the teacher came over and corrected my form
Anyone who has ever fought against a resisting opponent knows that reaching out to block punches is a good way to get punched. Most people do it once or twice before they learn.
He also corrected my fighting stance, encouraging me to extend my arms further away from my face. Now I was coming from an MMA school where we did exclusively crazy monkey boxing, so I was used to having my hands right next to, if not on, my forehead. Anything feels “too far” by comparison. But he had me get my lead hand pretty far away. Not being the kind of person to come in and disrespect another style, I obliged (while hoping my muscle memory would forgive me). He wanted my lead hand a good 20-24" away from my face. What is this, Karate Kid?
The next thing we did was punch while the overweight teacher counted reps.
The next thing we did was a knee attack drill into a pad that our partner held. FOR FORTY FIVE MINUTES.
There was no discussion of how to get into that position.
There was no discussion of what to do if the opponent resists.
It was just put your arm around your partner’s neck and knee the pad.
Why does that need to be trained for 45 minutes? Even untrained people can throw a powerful knee strike.
The teacher had a massive “too deadly to train with my students” vibe.
After class, I asked him if they did any grappling in the class. His reply was, and I quote:
“No, we don’t grapple. I prefer to rip a guy’s arm off and beat him with it. Eh-heh-heh-heh.”
He was attempting to control the frame by getting me to laugh and, therefore, agree with his premise rather than continue the conversation which he was uncomfortable having. This is a common technique used by McDojo instructors.
So I just said “oh.”
And then I turned to leave and made this face:
Terrible.
The people in that class had a very strong false sense of confidence. They really thought they were learning skills that would serve them in a fight.
And that is what so many schools are like.
Krav Maga is known for being all tough and “no nonsense” (granted, every art makes this claim).
I’m not saying every KM school sucks, just the one I went to.[/QUOTE]
We could both go on and on…and I probably will but what is the point? Poole believe what they want just like in politics and do not listen to the other side. Unfortunately there is this automatic defense of tcma and its teachers based on dogma and the teacher being well known. If I do not reveal names I am a troll. If I do then I am engaging in slander and libel according to the guy who will hopefully keep low after his gracious apology to me. 
The tcma I debate with here defend Kung fu because of their teacher. Is it not interesting that they happened to find the ONE real deal tcma teacher while the rest of us are floundering around? And video of these “amazing” classes would probably show the crap that I just mentioned.
I met a tcmaist recently and asked who his teacher was. He would not give me his name stating that he does not teach publicly and only his group of disciples. I am thinking this guy is a criminal of sorts. Maybe he was involved in the deadly streetfights of back then or learned the secret twisting fist form from Chn Zhen. OR the guy was embarrassed by the crap that he does and intimidated by the class we were all in. Who knows. Another secret teacher that will die with the world not caring.
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179201]I do then I am engaging in slander and libel according to the guy who will hopefully keep low after his gracious apology to me. :)[/quote]
It’s only libel if it’s not true The burden of proof is on the accuser to produce evidence of libel.
And it’s not slander because we’re online and no one is saying anything. We’re just writing stuff.
Is it not interesting that they happened to find the ONE real deal tcma teacher while the rest of us are floundering around?
<snip>
I met a tcmaist recently and asked who his teacher was. He would not give me his name stating that he does not teach publicly and only his group of disciples.
That sounds an awful lot like Ashida Kim’s story.
Or any of the 80’s ninja sensei who were taught by a secret ninja master who didn’t have classes open to the public, and they’re not allowed to reveal their name because it’s a secret.
But they’ll be happy to teach you all their ninja tricks for the low low price of $400/month plus uniform fees, association fees, belt testing fees, and administration fees. Must pay a year at a time, no cancelations/refunds.
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179188]And this folks is the exact attitude of a bad teacher. Bad teachers do not know what they are doing and give vague answers to keep from being found out. Many good students get ruined by bad teschers[/QUOTE]
Lol Ya, your the one , you just don’t know it. Go get 10 years of experence doing what you think is fighting, then you will have a better chance at finding a good instructor.
[QUOTE=Robinhood;1179216]Lol Ya, your the one , you just don’t know it. Go get 10 years of experence doing what you think is fighting, then you will have a better chance at finding a good instructor.[/QUOTE]
It is easier to identify a good school if you’ve been through some McDojos first.
Admittedly, the noob who knows nothing won’t really be able to tell the difference at first. We all thought we were learning useful 10 hit counters to punches at one point until we realized they won’t actually work in a fight (unless you’re fighting a mannequin).
It’s also easy to identify McDojos if you’ve been to a good school.
[QUOTE=IronFist;1179196]It’s like I mentioned in my previous post. Bad teachers will do this kind of thing, and often interject a joke, to try and control the fame/conversation and get the student to go along with him/accept his frame.
I can write more about this if anyone is interested but it’s my bedtime now.[/QUOTE]
I think i will. This is an important topic although some people aren’t ready to understand it yet. This kind of thing took me a while to understand, personally.
Frame control:
Frame is a concept that describes the overall implication of a situation.
Frame control refers to controlling the implications of a situation.
For example, if I am trying to sell you something, if I ask “do you want to buy this?” that sets the frame that you are the one deciding. You can say “yes” or “no.”
Now, if I am trying to sell you something and I ask “so do you want the small package or the deluxe package?” that sets the frame that you are going to be buying something regardless of which one you pick. You can say “the small package” or the “the deluxe package.”
Of course, you can always say “uh… I don’t want either,” but because I have already set the frame that you are going to be buying something, you would feel a lot of uncomfortable social pressure if you said anything other than “the small package” or “the deluxe package.” People don’t like feeling social pressure and most people are not confident enough in themselves to handle much of it.
This is why scammers hate freethinkers, by the way, because free thinkers will look at the facts and call them on their bull**** rather than allowing themselves to be pulled into their frame. If you have ever seen a situation that caused you to think “wow, I can’t believe all those people are falling for that BS,” you’ve just witnessed it. Maybe it was an infomercial, maybe it was people going to a quack “doctor,” maybe you walked by a mall kiosk and saw someone selling a bunch of crap that doesn’t really work to some people who got sucked into his spiel. It’s also very hard to realize when it’s happening to you. Another example is every cult ever.
So let’s go back to the example of the Krav Maga instructor answering my question about grappling:
Me: “Do you guys do any grappling here?”
Instructor: “No, we don’t grapple. I prefer to rip a guy’s arm off and beat him with it. Eh-heh-heh-heh.”
He was attempting to control the frame by quickly answering my question with a “no,” and then immediately going into a reason why they don’t grapple. The reason was obviously hyperbole (you don’t really rip a guy’s arm off) and was designed to get noobs to defer to his authority (he is the instructor, therefore he should know what he’s talking about). The laugh at the end was also key. He was obviously uncomfortable being asked about grappling, so by quickly passing it off as not being important, downplaying and joking about how he’d rather just rip a guy’s arm off, and then laughing at the end, he was trying to get me to submit to his frame and say something like “haha, that’s a good point” or something else like that. If I agree with him, then we are on the same page that grappling isn’t really that important of a skill and, more importantly, it means I think he is an all-knowing bad ass super deadly instructor and am likely to pay for lessons.
But I didn’t agree, nor did I laugh, because his comment was stupid and his class sucked.
In fact, it sealed the deal that I wouldn’t be coming back.
Or in other words, my frame was stronger than his and he wasn’t able to pull me in.
This post just touches the surface of frame control. It’s an important concept to be familiar with because it helps you identify when someone is trying to subtly control you as well as when someone is BS’ing you (often in an attempt to influence you).
Another example is when you ask someone a specific question and get a vague reply, or a vague reply + a joke. And as people in the TMA world, we have all seen this many many many times.
How many of you have had a TMA teacher that you thought was extremely deadly?
Why did you think that? Did you ever actually see him demonstrate a high level of skill against a resisting opponent, or did he just subtly imply it both through his own actions and through the behaviors of the other students in his school?
Did you only see him throw students around the room who weren’t really resisting, and who left their arms extended?
And, how often did you see them throw a punch, leave it extended, the teacher does some 10-hit counter technique, and then everyone laughs subtly reaffirming just how deadly your teacher is?!
That last example is literally 90% of TMA demos and classes I have seen.
Student throws a slow punch, leaves arm extended.
Teacher does a 10-hit counter like 10 times faster than the student threw the punch.
Student laughs as he thinks “wow, how easily I would get destroyed in a real fight, good thing my teacher went easy on me.”
Student adopts the frame that his teacher is super deadly without his teacher ever doing anything.
This is also how all those no-touch nonsense schools work, and also why those techniques don’t work on outsiders.
Gentlemen, this is one of the most important posts you will read on this entire forum, or possibly anywhere, in your lives.
Always keep your BS detectors turned on, especially when dealing with martial arts.
[QUOTE=RWilson;1178824]I have come across two different kinds of teachers.
One teaches how to do skills. He teaches you how to throw and lets you throw him. He teaches you how to hit and then sends you to the bag. When teaching throws he teaches you how to create momentum and shows how momentary body mechanics help. This teacher emphasizes conditioning and makes it part of his class. This is how student learn how to do it on their own. This teacher is good.
Here is the other kind of teacher I have come across. This teacher sucks. He talks about what magic acu points to press on before throwing the guy, he has you strike him slow and then super speed counters, you have to fall for him because he is too old to throw you but still believes he can, he extracts techniques from forms and demos on arm hangers. He talks about static positions when “trapping” in striking and says, “if he moves here I move here. It is so easy”. He does not freestyle with you. This teacher may or may not believe in conditioning but says you should do it on your own but the truth is he stopped years ago. He talks about how this helps a smaller person beat the bigger stronger person.
Have you guys come across these kinds? Which did you prefer?
The biggest reason for the two teachers is that the first teacher still competes. He is with it. The second teacher either never competed/fought or he did so in his youth. He allowed his actual training to stagnate and sat around thinking all day about how to apply instead of actually applying.[/QUOTE]
I should clarify my initial post. The second teacher teaches like he is old. He does not necessarily have to be old but he teaches like he is. He shows the curriculum and expects students to gain skills on their own. For example, we got shown stepping drills that made us walk in a figure 8. We spent the whole class doing this drill. The teacher demoed it and the whole class was like, “Oh! That’s why we’re doing this!”. Initially it was also described as a form of nei gong to open the Ming men point. The demo he showed was, you guessed it, some contrived non-sense that would not have worked against force. I was fooled at the time. Point is thy someone that teaches like an old guy would have us doing the footwork drill and then drill the bs technique. He would then tell us that we have to be able to do spontaneously when the need arises.
Someone who was teaching like a young person would have fast forwarded right to the applying it to force. That way we would actually find out its application instead of just learning its shell.
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179234]I should clarify my initial post. The second teacher teaches like he is old. He does not necessarily have to be old but he teaches like he is. He shows the curriculum and expects students to gain skills on their own. For example, we got shown stepping drills that made us walk in a figure 8. We spent the whole class doing this drill. The teacher demoed it and the whole class was like, “Oh! That’s why we’re doing this!”. Initially it was also described as a form of nei gong to open the Ming men point. The demo he showed was, you guessed it, some contrived non-sense that would not have worked against force. I was fooled at the time. Point is thy someone that teaches like an old guy would have us doing the footwork drill and then drill the bs technique. He would then tell us that we have to be able to do spontaneously when the need arises.
Someone who was teaching like a young person would have fast forwarded right to the applying it to force. That way we would actually find out its application instead of just learning its shell.[/QUOTE]
Also take into consideration that some people want to be taught like that.
They want to be trained like they see in old kung fu movies: the student does some crap like walking in circles, or jumping on plum blossom poles, or using some piece of equipment that has that “mystic kung fu” feeling about it. He never actually trains against a resisting opponent in the movie until one day, after he has mastered the exercises (and often broken the piece of training equipment in the process), he is somehow “ready” and now possesses fighting skills.
A lot of people want to train that way. They want to do exercises that don’t involve being hit yet have that mystic feeling to them, and they actually think they are learning to fight in the process because of 1) a preconception from movies and myths and 2) their teacher is leading them to believe they can fight.
IMO, a respectable teacher will explain the importance of training against a resisting opponent.
I understand not everyone wants to get hit, but he should at least say “look, if you do not train against resisting opponents, it is unlikely you will be able to defend yourself in real life. You don’t have to, but this is what will happen if you don’t.” I’m not saying everyone has to train that way. There might be some older people in the class, people with chronic injuries, or other reasons people have who are just doing it for fitness or whatever.
But at least mention it to the student, and let him make the choice of how he wants to train.
Counting punches all day and 10 hit combos performed on willing partners don’t teach you how to fight. And the false confidence it builds in people who don’t know the difference probably makes them worse off than before they even started training. At least a noob with no training at all knows he doesn’t have any training and will either instinctively run away or instinctively kickbox, letting the adrenaline take control. Joe Blue Belt from McDojo academy on the other hand doesn’t realize that he won’t be able to do his fancy techniques that require fine motor coordination when he is shaking from adrenaline, and he’s also never been hit before and isn’t expecting to be hit because he’s a blue belt and knows 5 different 10 hit counters to punches. But what he doesn’t realize is that his real opponent is probably moving around and probably trying to actually hit him and, just guessing on this last one, probably also retracting his punches after he throws them.
I suggest a program of rigorous exercise. It would help to eventually eliminate your painfully obvious novice mentality and the overabundance of free time you have to express it.
[QUOTE=wenshu;1179243]I suggest a program of rigorous exercise. It would help to eventually eliminate your painfully obvious novice mentality and the overabundance of free time you have to express it.[/QUOTE]
Oh ok. I guess ironfist, ihateashidakim, and I are novices. Bite me
Well, I have been out of the MA world for the last 6 years…
And I’ve been out of the gym for the last 8 months while an injury heals, too.
Novice status achieved :o
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179234]I should clarify my initial post. The second teacher teaches like he is old. He does not necessarily have to be old but he teaches like he is. He shows the curriculum and expects students to gain skills on their own. For example, we got shown stepping drills that made us walk in a figure 8. We spent the whole class doing this drill. The teacher demoed it and the whole class was like, “Oh! That’s why we’re doing this!”. Initially it was also described as a form of nei gong to open the Ming men point. The demo he showed was, you guessed it, some contrived non-sense that would not have worked against force. I was fooled at the time. Point is thy someone that teaches like an old guy would have us doing the footwork drill and then drill the bs technique. He would then tell us that we have to be able to do spontaneously when the need arises.
Someone who was teaching like a young person would have fast forwarded right to the applying it to force. That way we would actually find out its application instead of just learning its shell.[/QUOTE]
I am not sure of the skill level / style / teaching ability of your past teachers etc. However, you are overlooking a traditional teaching method you may not understand. It seems that you are only interested in jumping onto the mat and rolling around to pressure testing everything.
Some of the old school teaching involves drilling certain techniques over and over (figure 8 circle walking / stepping patterns etc etc). My teacher would say do this technique… X…, not only would we do it all day but for months in a row. Then months later after thousands if not millions of times of repetitions, then he would say now muscle memory should be in place and we would dwelve into applying / pressure testing / sparring etc.
Again I don’t know if your teachers were charlatans or not, but old school teaching relies heavily on the fact that you are there for many years working the basics. Solo movements / stepping patterns / fighting drills etc all need solo practice time and then… pressure test.
If you just jump right into ring and start trying to pressure test everything right away, then you might as well just quit MA training. You are just a bar room brawler… you are not learning a style or a skill. Any meathead can grab a guy and twist their arm. It does not take any skill for that. There are many who go for that kinda training nowadays… jump in the ring and kick the heavy bag a few times…roll around on the mat with a partner and say they are training in MA.
ginosifu
So in the end… patience and practice will get you Martial Skill
[QUOTE=ginosifu;1179264]I am not sure of the skill level / style / teaching ability of your past teachers etc. However, you are overlooking a traditional teaching method you may not understand. It seems that you are only interested in jumping onto the mat and rolling around to pressure testing everything.
Some of the old school teaching involves drilling certain techniques over and over (figure 8 circle walking / stepping patterns etc etc). My teacher would say do this technique… X…, not only would we do it all day but for months in a row. Then months later after thousands if not millions of times of repetitions, then he would say now muscle memory should be in place and we would dwelve into applying / pressure testing / sparring etc.
Again I don’t know if your teachers were charlatans or not, but old school teaching relies heavily on the fact that you are there for many years working the basics. Solo movements / stepping patterns / fighting drills etc all need solo practice time and then… pressure test.
If you just jump right into ring and start trying to pressure test everything right away, then you might as well just quit MA training. You are just a bar room brawler… you are not learning a style or a skill. Any meathead can grab a guy and twist their arm. It does not take any skill for that. There are many who go for that kinda training nowadays… jump in the ring and kick the heavy bag a few times…roll around on the mat with a partner and say they are training in MA.
ginosifu
So in the end… patience and practice will get you Martial Skill[/QUOTE]
I do not think they are purposely fooling anyone. They do not know how to teach the fighting skills of the martial arts. They teach the shell(forms) but not the essence. IMO you do not need the shell to find the essence.
[QUOTE=RWilson;1179271]I do not think they are purposely fooling anyone. They do not know how to teach the fighting skills of the martial arts. They teach the shell(forms) but not the essence. IMO you do not need the shell to find the essence.[/QUOTE]
well maybe a little shell. IMO a class should go like this: Warm Ups - new techniques introduced and refined then Cooperative Partner Drills then limited give and take style sparring and then free sparring for the competitive peeps. Shake up the free sparring every now and again with endurance sparring games like king of the hill (man goes out, rolls, fights, or randori with a person for a round - regardless of the winner, the man faces the next opponent - do this until he’s faced everyone in the class - substitute a good 1 round rotation with each person facing everyone if time’s a factor)
[QUOTE=ginosifu;1179264]Some of the old school teaching involves drilling certain techniques over and over (figure 8 circle walking / stepping patterns etc etc). My teacher would say do this technique… X…, not only would we do it all day but for months in a row. Then months later after thousands if not millions of times of repetitions, then he would say now muscle memory should be in place and we would dwelve into applying / pressure testing / sparring etc.
Again I don’t know if your teachers were charlatans or not, but old school teaching relies heavily on the fact that you are there for many years working the basics. Solo movements / stepping patterns / fighting drills etc all need solo practice time and then… pressure test.[/quote]
That’s certainly a good way to drill a technique into muscle memory.
But it begs the question why do you want to drill figure 8 circle walking into muscle memory for fighting?
edit - if your goal is fitness, preservation of the arts, history, culture, etc. then by all means go ahead. But if your goal is fighting, has anyone ever used figure 8 walking in a documented tournament?
If you just jump right into ring and start trying to pressure test everything right away, then you might as well just quit MA training. You are just a bar room brawler… you are not learning a style or a skill. Any meathead can grab a guy and twist their arm. It does not take any skill for that. There are many who go for that kinda training nowadays… jump in the ring and kick the heavy bag a few times…roll around on the mat with a partner and say they are training in MA.
Agreed that the fundamentals of a technique should be learned before trying to use it for realsies.
Some techniques, I believe, are best learned in a realistic environment, however. For example, crazy monkey boxing. You can teach someone the basics quickly, but they need to use it to get it. Beginners learn it quickly with their backs to the wall and someone throwing punches at them; punches that will actually hit them if they don’t block. It helps them overcome the instinct to back away from an advancing attacker, because they can’t; the wall is in the way. Now you don’t go punching a noob hard, but he knows he will get hit if he doesn’t block. We warmed up every class with 10-20 minutes of crazy monkey drills. Against the wall, then your partner against the wall, then with both people moving around and both people attacking, change partners every few minutes.
It’s a warmup. You’re not trying to kill the other guy, but you are both resisting and both trying to hit each other (again, not HARD). Mouth guards in. I got a few bloody noses just from this warmup because I suck :o And before anyone misinterprets what I’m saying, I’m not bragging, and bloody noses aren’t the goal. It just means I didn’t block correctly and I got hit.
15 minutes of this 2 or 3 times a week will make someone an infinitely more competent fighter than 5 years of 10 hit combo McDojo nonsense.