http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0wRqR9J8WA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlInJFHw5mQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ede9OzH1HnA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAiAnMFtCxU
http://www.chinesekungfuacademy.com/
anyone know anything about this 9th degree grandmaster henry sue???
bump…
nobody???
wtf??? was there already a thread on this guy that i missed??? or what???
nobody knows this guy???
apparently they were invited to the shaolin temple in henan prov. and were formally greated by shi de yang…
here’s what happened in their words:
Obviously no one gives a flying ****.
Dude is SPM, and all the good, bad and ugly that goes with it, just like any other “secretive” style.
Two brothers, Malcolm and Henry Sue. Both good students of their SPM master, (Ip shi?) I think one specialises in Tai Gik now…
When Master retires, he chooses neither Malcolm or Henry, but Paul Brennan as his successor. Gives him all the goodies, altar, etc…
I assume for good reason, but that’s their business…
Not all the same kind of people, but all top Martial Artists…one of the Sue brothers is a bit of a loose cannon sometime…the other is just mellow.
Not sure, but I think they are all in Brisbane.
have any of them ever competed in anything???
they all look pretty fast but i dont see the power in the short strikes… i notice when they are doing all that breaking, the strikes are longer than when they do techniques together… lots of slapping, for safety i guess… hard to tell how hard they hit from a video tho… but it looks like what i said previously^^^:D
[QUOTE=Syn7;1035914]have any of them ever competed in anything???
they all look pretty fast but i dont see the power in the short strikes… i notice when they are doing all that breaking, the strikes are longer than when they do techniques together… lots of slapping, for safety i guess… hard to tell how hard they hit from a video tho… but it looks like what i said previously^^^:D[/QUOTE]
If they had competed there would be video of them doing so instead of this slappy hand nonsense.
even the part when they are hitting those bags… the pillars with the horizontal pad in the middle, those hanging pillar pads arent moving very much at all when they hit them… you would think a “master” would have those things flying all over the place, no???
i’d like to see how well they do against some muay thai fighter that can also wrestle… their speed is impressive, their accuracy is impressive… but the power in those strikes seem to be negligent…
im not trying to hate tho… aesthetically its very pleasing… i want to believe its as effective as they claim… but i dunno… time and time again when i want to believe a shorthand style has power, i find out that they dont… my sisu can make a some serious power in his shorthands, he’s like 70 too… he has proven it to me… unfortunately he is in the minority… but then he actually has been in a real fight before(lots) and did alotta bag work and such…
im not so sure about these guys power tho, as pretty as it is to look at…
i was jhoping somebody here would know a bit about these guys and answer some of these doubts for me… in theory, i like the hands… if they really can create devestating power in their shorthanfds, i wanna learn, coz its so pretty:D
[QUOTE=Syn7;1035939]even the part when they are hitting those bags… the pillars with the horizontal pad in the middle, those hanging pillar pads arent moving very much at all when they hit them… you would think a “master” would have those things flying all over the place, no???
i’d like to see how well they do against some muay thai fighter that can also wrestle… their speed is impressive, their accuracy is impressive… but the power in those strikes seem to be negligent…
im not trying to hate tho… aesthetically its very pleasing… i want to believe its as effective as they claim… but i dunno… time and time again when i want to believe a shorthand style has power, i find out that they dont… my sisu can make a some serious power in his shorthands, he’s like 70 too… he has proven it to me… unfortunately he is in the minority… but then he actually has been in a real fight before(lots) and did alotta bag work and such…
im not so sure about these guys power tho, as pretty as it is to look at…
i was jhoping somebody here would know a bit about these guys and answer some of these doubts for me… in theory, i like the hands… if they really can create devestating power in their shorthanfds, i wanna learn, coz its so pretty:D[/QUOTE]
Syn, are you training Pak Mei? Very similar to SPM, cousin styles…
I know you guys don’t acknowledge this, but still, you have to consider that these guys are from a totally different world than yours.
Compete? You must be joking. Even posting videos is frowned upon. You are talking about a clutch of blokes that circled around Ip Shui, competing for the Grandmaster title upon his retirement. Brennan got it, which says something I suppose.
Of course, the Sue side has some funny commercial stuff going, that may be the reason, overstepping their boundaries in the SPM world.
Now, I don’t know these guys from anything more than local gossip and having met some of their students. The Sue brothers are a lot like the Lacy brothers, one is mellow, the other a bit scary. The succession thing, going to a round-eye, was a bit controversial…
In the world of SPM, these guys are top players. If you don’t think a good SPM player can fight, that’s your option. But in what they do, I suppose you could call them world class…
[QUOTE=Syn7;1035939]
i’d like to see how well they do against some muay thai fighter that can also wrestle… their speed is impressive, their accuracy is impressive… but the power in those strikes seem to be negligent…[/QUOTE]
Send a note to the developers at Street Fighter, you might get lucky in the next release…
[QUOTE=Yum Cha;1035947]Syn, are you training Pak Mei? Very similar to SPM, cousin styles…
I know you guys don’t acknowledge this, but still, you have to consider that these guys are from a totally different world than yours.
Compete? You must be joking. Even posting videos is frowned upon. You are talking about a clutch of blokes that circled around Ip Shui, competing for the Grandmaster title upon his retirement. Brennan got it, which says something I suppose.
Of course, the Sue side has some funny commercial stuff going, that may be the reason, overstepping their boundaries in the SPM world.
Now, I don’t know these guys from anything more than local gossip and having met some of their students. The Sue brothers are a lot like the Lacy brothers, one is mellow, the other a bit scary. The succession thing, going to a round-eye, was a bit controversial…
In the world of SPM, these guys are top players. If you don’t think a good SPM player can fight, that’s your option. But in what they do, I suppose you could call them world class…[/QUOTE]
The secret world they are from is their way of ACTUALLY testing techniques against real resisting people who are not spinning their hands around. They would get killed in a competition against someone who studies striking and wrestling. You states that what they do is world class…but they never do this in sparring and against other styles. And for those that say they do spar realistically have no video proof…which kind of makes it non-existent.
[QUOTE=MysteriousPower;1035957]The secret world they are from is their way of ACTUALLY testing techniques against real resisting people who are not spinning their hands around. They would get killed in a competition against someone who studies striking and wrestling. You states that what they do is world class…but they never do this in sparring and against other styles. And for those that say they do spar realistically have no video proof…which kind of makes it non-existent.[/QUOTE]
Yawn…
[QUOTE=MysteriousPower;1035957] And for those that say they do spar realistically have no video proof…which to me, kind of makes it non-existent.[/QUOTE]
there. fixed it for ya.
[QUOTE=Yum Cha;1035947]Syn, are you training Pak Mei? Very similar to SPM, cousin styles…
I know you guys don’t acknowledge this, but still, you have to consider that these guys are from a totally different world than yours.
Compete? You must be joking. Even posting videos is frowned upon. You are talking about a clutch of blokes that circled around Ip Shui, competing for the Grandmaster title upon his retirement. Brennan got it, which says something I suppose.
Of course, the Sue side has some funny commercial stuff going, that may be the reason, overstepping their boundaries in the SPM world.
Now, I don’t know these guys from anything more than local gossip and having met some of their students. The Sue brothers are a lot like the Lacy brothers, one is mellow, the other a bit scary. The succession thing, going to a round-eye, was a bit controversial…
In the world of SPM, these guys are top players. If you don’t think a good SPM player can fight, that’s your option. But in what they do, I suppose you could call them world class…[/QUOTE]
yeah i really dont know anything about these guys, all i say is based on website and video… but thats why i posted this, so i could get edumacated…
yeah we aknowledge the relationship with SPM… im clc bak mei… we are related to all the hakka styles… east river… li gar… they are all cousins and lung ying is like a brother… there are alot of cross style influnces going on there in the clc lines… but any info you have on bak mei, im all about learning bak mei right now so by all means tell me everything… articles, anything… i read alot…
anyways…
i do see some similarities forsure… alot off short fist have similar principles, regardless of application… but i notice some differences, and i dont mean the obvious differences… i mean like how we generate our power, for one…
and we arent really supposed to talk about it either… its like an unwritten code thing… you know what i mean… so far ive been sort of vague about my style, specifically, other than what i said here…
think about this tho, there are like7 masters under the GM… so there must be sattelite schools, no??? they would all have students… and out of all those students you would think atleast one of them would get the urge to put on the gloves… kickboxing, mma, boxing, some mantis style competition… something, anything… no??? cause, i mean, its a really big school… from what i can telll these guys have a huge operation down there… but i dunno… yall tell me, its why i asked… thanx for the words…
Yea, SPM interests me too, specifically as a comparison to see how they achieve the same results as Pak Mei in a given situation.
Their training is different, yet the hand is so similar…there’s something to that…
Your question about the kickboxing/competing… While it is as ancient as any other combat, and Mui Thai and other hard hitting sports, its popular incarnation is rather new, going back to the Bruce Lee era, when the kickers changed from point to full contact, what sometime in the late 60’s? Ramping up a few years, wasn’t until the 70’s early 80’s you’d be banging hard at a common level. 30-40 years…
Its a young man’s game too, 20-35 years old…
A good deal of the old school guys circles never intercepted that circle.
Too busy collecting outstanding debts, providing security for ‘meetings’ and generally controlling turf. Ok, well maybe not all, but you probably understand what I’m getting at.
I think part of this is a generational thing, and part is a cultural thing. I once asked this old Chinese master if he ever had a fight. He smiled, rolled up his arm and showed me where the Japanese shot him…
[QUOTE=Yum Cha;1035992]Yea, SPM interests me too, specifically as a comparison to see how they achieve the same results as Pak Mei in a given situation.
Their training is different, yet the hand is so similar…there’s something to that…
Your question about the kickboxing/competing… While it is as ancient as any other combat, and Mui Thai and other hard hitting sports, its popular incarnation is rather new, going back to the Bruce Lee era, when the kickers changed from point to full contact, what sometime in the late 60’s? Ramping up a few years, wasn’t until the 70’s early 80’s you’d be banging hard at a common level. 30-40 years…
Its a young man’s game too, 20-35 years old…
A good deal of the old school guys circles never intercepted that circle.
Too busy collecting outstanding debts, providing security for ‘meetings’ and generally controlling turf. Ok, well maybe not all, but you probably understand what I’m getting at.
I think part of this is a generational thing, and part is a cultural thing. I once asked this old Chinese master if he ever had a fight. He smiled, rolled up his arm and showed me where the Japanese shot him…[/QUOTE]
well yeah, if its combat tested on the street then that could be even better experience than the ring forsure… aslong as its against quality opponents… not just drunk bar scum and bums, u know what i mean??? like the HK triad tested styles are dope, cause they fought against other styles all the time aswell as yopur standard collection rough up… and then theres all the military influence and policing… bak mei is FRESH… but nowadays they must have alot of fruiit on their GM Sue SPM tree branch and you’d think one would compete… but yeah, im interested in the history forsure…
i also did google searches and whatnot… didnt get much that i didnt get off their site… lots of redundant info and message board bull****… so anyone with any more info, lay it down for me… pretty please… :D:cool:
I’m sure there are SPM trained fighters, Sanjuro comes to mind, but unlike CLF or Pak Hok, when you put gloves on a short power fighter, you might as well cut their hands off.
So, you adjust, accommodate and get on with it. That’s why you’ll have trouble finding a good SPM fighter in the ring that looks anything different…
There are some Pak Mei sparring vids up that make me cringe when I think people out there think that’s what the style looks like…
And when it comes to street work using martial arts, that’s who you fight, bums, thieves, drunks, hotheads… Sure you’ll come up against hard men, I’m sure, but that’s what cohorts, clubs and tasers are for…
Oh, and good luck finding some vids, if you do, send the links on!
When I was SAW SPM, ( outside of Sifu Paul Whitrods Chow gar) it looked juts like that, matter of fact, it could have been those clips, I don’t recall.
I was not impressed.
I had seen it all before, very “american kenpo” like.
The videos that I saw of Sifu Whitrod was NOT like that, you could see the power in his moves, but again, no sparring just “dissecting the corpse” as Bruce Lee used to say.
Then I got first hand exposure to SPM from my Hung Kuen sifu’s brother.
It was fast, that;s for sure, but he never hit more then 3-shot combos, they were full force and full bodied strikes, never seen him “tap” or “slap”, but then again he never demoed SPM, he always did it “right”.
His lineage is from Macao but because of his brothers HK infulence, it has a very different look to it but in all honesty, I have only seen the SPM as we see on youtube and from a few videos that are public and some few that are private.
How well does it work VS MT for example?
Well, to be honest, the biggets problem with SPM is the same with the majority of short hand systems like WC, Bak Mei, Lung Ying and so forth:
Isolated and limited sparring.
Most of these guys never learn how to use their SPM outside of class and tend to develop it in highly specififc ways VS itself, in other words:
SPm guys spend all their time fighting SPM guys and as such are limited in what they have been exposed to.
One of the things my Sifu;s brother loved was how I brought something different to the ball game, he loves testing his students SPM vs my boxing or MT or MMA.
It was a very big eye opening experience for them.
He made quite a few changes accordingly.
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;1036036]When I was SAW SPM, ( outside of Sifu Paul Whitrods Chow gar) it looked juts like that, matter of fact, it could have been those clips, I don’t recall.
I was not impressed.
I had seen it all before, very “american kenpo” like.
The videos that I saw of Sifu Whitrod was NOT like that, you could see the power in his moves, but again, no sparring just “dissecting the corpse” as Bruce Lee used to say.
Then I got first hand exposure to SPM from my Hung Kuen sifu’s brother.
It was fast, that;s for sure, but he never hit more then 3-shot combos, they were full force and full bodied strikes, never seen him “tap” or “slap”, but then again he never demoed SPM, he always did it “right”.
His lineage is from Macao but because of his brothers HK infulence, it has a very different look to it but in all honesty, I have only seen the SPM as we see on youtube and from a few videos that are public and some few that are private.
How well does it work VS MT for example?
Well, to be honest, the biggets problem with SPM is the same with the majority of short hand systems like WC, Bak Mei, Lung Ying and so forth:
Isolated and limited sparring.
Most of these guys never learn how to use their SPM outside of class and tend to develop it in highly specififc ways VS itself, in other words:
SPm guys spend all their time fighting SPM guys and as such are limited in what they have been exposed to.
One of the things my Sifu;s brother loved was how I brought something different to the ball game, he loves testing his students SPM vs my boxing or MT or MMA.
It was a very big eye opening experience for them.
He made quite a few changes accordingly.[/QUOTE]
Thank God there is someone with common sense on this board! I love you, Sanjuro. The great thing about his posts is that he does not spout the same old, “They are too old to compete but were young enough to be ‘enforcers’ at gangster meetings, do not spar with people outside their style because they are too deadly, and keep their fighting techniques a secret.”
I guess it is easy for some of you to make fun of my posts instead of using them as a window into deficient training methods that do not produce well rounded fighters.