This Monday 2 of Shr Zhengzhong’s teachers will come to Tainan city for a MA exhibition.
Li Hongjie is 82 years old. When he was about 70 he let me punch him in the gut full force while he was laughng at my pitiful lack of power. At the time he could jump around like a kid while doing kung fu.
I have heard he will do Yijing Jing.
Two of his famous teachers are Li Kunshan and Wang Songting.
Since little is known about GM Wang I will try to ask him about that old famous PM master.
A teacher of Southern stick. He is one of the few living masters of a testicle kung fu. The ability to withdraw them into the body so they won’t be injured.
My teacher said the Mayor himself will be there to kick this master in the groin.
This kung fu is best passed from father to son when he is a baby. It involves a type of massage.
For teaching adults the teacher only need explain the method. I understand that it can be mastered by an adult in 3 years. I would be interested to know what a doctor would say about this practice.
I have not witnessed it. My two younger kung fu brothers have. One of them is Pong Lai. If he has time maybe he can give a description.
Groin kick. I have heard about this over 15 years ago but never saw it.
By groin kick I assume you mean using the flat upper part of the foot to kick the nads. How effective would this training be against a toe kick to hui yin point with a pointed cowboy boot?
Just off the top of my head, the name Li Kunshan I have heard my father talk about before. I will ask him later. Wong Songting should be the 7* master. His nick name is “tiea ke bei Wong er hu” (the iron arm 2nd tiger). In Shang Dong, he was one of the 4 grand jin-kang, he was the 2nd one. GM Wei talk about him in very high regard, he told my father that in many aspects, Wong has exceed him much.
I have heard that Wong was dead of anger, due to the unfair treatment of the government at that time toward his home(building code).
there is a certain percentage of people who can draw the nads in naturally- i mean to say without training. a real skill would be to make them drop lower, similar to that of a brahma bull where they dangle inches from the ground!:eek:
Looking forward to the trip, Pong Lai has worked hard for us, I do not need my eyes opened, I`m a firm believer of the Arts coming out of Taiwan. See you soon.
Paul Lin,
What you have said about Wang Songting seems to be correct. I’m not 100% sure if it is fact, but I have heard that before.
Li Kunshan should be GM Wei’s PM uncle. Feng Huanyi and GM Li both studied with Jiang Hualong.
Woliveri,
So it appears that you study TCM. Hui Ying is a deadly point. In our acupuncture class we are taught to use a pencil like object stabbed into this point to bring the dead back to life(not speaking from real life experience here).
I would say try CPR first.
About the groin kick, I think you are right. I don’t have experience with this exercise, but it seems that even if you withdraw them into the body a groin kick won’t be fun.
I asked my teacher,“What are the other benefits of this exercise?”
To which he replied,“Lucky!”
So it appears that you study TCM. Hui Ying is a deadly point. In our acupuncture class we are taught to use a pencil like object stabbed into this point to bring the dead back to life(not speaking from real life experience here).
Yes, I study TCM in Relation to Qi Gong. Which brings up an interesting question regarding the ‘completeness’ of training in any one school or being well rounded in the arts. Through viewing past posts I believe you are training in KF, Qi Gong, and TCM. Any Taiji in there? Are you training TCM on your own or part of your KF school?
Personally, I would think in a well rounded school the students would learn:
Their main art (Kung Fu/Taiji, etc)
Principals of TCM (applied both to Martial/Healing)
Qi Gong (Strictly internal training)
Would you say this is what your getting with Shr Zhengzhong?
Originally posted by Tainan Mantis
[B]Paul Lin,
What you have said about Wang Songting seems to be correct. I’m not 100% sure if it is fact, but I have heard that before.
Li Kunshan should be GM Wei’s PM uncle. Feng Huanyi and GM Li both studied with Jiang Hualong.
[/B]
Well, I have heard another way too, that GM Feng has learned mostly form GM Jiang, but they are both under the same sifu. I don’t know how much that is and I will ask my father again on that and see how he remembered GM Wei has told him.
TAINAN MANTIS Said: “For teaching adults the teacher only need explain the method. I understand that it can be mastered by an adult in 3 years. I would be interested to know what a doctor would say about this practice. I have not witnessed it. My two younger kung fu brothers have. One of them is Pong Lai. If he has time maybe he can give a description.”
This kung fu is a type of conditioning. For example, we condition our body which allows us to take a full force hit better than an average non Martial Artist person. The Testicle retracting kung Fu does not mean that any type of punch or kick would not make the person turn blue, rather the practioner would have a certain higher level of pain resistance. I think all the men on this forum can be examples that even if your testis are slightly touched it causes severe pain and more than likely would place any grown man on the grown. I personally have thrown several punches to this person’s testis including a very nice upper punch and after punching followed it with a nasty tiger claw grab. He then performed a southern stick form and we proceeded to eat Chinese desserts.
Remember: Kung Fu can include Chi Kung, but Chi Kung cannot include Kung Fu!!
Even more interesting, Our teachers best friend, whom is also crippled in one leg and both arms, also mastered this testis kung fu. By the way, that brings up another topic. Shr Zheng ZHong has taught several Handicapped students (some very severe) and my school now has one. Challenging to teach, but brings a different spirit into the school. Does anyone else teach or have taught handicapped students?
Woliveri,
What we learn is based on our own needs and desires.
One of my brothers had a condition where the lung disconnects from the rib cage several times a year. He learned some chi gung that I don’t know. He is happy to say it worked.
My interest is just kung fu and that is all I learn.
If someone like you went there with a strong interest in chi gung you might learn it. For TCM that is a different story. In Taiwan only an MD can do acupuncture and herbology(legally).
My TCM was just learning enough to know how much I don’t know and at 1 and a half years of schooling it is likely I didn’t even get to that level.
I do not practice Taiji. By your definition of well rounded I do not qualify. My interest is to focus on a very narrow aspect of kung fu only.
You may be interested in the Cultaral University’s definition of well rounded as they have a MA course that includes everything you mentioned.
I don’t know the official title of the degree, but it is something like a BA in MA.
As far as being well rounded I can only speak from my own experiences. I have found that a basic understanding of Chinese Medicine (Organ systems and their interaction) is invaluable in martial arts development and even life itself and it’s an absolute must in Qi Gong (in my opinion).
I’m not sure what the definition of an MD in Taiwan is (western medicine/Chinese medicine) so I can’t comment on that. I know doctors here in the U.S. spend at least 6 years for their degree and Chinese Medicine Doctors close to the same (as I’ve been told) in China. That’s 12 years for each side minus the overlapping subjects (A&P, etc). Seems like one side or the other would suffer if the total period of study was 6 years, but again, I don’t know.
Yegor,
The standards are not too high for this degree. Although you learn about TCM you are in no way qualified to practice it.
You learn many types of MA, but can not become expert in any.
Woliveri,
For this Taiwan TCM degree you learn what a western doctor learns to some degree, but specialize in one aspect of TCM.
When I interned at a clinic and complained about how difficult it is in Taiwan compared to the states to practice TCM the doctor pulled out one volume<of many, that shows TCM doctors doing misdiagnosis because they are not real doctors.
One specific example I saw was a patient who appeared to have skin growing out of her bone, very unpleasant looking.
The doctor said that the incorrect medicine was applied and caused infection. Instead of treating the infection properly the country bumpkin doctor with no proper training just put on more medicine.
You may be familiar with Zhu Mingching. He writes acupuncture textbooks for scalp acupunture. He has become famous with some high profile cases of curing paralysis.
He goes to medical schools around the world and lectures doctors(not students) on acupuncture. I had a chance to meet him when he was in
Tainan. He was treating a girl with severe physical abnormalities.
OPINION FOLLOWS
He believed that acupuncture is something for an MD to learn. He said if I was really interested in TCM I should go back to the states and enter medical school. This is also the consensus of TCM doctors in Taiwan. The TCM school in Taiwan only accepts overseas students who are already MDs.
I would have to dissagree with the general MD consensus regarding accepting only foreign students who are MDs. Enough western medicine can be taught within the confines of a TCM School to avoid such errors as you mentioned above. The ‘country bumkin’ may have had only minimal education with no western influence. I agree that western medical knowledge is needed to be well prepared and knowledgeable for treating disease but not to the extent of getting a western MD first and then TCM.
Man, I REALLY wish I could have made the Taiwan trip…