Originally posted by anerlich
Well, Ok, but that and 20c will get me a ride on a bus.
Uhm… WOW. It’s like a buck seventy-five here in Arizona.
I envy your inexpensive mass transit.
-Levi
I envy your inexpensive mass transit.
Truthfully, that 20c ride would be very short.
I haven’t ridden a Sydney bus for decades, but my train journey to work and back(about 18 miles each way) costs me $8.80 AUS in peak hour, and $4.60 off-peak.
Our train service is woeful compared to the London Underground and Paris Metro. Then again, our population density would make such services impractical.
Traffic in Sydney is amongst the worst in Australia if you’d prefer buses. And the interchanges between train lines, buses, and ferries are full of unmakeable connections.
Eh, but we all get by.
Anerlich,
I appreciate you humor… but what’s all this saints/giants of the intellect/ illuminated beings crap have to do with anything???
I’m the one who made the personal attacks, and I stand by them all. **** em! I’m not trying to win friends here. Savi’s dead on in his last post.
I could go into more details, but we’re all tired of it by now.
Hopefully this will be the last of this kind of flame war for a long time.
“I’m the one who made the personal attacks, and I stand by them all. **** em!”
Understood. I’d rather people called spades ****ing shovels than rave on ad nauseam about how pure and refined and fair they are, and how eloquent and fair they are, when the reality is obviously that they are no better than anyone else..
“Savi’s dead on in his last post.”
I stand by my critique thereof. Sue me.
No thanks… the only lawyers I like are broke.
The post started off with TYD- veered off to an attack on Hendrik,
then duende first and then Savi focused on me and how supposedly I had sent students to the local HFY place in this large metro about 20 minutes away- driving within the speed limit.
This is not the first time that this false story has emerged from some HFY folks. I called this a lie. One of the meanings of a lie is
“an inaccurate and false statement”. The claim of my sending students is the falsehood I refer to-no matter how often it is repeated.
Rather than letting things be- comes now Savi again with a long
post directed at me- you can read it for yourself. Rather than a long rebuttal- I will cut to the quick.
-
I did not send any student of mine to Lowenhagen’s place
any time. Not my style. Further, I have zero interest in HFY.
Once before Lowenhagen “challenged” me “your place or mine”(approx)when supposedly I had disturbed the harmony of the universe. I laughed and declined. -
What students do outside of class on their own is their business. I dont babysit them and I give no one carte blanche authority to represent me. And I remind people that no one represents me outside of learning kung fu from me.
-
When several months ago the HFY version of the visit emerged-
I asked students about it. The hearsay that emerged is as follows-
remember I was not there and didnt send anyone and no one represented me.
Three people (adults) responding to a handout they had seen and the
prominent signboard apparently had gone on their own to see what HFY was about and went to the school and stood at the entrance of the school.
The chief instructor or owner of the school- a man identified as having big ears possibly Lowenhagen(?)- began to speak about HFY to the three visitors
one of whom asked some questions about HFY training methods..
The instructor said that HFY is a great system and it hasa powerful stance which can resist xooo pounds of pressure. Then he invited one of the students to test his (the instructor’s) stance to see if he can be pushed over. The student when asked to do so apparently pushed in the general chest area and the instructor stumbled backwards.
After a while the adults left and didnt go back. One of the HFY members went toa computer to try to identify the students.
There was no chi sau.
That is the hearsay from this end in a nutshell. I was not there and had zilch to do with the “alleged” event. Promise.
- Again, I have zero interest in HFY and have nothing to gain by
sending vsitors to HFY.
Again- can we move on?
Gosh Joy,
You must have just watched the “science” video on the importance of triangles on another thread here on this forum. Everyone’s allowed to their creative license though yours is less original than most.
For your creative outlet, you really should stick to those photos of dramatic grimaces and desparate displays of abject pain that you are so well known for in the WC world.
I mean as far playing the part of the dummy getting hit by a flying elbow…
nobody does it better than you.
Originally posted by YongChun
To me that’s good looking if someone is good using.
Ray,
I share your view. Your tastes have obviously been refined.
It just seems that people want to see flashy/flowery stuff. Jumping, and spinning and whatever, catches people’s attention. Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
The Flipside of the Coin
Vajramusti,
I’ll do my best to get everyone on the same page, or at least offer up the other side of the non-hearsay coin.
Originally posted by Vajramusti
remember I was not there
I WAS there. Although not initially, I showed up for class when the three individuals were speaking with my Sifu on the North training floor, standing near the mounted Wooden Dummy. As I always do when a visitor is at the school and someone is speaking with them, I went over to my Sifu in case he wanted to do any sort of demonstrations (since a demonstration on the visitor can be taken the wrong way if both parties are not on the same page, we usually do illustrative demos on one another first in to keep everything comfortable and non-confrontational for the visitor). I recognized two of the individuals. I am a kung fu geek, so I am well versed in most of the WC websites and clubs around here, just for the sake of seeing what was out there. And as I have said before, I’ve worked out with many (including a student of yours numerous times for a while when I was attending ASU, and we had nothing but positive exchanges, which reflects well upon him and him alone since we all represent ourselves). So I knew that two of them were students of yours and I was there when my Sifu asked if any of them had any prior martial arts experience (Wing Chun or otherwise). One said “no, not really.” One I knew said “No.” The third (that I also knew) didn’t answer. We ask because the vocabulary and level of detail used to explain and answer questions varies according to the level of experience, as I’m sure we all know.
Also, when I came in, Tony (canglong) was already seated at Sifu’s desk. When my Sifu let me know that he didn’t need me for anything, I went over to say hello to Tony. We exchanged pleasantries and he said they had come in a few minutes ago. I mentioned that they said they had no experience, but I was SURE they were students of yours. He was surprised, so I (that’s me… TALTOS… LEVI… the author of this post), loaded up your website and went to the group Chum Kiuh and Biu Ji photos. I pointed out the two I knew, but never spotted the one I didn’t.
When they left, I spoke with my Sifu. When he discovered that they in fact DID have martial experience, he asked me to go ask them if they wanted to stay and watch our class (which would have been Yip Man class that night, so they could have seen the variances in the Yip Man system that we have and they have by comparison, and any HFY questions they may have had could have been addressed from a common martial ground, i.e. te Yip Man system). But, alas, it was not to be. That’s a story for another day.
If we wanted to get into a semantic argument, I suppose only one of them actually outright lied. The silent one certainly didn’t lie, although it could be argued that he DID allow a false assumption to be made. The “no, not really” answer COULD be argued as just humility, but that’s shaky at best. But for the sake of a peaceful exchange, I’ll accept it.
Originally posted by Vajramusti
didnt send anyone and no one represented me.
OK. I can accept that. As to why one of the people that day outright lied to my Sifu’s face, I don’t know. I personally feel that such an act speaks volumes about his particular character, but I’ll follow your lead and accept that they represented no one but themselves. Not you, not your lineage, not your art. No worries. It would be AWESOME if when anyone else speaks here, they only represented themselves, and no Sifu, lineage, or art.
I again return to my previous post about stereotyping (which you correctly observed gets us nowhere) and ask again if perhaps the blanket “HFY clan”-esqe statements could in fact be stereotyping themselves. And if perhaps posting as if a student of HFY somehow speakes for the lineage requires the same response as you shared, i.e. “no one represented me.”
Just think, if we only responded to the individuals (on BOTH sides of this fray), we wouldn’t need clarifying and defensive posts because it would actually be understood and implemented that we are all individuals here. Then we could spend more time on discussion. What a concept.
Anerlich,
Sounds like it’s much the same as in Phoenix. Our city is so spread out that mass transit is expensive, not very convenient, and time consuming (relative to, say, New York), so it’s usually not worth the effort. We don’t have tains yet, but they keep saying we have a high speed train coming (although without the maneuverability of a bus, the destinations are sure to be extremely limited and probably just to a downtown centralized stop). Ahhh well, I’ll stick to my car and morning radio (and the stop-start traffic that helps the clutch absolutely murder my left knee).
-Levi
Much ado about nothing.
I understand Levi’s perception and I believe it to be his honest
relaying of what he saw and it does not have the venom of duende’s and savi’s posts on the subject…which was not started by me..
One thing that is not mentioned in Levi’s post(he may not have seen it)is that the HFY sifu apparently wanted to show how strong a HFY stance was and asked one of the visiting students to test the HFY stance- the visitor did “touch” him and supposedly
the HFY sifu was pushed off from his stance. That is my understanding. No big deal.
It is an insignificant event in the scheme of things.
And the stories vary—Levi’s, Savi’s and duende’s -who apparently wasn’t there- and the student’s.
Kurosawa’s Ras****hon. Badly done in this case.
It would be a cheap and pointless shot for me to “send” anyone
over to a school in whose style(HFY) and operations I have
no interest. There would be no gain of any kind. Again, I had no connection to the event- unless per some esoteric butterfly effect theory.
Why make anything of it- over these months now.
Why not let it be.
Kurosawa has been censored by the forum robot!!
He is smiling somewhere:)
Perhaps my post was somehow misread.
I was sharing my direct experience. Not going off of hearsay (as you have done so repeatedly since you WERE NOT THERE). I only include the information I had available to me THROUGH MY DIRECT EXPERIENCE. If any of the students in question choose to come forward and share their experience, then wonderful. But for you to consistently share information that you DID NOT WITNESS simply defeats the entire purpose of getting to the bottom of things, and makes you look rather silly when you spout out things like “hearsay” and “stereotyping” while in your next breath doing the exact thing you have just condemned. Here’s a thought: lead by example.
Originally posted by Vajramusti
It is an insignificant event in the scheme of things.
And the stories vary—Levi’s, Savi’s and duende’s -who apparently wasn’t there- and the student’s.
Actually it’s not. Duende and Savi were talking about a DIFFERENT event in which my Sidai Savi was present, which is why I have not commented on it - I WASN’T THERE. Somehow these two instances have merged into a single event. THEY WERE NOT.
Originally posted by Vajramusti
Kurosawa’s Ras****hon. Badly done in this case.
No, it seems more like getting some lines of communication crossed.
Originally posted by Vajramusti
Why make anything of it- over these months now.
Why not let it be.
Good point. So… why rehash a “challenge” from OVER A YEAR AGO? What bearing (if any) does it have on ANYTHING having to do with this?
I am forced to repeat myself…
perhaps a good sized dose of your own advice would be in order
So lets see how well the next response “lets it be.”
-Levi
Just a thought…
…what if responses took the form of “taltos” or “Vajramusti” or “anerlich” instead of “the HFY crowd” (even though I also study Yip Man and Chi Sim and somehow NEVER represent them) or “The Fong Sifu or Ho Kam Ming Sifu Crowd” or “the Aussies who loves to watch the fireworks crowd” (and I mean no disreoect by that, because sometimes I do as well)?
WOW. What a forum it would be.
-Levi
Originally posted by taltos
[B]
I am forced to repeat myself…
perhaps a good sized dose of your own advice would be in order
So lets see how well the next response “lets it be.”
-Levi [/B]
Levi,
Good point. I can understand the nature of this situation. we can realize that our life can’t be separated from Reality–from the life of the world as a whole, from the lives of the trolling-JOY. In other words, there’s nothing to get.
Take Care:cool:
what if responses took the form of “taltos” or “Vajramusti” or “anerlich” instead of “the HFY crowd”
I think that was what I was suggesting.
Kurosawa has been censored by the forum robot!!
Perhamps the forum robot is a sop****re, and need to go ****her.
Taltos/Levi-- the last word is all yours.
Cheers.
Yo, Ace!
Originally posted by anerlich
Ummmm … that you take yourself way too seriously and you need to grow a thicker skin?
And you don’t even know who I am, so what the **** is your point? Serious? Man, I just have little tolerance for stubborn old geezers and pee wee hermans who only have BS to say regarding things they have ZERO experience with.
Originally posted by anerlich
Your implication that he orchestrated it doesn’t exactly show a lot of benefit of the doubt either. Perhaps you share the lack of diplomatic talent of which you go on to accuse Joy?
Maybe, maybe not. Again you don’t know me. Joy has provided enough dialogue with me for me to make that judgement. Sometimes the test of a person’s character is when they are being attacked. Agree?
Originally posted by anerlich
I’ll keep my critical facilities in place, thank you.
Wasn’t asking you to discard them. Your welcome.
Originally posted by anerlich
I never said you lied. I’ve got no reason to assume you lied, but none to assume you’re telling the truth either. It sounds to me like an uinconclusive incident that got blown out of all proportion with the help of some rampant paranoia.
I didn’t say you accused me of lying. You stated that Duende and I have some agenda. Like it matters anyway. No big deal.
Originally posted by anerlich
The balance of probabilities and my impression of Joy formed over many years make it difficult for me to believe your accusation without proof. I have “reasonable doubt”, the benefit of which you toot your own horn about giving people like Gangsterfist.
I’m not here to persuade you or anyone of what happened. I don’t give a rat’s @ss what you think. It did happen, regardless if you or Joy believe it. I took care of it and that was that. First hand experience and eyewitnesses are all I have to validate the event. Then again, I’m not here to give you anything. Either get off my back or stick to your own drama.
Originally posted by anerlich
And perhaps not for you either?
When it is warranted, I like to return common courtesies. Got a problem with it?
Originally posted by anerlich
IMO diplomacy is way overrated. This an internet forum, not the UN.
Hmmm, you never gave me that impression. :rolleyes: Not the UN? Geez, didn’t know that’s the only place where diplomacy is appropriate.
Originally posted by anerlich
The regular quoting of lengthy tracts from MKF and posts from HFY108 instead of explanations in your own words don’t exactly strengthen your argument or highlight your claims of ability for individual, critical thinking.
Well, like I said, higher learning ain’t for everyone. Just because you can’t relate to some of the things we say here and on HFY108 doesn’t mean there is no such individuality in existence within the HFY clan. I’m sure everything YOU read from our posts is just mumbo jumbo anyway, and that’s why it all sounds the same to you. Who really cares if you care not?
Originally posted by anerlich
The WC world is doing just fine. Those who have incurable expansionist tendencies, paranoia, or care that they don’t have a high enough profile or aren’t famous or rich enough might feel under threat, but WC’s still one of the highest populated TCMA’s out there.
I agree. Hendrik and Joy need to put up or shut up.
Originally posted by anerlich
Stop being so friggin’ SERIOUS about it all. It ain’t that big a deal. Your attitude almost demands ridicule sometimes.
Maybe YOU are the one taking me WAY to seriously, ace.
Seriously…
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V
You guys are nuts!
:o
Gangsterfist…
classic. simply classic.
It rarely occurs to us that there’s something wrong with the questions Hendrik/ Joy ask about enlightenment.
This moment has been born again …Aryavalokitesvara
Gate Gate Para-gate Para-samgate Bodhi Svaha