Well I finally found a copy of Pavel’s Power to the People, and being the poor martial artist that I am, spent an hour and a half reading the darned thing in the bookstore.
Now perhaps because I was skimming, looking for the meat of the program I might have missed something, but it looked to me like Pavel was suggesting that the trainee only perform two sets of five rep stiff leg deadlifts and two sets of five rep one arm overhead presses per workout.
I like that since I train for intensity rather than volume, but after all the hub-bub I’d seen concerning volume training with PTP on this board I figured there’d be more to it. Did I miss something?
Personally, I don’t think side press is as awesome as everyone says it is.
When I do it, I do Squat, Bench, and Weighted Pullups. That covers every muscle group. Sometimes I switch it up and do DL, bench, and weighted pullups.
I do two sets of 1 sets of 5 (no rest between exercises)
Walking Lunges with weight
Single leg DL with Kettlebell
Bench
Reverse Pull ups using the Stability Ball
Body weight Shoulder Press in Pike position using the Ball
Dragon Flag
After this I usually do my yoga or flexibility training and light cardio using the treadmill, seated bike, or the precore machine if there is a pretty gurl next to it.
Samurai, I used to do bench, squat, deadlift and weighted pullups. As I pushed my limits doing squat and DL in the same cycle became too tiring and I’d struggle with the ends of cycles. Now I do fortnightly cycles with bench, squat and weighted pullups cycles alternating with bench, DL and weighted pullups. Mon to Fri.
I also do supplementary stuff in between for stomach, forearms and general fitness (HIIT sprints and bike riding) as well as MA. The good thing about PTP is it doesn’t hurt afterwards and the fatigue is very low. So I can do e.g. 350lb squat in the morning, ride my bike to uni an hour later and do sprints or MA in the afternoon with little built-up fatigue compared with a hypertrophic workout.
In answer to your question, Pavel advocates the two exercises because he considers those two to cover most of your body. Many people feel differently hence the slight variation in programs. We still stick to 2 sets of 4-6 reps, though. The idea is not to overdo it, though, so I wouldn’t do e.g. 10 exercises in my PTP program each morning. As I said, 4 exercises for me was pushing it and I’ve since reduced it to 3. My 3 cover most of my body. The important thing is to pick compound exercises.
I’ve done squat, weighted pullups, and dips and I’ve done deadlift, bench, and weighted pullups. For the latter I didn’t incorporate pullups until the third or fourth cycle.
My tread is example of PTP concepts. I am able to practice a vital
skill such as single arm push ups/pistols daily and increase in strength without overtraining. Unless my body building friends at the gym, I have broken all their rules while not getting drained, sore, or sick. Sometimes I do get sore, but I back off and go back again. My body building friends couldnt bench fives a week based on their methodology while I can. Other note, it is quite possible to Bench 10 times a week if you have unlimited hours or a power lifting professional using PTP.
IMO, the most important aspect of PTP is the cycling plan. Starting light with 2x5/day and slowly over the course of 2-3 weeks adding weight until you peak at your 5RM. Then dropping down to the starting weight + a little more and starting over again.
But Foo, you’re not doing it right. The whole point is to train the neurological system to adapt to higher weights. To do this, you train the same exercise every day with gradual increases, not alternate two programs in one cycle. While that may work, it’s not PTP.
There is no problem with my program and it works for me. There is no problem with my current cycle. I have just modified it to suit my temperament. I dont train to failure and I lift heavy and I rest a long arse time except the days I do one set. Instead of doing the same thing over and over again, I do the same function movement just in a different way. Besides doing one set is just GTG for me and gives me something to do on my flexibility and cardio days. Think outside the box.
Okay, thanks for the comments. I actually went back to the store and forked out the dough for the book. I’m interested in doing a few orthodox PTP cycles substituting dumbbell military press for one arm overhead presses.
I’d like to experiment with his “commando bear” thing after laying a good foundation with the first routine but he only gives two pages of the book to explaining the system. Basically it looks the same as a regular PTP only you do more sets like between 5 and twenty-five (!) for hypertrophy (yes some of us still wanna get big).
Pavel says you’ve gotta decrease frequency “somewhat” but he dosen’t give any specifics which is too bad since he’s so detail oriented with the rest of the book. Anyone care to point me in a direction?
Foo, you’ve got me all wrong. I’m not criticising your workout, I’m just saying it’s not PTP. I’m sure it works for you, but you’re supposed to train the exact same exercises each day, like I’m sure you know. E.g. I could switch out squat and deadlift every 2nd day, but I don’t think it’d work for me. The exercises are similar, but I doubt I’d get the neurological carryover, which is the point of PTP. Anyway, like I said, not a criticism, just an observation.
The name of the game of PTP is MAX strength. You dont have to train the same exact exercises each day, Toby, on PTP. As long you practice the specific skill “regularly” you are still in realm of GTG and Max Strength. Moreover, “regularly practice” is pretty relative and it should be an open system. If want to follow PTP by the book and not adapt its principle to the larger picture than that is your choice. It is like the BIble, some are so caught up with the law that they forget the people are more important than the law which were made to serve them.
I practice the main specific skills for max strength three times a week; in between I need to also need to practice flexibility and cardio. The exercises I have chosen for those days are still done in Max strength/ PtP model. I do it for its tonic effect on my nervous system. Plus it gives me a sense of well being.
Toby, I am open for any criticism or observation. Thanks for your two cents.
That’s interesting Foo. I was pretty sure it relied upon neurological training through repetition of specific exercises. I didn’t realise you could switch exercises like that within a cycle. Anyway, as long as you’re getting good results.
PTP pretty much relies on neurological adaption through repitition. The step cycle is just to vary intensity so as to not to overtrain yourself. Basically how PTP works is to increase neurological activition through repition which strengthens neurological pathways used for that specific motor task. So you don’t burn out, you alternate heavy weeks and light weeks. Pretty simple.
Once you have that figured out, you can make whatever adjustments suit you.
Yeah, I just thought it was repetition of e.g. a specific exercise at a time. Not that you could change exercises and still benefit from neurological adaption. I though changing exercises would be sufficient to disrupt the normal adaption process. So I thought I couldn’t do 1 day squat, then 1 day DL, then 1 day squat, … for a cycle.
You won’t make gains as quickly in both lifts as if you focussed on just one, but it’s certainly possible. In the old days of the AMEROSS training forum when Pavel was a contibutor there, he’d recommend that quite often.
Sorry to interupt everyone’s debate, but I was hoping someone might be able to answer my earlier question:
For hypertrophy Pavel recommends using a PTP cycle but increasing the number of sets performed from the baseline two sets per workout per exercise, to between ten and twenty-five sets per exercise per workout.
Pavel states that you won’t be able to maintain a five-day-a-week routine doing this though, so you should decrease the frequency.
Question: how can a muscle get weaker as it gets larger?
Have i misunderstood?
As a muscle gets stronger it will get larger and vice versa, will it not?
Case in point: Every year they have a strongest man in the world contest where they drag trucks, carry boulders etc. and the last guy to win it was a polish guy (i forget his name) and this guy was HUGE and RIPPED. Not to mention the size of the other competitors.
I often see people say that hypertrophy and strength are two different things. Maybe thats partially true in terms of 1RM but in general terms I dont think so. Anyone got any sound arguments to the contrary?
